Irish deaths

[Champooforyou]

I'm not Irish by the way, but I was just reading another thread about how Irish people manage death so much better, and I wondered how?

I'm south wales valleys and we're very comfortable with death, if someone is dying everyone knows and you'll go and visit, say your goodbyes. The family keep a vigil so no one dies alone. If you've missed the death you'll go to the Chapel of Rest and say goodbye. Everyone you ever met goes to the funeral, even people who you never met if they have a link, like they work with your daughter in law or suchlike.

After the funeral the family get cakes and pies and babysitting for weeks or months afterwards. On the anniversary everyone goes to the pub.

Suicide is talked about, it's not tabboo. The only sad death is if someone died alone or of course if they were young and it wasn't their time.

Are things the same in Ireland, or are you even better at death? I can't help wondering if it's so bad in England due to all the repressed emotion and stiff upper lip type stuff.

I live in England and I’m scared about dying here in case it takes weeks to bury me! I’ve never had a satisfactory answer about why it takes so long. Three weeks!

We are going to a family funeral on Thursday , nearly 4 weeks after the death. Someone quite young. ( 30s)Body has been in chapel of rest since then, but had no visitors.

Well, I helped my uncle dig my grandmother’s grave, but that same cemetery now has a big sign saying only county-council employees are allowed to dig graves, so I’m assuming there are ‘official’ grave diggers, even if they also do other things?

What about undertakers? Don’t they have storage?

I’m not Irish and we do the same, we still keep the dead at home though and the family/friends visits until late at night for couple of days, third day, usually around midday is the funeral. As a kid I found it a bit scary but as I got older I started to understand the meaning of it better , is like everyone dying wish to be in their home ( even dead) one last time. In England you don’t even know if your neighbour passed , it’s sad really

So how would you manage if you'd relationship abroad, is it just accepted that they might not make the funeral? 2 or 3 days seems ever such a quick turnaround.

@Champooforyou sometimes they'll hold off for a couple of days if there's problems with an immediate family member getting home in time.

@Champooforyou you can hold off a few days too if you need to. A lot of our family was in Australia when my Grandmother died so we got a week before we buried her although cow she was I would have buried her before she died but that may be a different tale.

2 or 3 days is ages. In Islam and Judaism funerals usually take place within 24 hours. I would love to understand why English leave it for over a week or even longer?

We’ve all had one of those in the family. Mine was also my granny. Whose grave I helped dig very cheerfully indeed, the cow bag.

I'm English and do think the Irish/Welsh ways being talked about are far better

It's all about caring for the grieving and celebrating the life of the dead person

We do have some wonderful celebrations in our church, but been to some funerals that were not great and seen people just left without help once the funeral is done

DH's extended family is Irish. He is well used to dropping everything and booking a flight at whatever cost to get to a funeral.

Even during Covid he did, and sat vigil on his own overnight , because no-one local could risk breaking the rules.

Here in England, he finds it quite usual to visit and view the deceased and will offer to accompany loved ones who are slightly wary but wish to do so.

These 2 posts made me laugh.

I studied grief counselling (no longer in that field). The reason it is said 'Irelands way is better' is because of the way grief is handled without people even realising.
In Ireland, you could have hundreds attending the house over the 3 days. Everyone who comes in through the house, will get the story of how they died etc etc. This in itself is counselling. It helps the grieving relatives process what has happened, they are telling their story over and over until it becomes comfortable. Of course there is always going to be grief trauma. But it is not to the extent that it does be found in other countries that do not do the buried on the 3rd day wake.
I have lived some time in England and had friends who had relatives die. It is mentioned they have died and that is end of story. Often they do not even know what they have died from.

We do have some strange ways in ireland though. But I love them, they bring me comfort.

My family is Irish (Catholic) family here (Republic, not the North and not in Dublin).
The person is buried on the third day (as in, if the person died on Monday, they're buried on Wednesday). It's brutal for relatives living overseas to have to rush back at a moment's notice (and yes, some relatives miss it).

