AIBU to be sick of people who think it's all back to normal?

[JanusTheFirst]

Woke to the news that my cousin died early this morning of Covid. No underlying conditions and she was vaccinated. But she was elderly. She hardly ever went out but must have picked it up on a rare outing to the local shop.

People are still dying and we should still be looking out for those vulnerable to this awful disease. It isn't all back to normal. My cousin is dead and she wouldn't be but for Covid.

I'm so sorry for your loss OP.
Covid killed my DM in Oct. She had been vaccinated 4 times and had previously fought it off in 2021 so we thought she was safe.

I'm front line NHS and worked on the covid wards. Our Trust went back to wearing masks in all areas last week.

I don't know what the answer is but I hope we are never forced to lockdown ever again. It is so unfair to the young.

I guess we should just be sensible, if you feel ill stay home, whether it's flu or Covid, it is unfair to spread it. If you are vulnerable or around vulnerable people then wear a mask.

@Thismonkeysgonetodevon nobody has 'wilfully ignored' that....it's already been addressed upthread

Read the thread before trying to tell us all where we are going wrong

Have you got a reading comprehension issue?

My grandmother has the same attitude your dad does - she's old and she wants to enjoy her life. But her daughter is 65 and having cancer treatment. She could potentially live for many more years, but not if she catches covid.

It's funny how we all ruined our lives to stay indoors and protect the most vulnerable during the height of the pandemic, many of us losing jobs, dating opportunities and God knows what else, but now 80+ year olds get to decide to expose their whole family to covid because they want to enjoy their last few years.

You don't see the irony there?

I’m so sorry for your loss. 💐

Covid isn’t going away. Lockdowns conned us into thinking it would. It’s a new disease and it’s out there to stay.

How do you suppose we pay for it? Children need to go to school to learn and also enable their parents to go to work. We have bankrupted ourselves over COVID lockdowns , furlough have cost so much money already. I suppose you don't work ? Most families have two working parents. Most jobs have very poor sick leave.

People have got to live not just exist. Ds was on the shielding list which had a massive detrimental impact on his mental health. I am not going to keep him hidden away from people on the basis of what if.

when he is ill we stay in because of the medical advice but otherwise we carry on at his normal

What on earth does your waffle have to do with my father going to pubs and restaurants? Bizarre.

@JanusTheFirst

She had a lot more left to offer than many people decades younger.

As I said, I am sorry you lost your cousin, but THIS line in that post ^ is bang out of order.

As a pp said, are you suggesting she deserved to live more than someone several decades younger? Because she (apparently) had more to offer. ???

OP I am very sorry for your loss and understand your anger but singling out COVID as uniquely dangerous is partly what got us into this mess in the first place.

I am currently sicker than I have ever been in my entire life with a respiratory bug that isn’t COVID (I have tested four times). I have no idea where I picked it up. I have been wearing masks in public spaces and have been testing and it’s made no difference whatsoever. I am lucky that I am relatively healthy and don’t have underlying health conditions so I should be OK in a week or so.

But why should COVID (which most people are vaccinated against) be ring fenced as some enormous public health bogeyman? And why should this continue to bring our society to a standstill?

Yes some very unfortunate people will die either from or with COVID. As many people will die from or with flu or other viral illnesses. Sensible public health measures like hand washing and mask wearing probably help at the margins but there is no doubt at all now that the public response to COVID was hugely disproportionate and damaging to public health for many unforeseen reasons.

Many people now want to be as “normal” as possible because they realise the behaviours espoused during COVID did more harm than good and they are not going to return to these behaviours. You have got to look at the big picture.

With great respect to you your relative’s death is a personal tragedy but individual tragedies are never a sound basis for policy.

Three of my elderly relatives spent their last years practically isolated in their care homes. They died of normal old age without celebrating their last birthdays and christmasses with family having a good meal, drink and laughter.
That is not living.
If somebody has reached their 70 / 80 / 90 they can be trusted to decide what they want to do with the time they have left.
I am currently undergoing treatment for cancer and I can't think of anything worse than spending my time in one room beeing kept safe for a long perod.

Her daughter can stay at home and visit her mum another time if she's having chemo you need to minimise contact anyway even seeing lots of people for a meal at home can be dangerous. Having a birthday meal out is very normal.

And often, but not always, the people advocating this have incomes that are not affected by isolating. So on pensions or benefits or with independent means. Occasionally it's those on solid employment contracts with very good employers, who pay full sick pay for months who think everyone should take more time off sick.

They are also not willing to pay more for goods or services and often pay little or no income tax. Easy to say when it's no cost to you.

I am very sorry for your loss and I understand why you feel the way you do. There seems to be a resurgent attitude amongst some people that older people, who in other cultures would be revered as our wise elders (and disabled people) are somehow not worth protecting.

