Autumn Budget

[OccultOctopus]

Key points so far:

• Upper tax threshold dropped from £150k to £125k
• Other tax thresholds frozen until 2028
• Windfall tax on energy firms to go up to 35%
• Electric cars will have to pay VED from 2025
• Review of a further pension age rise brought forward
• More people on UC to be given 'support coaches' to help them find work
• Spending squeeze on all depts except health

Yeah - this wasn't announced in the Commons this morning (I don't think) but snuck in later.

It'll add about 12p a litre to fuel costs, I think.

I wonder if those figures for people on UC who have never worked or contributed to the system have had those on LCWRA stripped out ? Anyone know ?

On the fuel duty, I think they need to review and raise the mileage rates that can be claimed for businesses expenses.

I don't think the current level is now enough to cover fuel and wear/tear and insurance costs.

12p extra on fuel will be a killer diesel is locally around the £1.80 ish mark. All those people that need to drive to work or drive for a living who can’t use public transport where it actually exists.

I just knew that this budget would bring out the toxic benefit bashers and pensioner haters on MN. So depressingly predictable.

You will all be old one day. Some of you will become too sick or disabled to work or fall on hard times of some kind and need to claim benefits. I hope you look back and cringe at your attitudes.

Yeah, 'they don't need the money.' And '10% when I'm getting 2%!' without looking at 10% of what. Still, look on the bright side, no-one's mentioned assisted dying yet.

If you mean the figure quoted of 3.6 million people who have never worked and (a poster claimed) are on UC, I posted the link upthread to the source. The figure is from ONS and mostly made up of students not people on UC.

@ClaudineClare Well said. It’s demoralising.

Correction to this: the estimated increase for Band D properties is up to £250 a year.

There are so many threads on Mumsnet where one is left feeling £150 -£200k a year is normal but none of them have made their way to this one to complain about the tax rise for them!
3.6 million have never worked ? I know a few people who got married and have been SAHM for so long they just don’t ever get round to starting a career. There will be young adults who are looking for their first job and family caters too.
If they want to get more adults back into work affordable childcare is a must as is a long hard look at age discrimination.

@fernz yup, so people like my MIL whose never worked a day in her life, gets her house paid for by the state and got a prescription yesterday for paracetamol "because why would she pay 29p for tablets she can get for free" can afford to pay for a £1000 security system on her house and orders £20 take out most nights whilst her son and me are struggling to keep her grandson warm as we can't afford heating.

And we earn a good chunk of money, just mortgage, energy and childcare costs too much. But it's OK I get a 2% payrise so yay.

I know not all people on benefits are like that. But there's enough to make me resent the system.

To help with the maths a bit...

10% increase in a full state pension is worth £972 a year.
If you earn less than £62.5k a salary increase of 2%, after basic tax will be worth less than that per year.
Above £62.5k, a 2% increase will net someone more that £972 a year.

With a 5% salary increase, that crossover happens much sooner - at about £25k.

Why do they give us % increases in some areas (pensions up by 10.1%) yet cash amounts in other areas (£1.7bn extra on social care). Big numbers are meaningless without context. Will the extra ££ on health, schools and social care offset higher wages and costs? ie are these real terms increases or are we still drifting backwards?

When I was made redundant at the last recession, there was naff all help for me couldn't even claim jsa! I had to take a pay cut to get a job so I didn't lose my house. Cos if I wanted state help I basically had to lose everything before I'd get it and that doesn't even make sense. They would end up having to pay more in benefits like housing and so on than if they just helped me by providing me with jsa to keep me going for 2 months

Its taken 5yrs to get back to the salary I was earning before the pay cut.

So yeah i call bullshit cos I know from experience if I fall on hard times there won't be help.

They cant even be fair to single income households with their meagre 25% single person discount when really it should be 50%.

moly-coddled pensioners (the richest generation of all)

16% of retired men and 20% of retired women live in poverty in the UK
The UK government spends far less on the state pension, as a proportion of GDP, than many other countries.
UK levels of pensioner poverty are higher than other countries in Europe.
In six EU countries, social expenditure on old-age pensions in 2017 accounted for over 10% of GDP. In the UK the figure was 4.7%.
The UK had a lower-than-average “replacement rate” than the average EU country i.e. the pension as a percentage of salary earned before retirement.

www.ii.co.uk/analysis-commentary/uk-state-pension-really-worst-europe-ii525935

You will all be old one day.

Yep. I began planning my retirement 40+ years in advance (when I started work) with absolutely no expectation of state support. I see it as my responsibility to ensure I have enough private pension to support myself in retirement.

I completely believe that the state (via tax payers) should support those who are unable (for whatever reason) to support themselves. But I don't really understand why the state should be giving money to people who don't need it. And there are a fair number of people in receipt of state pension who categorically do not need the money.

Surely we should all be responsible for ourselves as far as we possibly can. That way there is sufficient money to properly support those who have no savings but cannot work - through ill health, caring responsibilities, being u18, pensioners who worked low-paid jobs etc.

moly-coddled pensioners (the richest generation of all)

At least we're better educated than yours and know its molly-coddled.

But I don't really understand why the state should be giving money to people who don't need it

Again, that word 'need.'

Justbetweenus

So that you can't reduce the information to an amount or format that is relatable to an individual - obfuscation! If they really think it is marvellous and everyone will cheer you can be certain that how it is described will mean most will clearly understand without having to analyse.

Jezza was specifically asked in the debate if the education spending increase would now cover the unfunded rise in salaries for all school staff, by a Tory MP, and gave a 'non answer'. Now, he might not have that information at his fingertips but my interpretation is that it won't or he would have given a colleague a more positive indication. Those unfunded costs are already resulting in 90% of schools in my LA on a deficit for this financial year. The increased spending only starts for the next financal year and is only about a 2% increase on department funding - so unlikely to meet the inflationary costs in school budgets - after pay that would be fuel costs, rates (in some cases) other utilities and resources (although precious little on that) - School Governor on the Finance Committee.

Again, that word 'need.'

Yes. Those who need support should get it. Those who do not (me included) should not.

Because pensions are calculated per person, whereas the £1.7bn is into the service. You will be able to find out out what % the £1.7bn is.

They are not real terms increases, I'm guessing.

Social care budget was £26 billion in 2020-21. So £1.7bn is around 6.5%.

They switch between % and numbers based on what makes them look good.

'Should' is another one I'd ban. How do you quantify who needs help?

*Those who do not (me included) should not&

So you'll be giving it back? not claiming your state pension?

It is a basic function of government since the establishment of the welfare state to define who needs help. There is always debate over drawing the line but it is not a difficult concept.