Anyway, if the death is on a Monday then the body is laid out at home, the wake is on Tuesday at home with open casket (particularly if rural/outside Dublin), removal (to the church on Tuesday night), Funeral on Wednesday. Pub straight after the funeral. People stay for hours in the pub.
Also, even if you only met the person in passing or are only acquainted with them (and often, only acquainted with a relative of the deceased) you would go to the funeral. Irish funerals are much bigger than English ones.

Everyone talks about the deceased person normally, as opposed to in "hushed tones" throughout the wake and in the pub after the funeral. It's a time for celebrating the person who has died, as well as mourning, so there will often be jokes and funny stories told about them, too.

And after the funeral is all done people continue to talk normally about the person; Nobody avoids talking about them "for fear of upsetting anyone"

(People do hold off for more than the three days for the funeral but it is less common, although may be that is changing.). Also cremations are becoming more common - possibly due to the cost of a plot if your family don't already have one with space.

I have been a funeral in Ireland and it is more or less the same except suicide still very much taboo.

'I think this too, but English friends and acquaintances say the Irish timescheme seems terribly rushed to them, and people wouldn’t be able to get to the funeral without more notice.'

I grew up in Ireland, but have lived in the UK all my adult life. Never been to an Irish funeral as an adult (yet), but have been to several in the UK. 3-4 weeks between death and funeral is not at all unusual here. I think it's too long, but on the other hand, I have no idea how anyone copes with a funeral, either emotionally or logistically, 3 days after someone dies. I guess whatever you're used to becomes normal to you

DP lost both of his parents in the last 2 years, and my Irish family were weird as hell about it and absolutely no comfort to him, so not all Irish people are comfortable or competent around death

I know, sure you would be quicker going home!

I think the taboo around suicide is mostly gone because it's so common now.

Funerals are changing now, DH's uncle died last month and he didn't want anything to do with religion so his removals was for 2 hours in the funeral home then straight to the graveyard. The undertaker told us about a third of funerals are that way now. Same for my friend's son when he died.

Most of the undertakers are family run businesses that have been passed down through the generations and are excellent at what they do and guide families through the whole funeral process.

I find this fascinating, thank you for starting the thread. I'm mainly English but with some distant Irish blood that I wish was closer. We are Catholic although here it makes no difference regarding funerals.

What happens in Ireland if there needs to be a post mortem?

Here it takes ages to get the death certificate and that's what seems to be the start of the delay. The crematorium is like a conveyor belt with cortèges queueing up. Awful.

I think I'd find it very freaky to have the body in the house but I understand that it must be a comfort and I love the idea of it with everyone coming and how that's part of the grieving process telling the tale and sharing stories. I personally couldn't cope with lots of people in the house at all hours but I like the idea of it. It sounds like a right old party instead of a lonely forlorn and distraught time.

Yet again another English bashing post. If it was any other country's cultures that were being criticised their would be howls of outrage, racism, yada yada just bloody leave us alone ffs

Well in some ways it is more demanding on the bereaved. But , on the other hand, all the distraction is probably therapeutic too.

I find funerals a bit stressful in one way : I will know some of the deceased family but not others. Feels a bit intrusive to be shaking their hands when I can see their puzzlement !

A friend's father passed away in London and the service was at Putney Vale crematorium. It was sparsely attended and the priest had no idea who any of us were He was looking at a piece of paper occasionally to get the dead man's name right.It was all over very quickly .

Later at the hotel his daughter said she had flown in from Los Angeles. ' But I don't think I had a chance to say goodbye to him.'

So it's one extreme to another I guess. I also recommend the Kevin Toolis book mentioned above. And OP I'm glad Ireland is not some weird outlier! The Welsh way of dealing with death sounds very similar.

I've just waited 5 weeks for DH's funeral in the UK. We'd have had the mass before the funeral. I don't understand why so many countries manage to have funerals within a week, as used to be the case in England.

That's really interesting, I'm struggling with people not wanting to talk about it after two months. The five weeks between DH's death and funeral was surreal, it felt wrong to be getting on with admin while he was still down the road.

There's a lot of generalising here.
I'm Welsh and while I recognise the description in the op from small, tight knit communities, as in England, it is not the same for many in larger towns or cities. A bit like everywhere I imagine.

So it has more to do with the locality/community than country.