Son’s mother telling him he is ill when he’s not

[Dylan222]

My 12 year old sons mother has told him that he has ADHD and is that he is Autistic, her parents have also told him.

However he does not have ADHD and is not Autistic. It looks to be a type of child abuse called Fabricated Illness by Proxy. I have been working with his GP to get Social Services involved, his mother has been falsely stating to people for the last few years that my son has these conditions, however this week was the first time she has told him.

Any advice please on how I should approach it with my son? I have explained the situation as clearly as I can to him and confirmed that he does not have ADHD or Autism, but I don’t know whether to talk about it with him more or just let him come to me if he is worried about it.

Thank you

[EliflurtleTripanInfinite]

@Dylan222

Thank you for the people that have given me constructive advice and constructive criticism, it has been very useful. I wasn’t aware that I can take my son for a private assessment without consent from the other parent, it isn’t the case with my local assessment centre. And interesting information about the ADOS-2. Thank you

I think it's a grey area, they didn't ask for stbxh consent with any of mine, but we live under one roof. You'd need to say you were separated so they assess any behaviour accurately, at which point they might ask. You could apply for a 'specific issue order' from court to get the assessment done. For mine there was 1-2 hours of time spent with a psychologist and the rest was school teacher questionnaire and parent questionnaire and interview. Someone only seeing the child for a limited time doesn't mean they weren't assessed properly.

The problem here is a lot of what you're relying on doesn't actually mean he's not Autistic. School and SENCO not seeing it, doesn't mean much and it's usually the primary carer who deals with the behaviour the most because they're the person who spends the most time with the child and the person they trust most. Sometimes the other parent doesn't want to see. One of ours is very obviously Autistic and stbxh refused to see it until he was diagnosed and still won't make allowance for it. The vast majority of single parents with SEN children are mums. It's common for Dads to disengage and do very little or actively resist diagnosis. The non molestation order doesn't help, it's again very common for men to say there's no reason for these things. Right now your DS is in the middle of this between 2 parents that can't agree, it's a toxic environment for a child. Would your ex agree to do mediation about this issue?

[Change2banon]

Sorry OP, you’re a knob 🤷‍♀️
You literally just keep repeating the same wrong lying shit over and over 🤷‍♀️
Put your son first, accept his diagnosis, and get on with all your lives.

[Morph22010]

@Teenylittlefella

Sigh.
If the assessor had consulted with the school, the father, the GP or the Early Help worker, they would have been aware of such discrepancies.
justkeepbuilding

I do not know if the mother or the father and other agencies are the ones in the wrong. But where parties disagree, triangulation of the assessment is best practice and maybe would have clarified more robustly the nature of this situation.

thinking back to ds’s assessment on nhs they didn’t speak to his dad at all, I went to the appointments on my own as he couldn’t get the time off work. It wasn’t even mentioned that they needed to

[Teenylittlefella]

You seem very invested in this, building.

The report from school and other agencies should have been sought at an early stage of the process. Such report would presumably have stood in contrast to the parent since the senco in this case has according to OP made very robust statements about her opinion. This would then have triggered the best practice of investigating this discrepancy further, by (usually) additional school observations. Our team actually always do school obs though you are correct to say they aren't "mandatory" in the guidelines. Though of course nothing is "mandatory" are guidelines are not legally binding. Hence why sole practitioners can and do diagnose, when multid teams are recommended.

It's most common to find on close obs that school's confidence is misplaced btw.

[lifeturnsonadime]

@Teenylittlefella

You seem very invested in this, building.

The report from school and other agencies should have been sought at an early stage of the process. Such report would presumably have stood in contrast to the parent since the senco in this case has according to OP made very robust statements about her opinion. This would then have triggered the best practice of investigating this discrepancy further, by (usually) additional school observations. Our team actually always do school obs though you are correct to say they aren't "mandatory" in the guidelines. Though of course nothing is "mandatory" are guidelines are not legally binding. Hence why sole practitioners can and do diagnose, when multid teams are recommended.