What COVID has demonstrated is that investment in the right things affords us greater resillience to weather these storms. Investment in the right PPE enables our medical staff to keep working safely for example, and in a better position to nurse the very sick back to health. Investment in free LFTs and proper sick pay legislation covering all helps us as a society to protect the vulnerable. There is always a trade off.

Exactly this. It's very easy for people to say 'stay off work' if you have the slightest little sniffle, but many hundreds of thousands of people don't get paid if they are off. It's all right for people sitting there on a pedestal, preaching and dictating, when they have a job that is 'salaried' and they get paid no matter HOW much time they have off!

In addition to the 'salaried' people, there are very likely some people saying 'stay off!' who don't work, (as they are stay-at-home-parents, or on benefits,) and they have no concept of what a shitshow it can turn into if you have a few weeks off work. (NOT an attack on SAHPs, or people on benefits btw before anyone starts!)

My husband doesn't get paid if he off sick. (Only the £90-ish a week SICK pay!) He had to have eight weeks off after having an operation a few years ago. (when we were not as comfortable financially, and DD was younger.) It took us about a year to recover from it financially. I think we lost about £2500-£2600 in income.

And as you say, the tests aren't free. Are people supposed to buy one every time they have a bit of a sore throat and a sniffle? COVID may kill elderly and vulnerable people, but as many people have said, including me, so do many other things.

As I (and a few others) have said, people can't be having loads of time off, and do test after test for COVID every time they have a mildly sore throat and a sniffle. As quite a few people have said, including me, we need to live with covid now. It's right up there, along with flu. Get vaccinated, and just live your life. The vast majority of people will NOT die from covid.

We shouldn't need to lock down but people have absolutely NO common sense. It's pure common sense and logic that you wear a mask in a hospital during the height of the winter flu and covid season, but most people don't/won't. I can't count how many times I've opened a window on the train only to have someone get on and close it because there's a bit of a draught. Pig ignorance. It's been established that ventilation is absolutely THE best way to drastically reduce the chances of viruses spreading, but people would rather get long Covid than sit next to an open fucking window for 10 minutes or find a seat not next to the open window. What do you do with that level of wilful ignorance?

We have ended up having horrible mitigations that ruined lives because people can't be trusted to do the basics like wear a mask in an enclosed space. Nobody should be at risk of catching Covid in a hospital waiting room because the person next to them was hacking and sneezing without a mask on.

With sickpay for all there would be nobody left in the workplace

Too many took the piss last time sending in photos of numerous positive tests! Are we supposed to believe them and let them stay home on full pay?

Yes, I’m not well at the moment with a horrible cold. On Tuesday I have the luxury of choosing to work from home ,or if I don’t feel well enough, I’ll have the time off as sickness on full pay. So many people don’t have those options.

@Theluggage15 how many times can you be off work on full sickpay?

This ^ 100%

My grandmother has the same attitude your dad does - she's old and she wants to enjoy her life. But her daughter is 65 and having cancer treatment. She could potentially live for many more years, but not if she catches covid.

As long as she's staying away from her if she gets sick, I don't see the issue with her enjoying her life. Her daughter could catch Covid from anywhere if she goes out.

I think people are forgetting why we had lockdown,s in the first place it was to prevent the NH S being overwhelmed,it was never to prevent people getting the virus and dying from it ,and my dh,was on the shielding list as was my mum ,unless people lockdown forever ,then unfortunately we will continue to have waved of covid and sadly some people will die ,it's not the fault of the person they caught the virus off it's the fault of the virus .

I prefer wearing a mask when I'm working as a HCP. It's also handy for smells you can put Vic's under your nostrils more discreetly. I don't like wearing one going into the shops let's face it they are uncomfortable, annoying to buy and I'm always faffing try to replace it outside of work. Mask wearing , restrictions isn't a thing culturally for us and people aren't going to conform to wearing one.

Our society is more individualistic than collectivist that's why it's easier for the China , Japan , South Korea to conform to mask wearing and restrictions.

I’m sorry for your loss.

My grandad passed away of covid 3 days ago and I kissed and hugged him through it all. It’s so hard to find the balance in this day and age though. I’m cautious, mindful and courteous around others and have stayed home since coming into contact with grandad (mainly because I’m too sad to do anything else) but life will go on for us all and my grandad wouldn’t want anything less, he even said “life’s for living not shielding for the rest of it so I don’t die” which I suppose you can apply to any illness or everyday life (car crash etc).

once again, im sorry for your loss.

OP, sounds like they died of an underlying condition while they had covid rather than covid. Those axe grinding types of posts suggest health and lives of millions of people destroyed by the lockdowns and other covid measures (that also had drastic effects on children and economy and caused recession and cost of living crisis, lead to wars since people passed the 2.5 year compliance test and showed that history taught them nothing) and will for years to come at a dear cost with many more lives lost thanks to those measures and to humouring a small but vocal number of people with health.
Please seek treatment for your anxiety. The harm it does is immense. In fact this once thriving country has been destroyed because of it.

@IDontCareMatthew Six months on full pay.