Anyone else feel that being a dad and sole breadwinner is a lousy deal?

[SpareWheel]

DW and I are SITCOMs (single income, two children, oppressive mortgage). I work crazy hours and race back work half-done to see the kids a little bit before bedtime then try to finish off work and fall into bed. At the risk of sounding like a whinger, I feel like I'm becoming a crap employee, crap husband and a crap father all in one - surely I'm not the only one...

Springadora - I reinvented myself before having my daughter and it is the best career move I have made. I went from management consulting (totally incompatible with a happy family life) to business academia/executive education, which has much more flexibility and doesn't happen during school holidays. The "downside" is that there is no regular paycheck, but since we don't need that to live on in this family, it's actually a bonus to be in a position to only take work when I want it.

By the way Xenia, in response to your point about financial independence should marriage go belly up - you are of course right. But marriage is a risky business. I've quit my work on trust, a leap of faith, a scary leap into the unknown. It's still worth it. Honestly. Every minute with the sproglets makes it worth it. Now I must go and spend time with smallest sproglet as her teddybear has just finished using the potty!

sd, yes but women make those sacrficies. Perhaps it's just that I don't understand that desire to be with the children all the time and in that regard I'm like a lot of men. May be that's all it is. Some of us whatever our sex truly don't want to be with the children all the time. I love chidlren. I have had 5 over 22 years now and I wouldn't rule out another if things were right and it were possible but I always found at all times spending a whole dday even even just 10 hours something I truley do not ever enjoy and then it's not good for teh chidlren either.

The string of surrogates actuallyworks fantasically for many parents and in our case the string was first a daily nanny who stayed 10 years, longer than many men choose to stick around and it's not really surrogate because you don't pack the children of for 5 years and then have them back instead every day one or other parent is interacting with them and at weekends and before you know it they're at school and hardly wanting you anyway.

On financial risk I'm the example of why not to work because because I did and earned a lot my husband got nearly £1m on the divorce and we've all been left much worse off. So being ahousewife to a rich man who is moral enough to pay up on divorce may be a better choice and you don't risk losing the children to the man either.

We could have sold the house and both bought smaller houses, yes even for cash just about and even though he got more than 50% (because he earns less and we had a clean break and no maintenance). I chose to stay here and buy him out so it was choice. I didn't want us to be cramped into a smaller house. But I don't see why if you both work full time and both are higher rate tax payers the one who earns much less gets money from the one who earns more leaving children out of it and if there is no career sacrifice on one side. I think that's really unfair. By all means enjoy a good life at your wife's expense when you're married to her but why should there be an assumption of continuation at that level after?

Xenia - the answer is not to get married...

Dinosaur - yes, I think it is tragic that today it is less risky not to marry.

This is particularly true in France, where the financial disadvantage of marriage to women is quite unbelievable. Not surprisingly, a lot of French women want to divorce.

In England though you'd be in a much stronger position financially married Anna if your partner is better off than you are. You might get 50% of your joint assets on divorce and maintenance for life plus school fees for the chidl and child support. Encourage him to London and then propose.

Bloody Hell!!!! I can't believe this conversation is STILL going!

Xenia - there's not much in it capital-wise, and he earns his living in France so we'd be subject to the French matrimonial tax régime wherever we married...

Xenia - going back to the kids thing - at what stage did yours decide they preferred school to Mum and Dad? For what it's worth, my children would far rather to be at home any day. They are 9, 5 and 3. They tolerate and sometimes enjoy school, but home offers them what they really want - fun and personal attention. I rather dread the idea that they'll prefer somewhere other than home before they are adults or quasi adults even (ie teenagers). And by the way I htink it's very brave of your to fess up to not wanting to spend time with the little treasures all the time. I have to admit that occasionally I hanker after adult conversation (thanks MN), but hey it's al short-lived and I find it rewarding nonetheless.

Difficult to know as the variation amongst the 5 children is huge. My daughters used to spend 10 hour days at their riding stables which is quite a big and nice complex with restaurant, shop, arena, shows and rich and poor people in huge mixture - a kind of separate world almost. They were mad about their pony and also presumably they wanted to get away from their parent who did not get on so may be that was partly because of my relationship with their father too but also the horse obssession. The made us go to church at 8am on Sundays (which teenagers do that!) to they could get to the stables by 9am.

But more generally I think part of becoming a teenager is rejection of parent and being influenced by your friends and peers at school. I am sure that's hugely documented. In fact if they don't go through that process and come out in spots and be repulsive and learn how most to annoy their parents with phrases and statements the normal process of break away and independence isn't happening and they aren't normal children. The nicest easiest stage of children I think is 5 - 11 or 12. They are kind of middle easy golden years.

But even now at university one is here an awful lot and if the others are home in the evening in the holidays it's rare. So just depends on the child.

As when they preferred school to their parents probably never. Even the 22 year old was complaining about law school yesterday. I only enjoyed school when I was in the sixth form. We were constantly trying to persuade my mother to home educate us as she was a teacher.