It's most common to find on close obs that school's confidence is misplaced btw.

No school report was sought for either of mine.

For ADHD it needs to be seen across settings.

For Autism it doesn't.

Mine were both assessed by CAMHS.

[lifeturnsonadime]

@Teenylittlefella

You seem very invested in this, building.

The report from school and other agencies should have been sought at an early stage of the process. Such report would presumably have stood in contrast to the parent since the senco in this case has according to OP made very robust statements about her opinion. This would then have triggered the best practice of investigating this discrepancy further, by (usually) additional school observations. Our team actually always do school obs though you are correct to say they aren't "mandatory" in the guidelines. Though of course nothing is "mandatory" are guidelines are not legally binding. Hence why sole practitioners can and do diagnose, when multid teams are recommended.

It's most common to find on close obs that school's confidence is misplaced btw.

Have you read all of OPs posts Teeny?

He seems invested in not having his child diagnosed. You must have come across this before in the 20 years you have been in diagnosis.

Surely a parent in denial is not adequate reason to deny a diagnosis?

How is that in the interests of the child?

[JustKeepBuilding]

@Teenylittlefella

You seem very invested in this, building.

The report from school and other agencies should have been sought at an early stage of the process. Such report would presumably have stood in contrast to the parent since the senco in this case has according to OP made very robust statements about her opinion. This would then have triggered the best practice of investigating this discrepancy further, by (usually) additional school observations. Our team actually always do school obs though you are correct to say they aren't "mandatory" in the guidelines. Though of course nothing is "mandatory" are guidelines are not legally binding. Hence why sole practitioners can and do diagnose, when multid teams are recommended.

It's most common to find on close obs that school's confidence is misplaced btw.

Not invested, just correcting incorrect information. Again, reports from school specifically for the ASD assessment isn’t essential in order for the diagnosis to meet the NICE guidelines. Neither is a school observation, even if there are discrepancies. Just because your area does observations doesn’t mean areas that don’t aren’t following the NICE guidelines.

[Teenylittlefella]

Did you also, building, correct all the posters stating that the ADOS is the assessment?

I maintain that reports from settings ARE required.

[JustKeepBuilding]

@Teenylittlefella

Did you also, building, correct all the posters stating that the ADOS is the assessment?

I maintain that reports from settings ARE required.

No-one posted only the ADOS was used to diagnose. The OP’s posts had already acknowledged the mother was spoken to.

That screenshot does not say a report specifically for the purpose of the assessment is required. As I posted, giving the yearly school reports can fulfil that point.

[lifeturnsonadime]

@Teenylittlefella

Did you also, building, correct all the posters stating that the ADOS is the assessment?

I maintain that reports from settings ARE required.

No one said that. The ADOS was part of the whatever the assessment was that was accepted by the NHS as a diagnosis.

When taken in the round the score that child achieved was pretty compelling wasn't it?

There obviously would have been other criteria.

The reason the ADOS became a talking point was in response to the OP saying that the child had not been assessed. An ADOS involves specifically assessing the child.

[lifeturnsonadime]

What I mean was that the OP kept saying that the diagnosis was SOLELY based on what the mother had said.

If the child had an ADOS assessment as a part of the diagnosis that simply couldn't be true.

[Dylan222]

Thank you for your message, I have requested mediation but his mother has declined.

With the assessment, it is not so much that the symptoms or traits he is displaying maybe subtle, not recognised by school, or only apparent in certain environments but that he had very clear behavioural difficulties / symptoms at the point of the assessment, which disappeared after the assessment.

The assessment was based around those behavioural difficulties and there was a clear explanation given for them by my son to his Early Helpworker two weeks prior to the assessment which was not passed onto the doctor by his mother.

