Ireland is a hard place to live

[Mooshamoo]

Just watching the video of the black child being not given a medal by Irish gymnastics.

I was wondering if there is anyone else on here on craicnet, who is not Irish, living in Ireland. What your experiences are.

I think that Ireland can be a very hard place to live if you are not fully white and fully irish.

I'm half Irish. I was bullied all the way through school for not having an Irish surname. Then when I grew up and lived in the same small town, all of the same girls from my school were living in that town. And as adults they refused to talk to me.

I see the women who are fully Irish, being popular , having great lives.

To be totally acceptable and popular in ireland, you have to have a rich family, brothers/father who play gaa etc.

All the rich girls in my school hung around together. And again as adults all the rich Irish women hung around together in small town Ireland.

If you were foreign, from a single parent family, seen as poor, you were not accepted at all.

And it's who you know

I think this makes Ireland a very difficult place to live

Thanks, he was bang on there. But the collateral damage is not to be underestimated. Google 'generational trauma'. I have a wonderful husband and daughter, but the generational trauma is very much there. And tbh i'm terrified of passing it on.

And i can't 'yoga'. I'm crippled and a cynical beeatch.

Haha I can't really yoga anynore either, I've a bad knee

Yeah d yoga teacher was right. That the peope who hurt us were suffering themselves, and if we keep letting them hurt us, we are just hurting ourselves with our own thoughts.

I know it's easier said than done. I haven't mastered it. It was interesting to hear him though

Gabor Mate is the generational trauma guy i related to. Have a look into him if you get a few free hours. Really interesting, well worth it (although v sad).

I don't yoga since the teacher kicked me out for looking like I'd keel over.
I'm just old and asthmatic so haven't been back as too embarassing 😥

Haha that reminds me of when I was young and I was often doing 5k /10k charity runs.
I remember asling my older colleagues did they do runs, and my colleague saying

"Run? Sure I can barely walk to the car".

Haha.

Now I'm watching my younger cousin climb hills all over Ireland every weekend and he asks me to join, and I say "sure I can barely walk to the car".

The circle of life

I'm someone who came from England when I was a kid and was singled out in school for being different, and I was ostracised for most of primary. There was a bit more Xenophobia when I was in secondary but at that point I had at least a couple of friends. I got jokes about being a tan as an adult as well. I left my cliquey home town when I was 18 and only go back to visit family at home. When I do go back and see someone I used to know, those old shitty feelings do come back again. It's why I live 1.5 hrs away and would happily do a round trip of 3 hours to visit my mother rather than ever move back there.

I live in a small village the next county over, and I do find it welcoming in a way that my home town will never be. While it's predominately white catholics around here, we are getting some people from other places settling here, and had a culture night over the summer which was lovely. I work in the local city though and that's pretty diverse, and at this point I think foreign staff outnumber the Irish in my workplace. Having said that, I did marry into a big GAA family who were well liked and respected so maybe that made it easier for me to become liked and make friends here...? I hope it wasn't that.

It's getting better in some places but has stayed the same or gotten worse in others unfortunately. I think your feelings are compounded by needed to be in proximity to the places where you experienced unhappy moments at the hands of others and obviously the stress of your mother's health is also a heavy burden made worse by being so isolated in a place that only ever brought you unhappiness.

Very interesting discussion. What does GAA stand for please?

Gaelic athletic committee

Gaelic athletic association. It is Irish football and Irish hurling .

It is very, very tied into how good a family's social standing is in small town Ireland. The families that have brothers playing in the GAA are the most popular. As turfwars above said, she married into a GAA family that were well liked and respected.

In the small village that I grew up in. There was the village GAA team. Then there was the county GAA team. Two men from our village were on the country GAA team. Their families were the most respected in the village.

People are obsessed with football in Ireland. It's not to do with football, it is to do with tribalism, social standing, how much you are seen to be 'representing your village". It's very tribal and it also leads to a lot of problems.

County footballers become to be seen like gods and are nearly untouchable. For example the man that is a county footballer from my village is absolutely horrible, and there have been many allegations of sexual assault against him, but he has never been charged because he is so popular and respected in the GAA . His victims think that they can't win against the GAA. You could say that man raped someone and people will say but he is a good man, from a good background , he plays GAA.

I've seen it happen.

Thank you for the explanation. Not just about religion in Ireland then. Or, is it linked to religion in any way?

No. It is not linked to religion in any way.

I think there is truth in what you say @Mooshamoo, but it's not the full picture.
The GAA is huge, and very big in some communities, especially in rural Ireland, but there are lots of families who prefer other sports and they're also well respected. I'm in rural Ireland, my DC play soccer and other sports. They gave up GAA very young and I don't find it to be a problem at all. Personally I couldn't tell you who are the GAA players in our community as I have zero interest in sport, but I do recognise it is huge for many others. It might depend on which part of the country you live in too, and how small the community is.

Some of the other sports are considered more elitist than GAA so there's that aspect also.

I don't know about the rape charges...all I can remember are the rugby player trials a few years back. They did get off but I don't recall much about the case anymore.

Oh yeah I remember those Irish rugby players being charged with rape. The girl was left bleeding , and they sent each other texts saying that "riding her was like being on a carnival at a merry go round" .

They were still found innocent. I remember there being protests about rape in Ireland at the time. I went to one actually.

Yes it is definitely more rural and small town ireland that is obsessed with gaa.

I don't think that there is even a soccer team in my area. I haven't heard about one . All you hear about is GAA. It is literally all you hear about.

This is the social scene in the area:

Next Friday they are having a sponsored walk to raise money for the GAA.

The week after that , they are having a fashion show to raise money for the GAA.

Then before Christmas they are having a lip sync battle to raise money for the GAA.

Then they are having a strictly come dancing thing raise money for the GAA. All they talk about is junior a junior b junior c matches. Intermediate matches etc

I think GAA was seen more as representing the Catholic community traditionally @OLDERME . That has changed, though rugby is probably no1 in the fee paying schools that I have any experience of. (Protestants were typically wealthier than Catholics, in the past at least.)
Members of British security forces were banned from membership of the GAA until 2001.

Rugby is definitely seem as the posh sport in Ireland. There is definitelt a bit of snobbery about it. The only people I know that played rugby, were men who went to private schoola in Ireland.

God sometimes I'm so sick of the class system and sports snobbery in Ireland, - the rugby boys all sticking together. The GAA boys all sticking together.

There's definitely a bit more of a mix in sports playing now, where I am anyway (rural).Thank goodness.

Sometimes I just wish I had an Irish surname. I have a particularly English surname. Not one like baker or Matthews or something, that could be seen as maybe Irish.

I have a very english surname and people comment on it. And I get abuse in workplaces for it. I honestly get really nervous walking into a new workplace in ireland. I wish I just had a nice Irish surname where I fit in and I didn't have to worry.

I have often said to my mother why oh why didn't you change my surname, back to your Irish maiden surname when you moved back to Ireland.

It would have saved me from years of abuse in school and work. She said she didn't think of it.

I would change it myself now as an adult but I would have to get my passport and driver's licence renewed and I just can't do the hassle or afford the cost at the moment.

But the difference in the reactions I get , with the different surnames is staggering.

If I say to people "hi I'm Ann -english surname". I get mutters . People say to me "that is not a Meath name ". (I changed county but that's what they say). They will say "Ive never heard that name before". "That's a weird name". "That name is not from round here". One person even said to me "I'm going to remember you as the girl with the weird surname"

If I introduce myself as "Ann -irish surname (my mother's maiden name), say Murphy for example, I get warm smiles and "oh I know Murphy's from Meath, ah sure I know them well". Ah so you are the Murphy's from dunboyne. Yeah I used to work with your uncle.

They can place me in a tribe and they are 1000/million times more friendly if I use the Irish surname.

I do not know the people you surround yourself with but I have never heard another Irish person comment the way you say people comment.

Are you Irish first of all. You haven't said. If you are Irish they are not going to say it to you. Are they.

if you are Irish or not Irish my second point here stands either way.

Wow I can't quite believe that you said that. It's so dismissive. And rude. You're basically saying "because you have never heard it, that it doesn't happen. ".

What if a Pakistani woman came up to me, and said she has received loads of abusive comments about her surname in England.

And I replied "well I have neve heard English people say that".

Do you not see how dismissive and rude that is.

Also you are less likely to hear abuse about a Pakistani surname , than her - who actually has a Pakistani surname right.

I am Irish but a lot of my friends are different nationalities (eastern european, mauritian, British etc) and I have never heard anyone be dismissive of them from their skintone to name/surnamekids names/nationalities etc. Maybe I just live in a different type of area to where you are and my kids all to to educate together schools so mainly friends not from Ireland but never have I come across it. Sorry you have.

It"s neither dismissive nor rude. Pp is talking about their own experience, not dismissing yours.

But you have seen it happening in Ireland.

You have seen the video of the black girl not been given a medal in Irish gymnastics, right.

So even if you haven't seen it in person, you have seen it on TV. Where people have suffered racism in ireland. So you know that it goes on, right ?