My son said he was behaving the way he was because he could not see me. Following 9 months of blocking our contact, 10 days after the assessment his mother drove him round to my house and dropped him at my door, over the next couple of days the symptoms the assessment was based around disappeared.

[ConfusedNT]

@Dylan222

Thank you very much for the in-depth information, it is very helpful.

His mother was present during the ADOS assessment.

I am not sure whether his mum was present in the assessment or not.

His mother was present during the ADOS assessment.

More flipping back and forth on here than on pancake day

[lifeturnsonadime]

@ConfusedNT

I am not sure whether his mum was present in the assessment or not.

His mother was present during the ADOS assessment.

More flipping back and forth on here than on pancake day

I know.

It's astonishing that despite too and fro non molestation orders he's managed to glean that information in such a short space of time.

It's also highly unusual for a parent to be in an ADOS, even if they are it is not the parent who is being assessed.

[Teenylittlefella]

@lifeturnsonadime

No one said that. The ADOS was part of the whatever the assessment was that was accepted by the NHS as a diagnosis.

When taken in the round the score that child achieved was pretty compelling wasn't it?

There obviously would have been other criteria.

The reason the ADOS became a talking point was in response to the OP saying that the child had not been assessed. An ADOS involves specifically assessing the child.

They certainly did say or, at least imply, that the ADOS score was sufficient in itself to be diagnostic.

[Dylan222]

Ive got the record of the assessment out, I hadn’t before. That is the discrepancy. This is from the report:

’The ADOS-2 (module 3) assessment was completed with …. accompanied by his mother’

[lifeturnsonadime]

One of those posts is mine.

The OP had said earlier that the ex wife had filled out forms and had spoken to the assessors. That combined with the ADOS and any other information which the OP may or may not be aware of is enough to diagnose autism.

Surely as an assessor you recognise it would be unusual for a person to score 10 marks above the diagnosis score to not be diagnosed. I know that the ADOS isn't always taken as read but - really?

[JustKeepBuilding]

@Teenylittlefella

They certainly did say or, at least imply, that the ADOS score was sufficient in itself to be diagnostic.

All of which were written in the context of the OP already acknowledging the mother had been spoken to as well as part of the assessment.

[lifeturnsonadime]

@JustKeepBuilding

All of which were written in the context of the OP already acknowledging the mother had been spoken to as well as part of the assessment.

Yes, I mean I know that @Teenylittlefella has suggested you are invested but why are they taking the side of the OP who has been entirely inconsistent.

That seems really invested and not particularly in the child's interests.

[JustKeepBuilding]

“Accompanied by his mother” doesn’t equate to his mother being in the room during the ADOS itself. I accompanied both my DC who have had the ADOS, one I watched from the neighbouring room, the other I sat in the corner of the room for as DC wouldn’t remain in the room without me.

[JustKeepBuilding]

That should say doesn’t necessarily equate.

[lifeturnsonadime]

Tiny doesn't exist anymore as a username.

I was just about to ask in their 20 years experience how many times a child with a score of 17 on an ADOS had NOT gone on to be diagnosed.

But 'poof' they appear to have vanished.

[lifeturnsonadime]

@lifeturnsonadime

Tiny doesn't exist anymore as a username.

I was just about to ask in their 20 years experience how many times a child with a score of 17 on an ADOS had NOT gone on to be diagnosed.

But 'poof' they appear to have vanished.

@Teenylittlefella apologies, I'm dyslexic you do exist. Sorry I'm having a moment.

Please tell me how many times in your 20 years experience has a child with a score of 17 on an ADOS not gone on to be diagnosed?

[lifeturnsonadime]

@Dylan222

Ive got the record of the assessment out, I hadn’t before. That is the discrepancy. This is from the report:

’The ADOS-2 (module 3) assessment was completed with …. accompanied by his mother’

Accompanied doesn't mean mother was in the same room.

She might have been waiting outside.

[Itisbetter]

I was in the room during my son’s assessment.