If you could go back in time, would you still get the jab?

[Quweenie]

If you could go back in time, would you still get the Covid jab?

I don’t really care if you’re vaccinated or not, but I’m interested if people would go back and change their decision?

Yes, with CEV husband, it gave us our lives back.
Hope we’re offered annual boosters (would happily pay).

@MinkyGreen you cannot ignore all the injuries, all the yellow card data, all the sudden deaths though. Even if you think those speaking out are "fringe" and wrong, the evidence is becoming very very clear. You may not like it but its not just staring us in the face, it is shouting at us!!!!

I have had all the vaccines but would only have one now if I was planning to go abroad. Unless anything changes.

The coronavirus vaccines have caused side effects and in very rare cases deaths.

However, it is still abudantly clear, based on robust replicated evidence, that it was far safer to be vaccinated than not vaccinated, and that the current groups being offered boosters would also be better off taking it than not.

I am very happy to update my opinion if there was new evidence demonstrating the opposite - I want to make the best decisions for me & the people I love and don't give a jot about being "wrong" - but there isn't. Not a shred of it. There is no "obvious evidence to the contrary".

All the claims you're making, you follow back where they've come from, and it's just more misleading, anti-vaccine nonsense @loulouljh

^ as above

This evidence doesn't exist, let alone it shouting at anyone

Must be hundreds of posts on MN now (plus three+ (?) dedicated threads) explaining why Campbell is not a helpful source on coronavirus or the vaccines @Zippedydoo123 Let alone all the commentary from research scientists and doctors online regarding him.

This includes specific examples of all the basic errors, miscontrusions and fake claims he's made. This isnt suprising, he isn't a medic, he isn't a research scientist, and he hasn't published a single empirical research article.

Unfortunately he's now very much caught up in the anti-vaccine industry, and why wouldn't he be? He makes ten of thousands a month on youtube, conspiracy theories and speculation get a lot more clicks than boring accurate reporting, and therefore he's actively incentivised to promote misinformation.

As has been said before, it's an incredibly lucrative industry.

@loulouljh

No. You have been listening to social media misinformation. If you look at properly regulated advice e.g. the NHS guidelines - it clearly states that they are safe, effective and serious side effects are extremely rare.

Social media videos will not be properly regulated and are not a better source of information. People will twist data to suit an agenda. That’s why robust, peer reviewed evidence is the most trustworthy source.

Of course I can’t change your opinion, but a poster on another thread was talking about her young daughter’s very important operation being delayed due to her hospital being overwhelmed. It really doesn’t help to rally against NHS guidance when it can cause significant harm to others. I

If that under resourced hospital can’t treat her daughter because an unvaccinated Covid patient (misled by misinformation) needs urgent attention - that’s not really fair is it?

you cannot ignore all the injuries, all the yellow card data, all the sudden deaths though.

Every single medicine and vaccine has side effects for a minority of people. This is just the way it is (probably because we're all a bit genetically and biochemically different). So the Covid vaccines also have side effects (some transient and related to the immune response you'd expect) and for a few people, longer lasting and in a very, very few cases, these can be fatal. However this is the extreme minority.

The sudden deaths thing is really being hyped at the moment. As if sudden deaths never happened before. For example, the American football player who had a cardiac arrest during play. He received a heavy blow to his chest, that is enough to stop his heart. I recall several athletes who have suddenly died in past years. Nothing to do with vaccines. Sudden deaths happen.

Meanwhile vaccines have saved millions of lives since they were introduced. It cannot be understated just how many millions have avoided dreadful diseases and either disfigurement, paralysis or death thanks to these scientific advances. I for one am very grateful for them.

Classic example of the above - someone makes a scary claim as "evidence", turns out the evidence does not exist.

@Zippedydoo123 responded to this: "Dr John Campbell does regular podcasts about the pandemic."

I took this to mean they'd got the claim from a Campbell youtube video. I watched the video, and yep it's another example of him either being confused due to no science expertise or deliberately misinterpreting a study for clicks.

Here's the original source - it's not recent btw - it's from Spring 2022. It is a observational study using data from the US.

And here are the findings in context:

What is added by this report?
Increased hospitalization rates among adults aged ≥65 years compared with rates among younger adults were most pronounced during the Omicron BA.2–predominant period. Among hospitalized nonpregnant patients, 44.1% had received primary vaccination and ≥1 booster or additional dose. Hospitalization rates among unvaccinated adults were approximately triple those of vaccinated adults.

What are the implications for public health practice?
Adults should stay up to date with COVID-19 vaccination, including booster doses. Multiple nonpharmaceutical and medical prevention measures should be used to protect persons at high risk for severe SARS-CoV-2, regardless of vaccination status.

Why blindly follow and repeat what people are telling you? Surely it makes more sense to think for yourself, and check whether the claims they are making are actually backed up by anything?

No,

Had a systemic reaction which thankfully resolved.

Recently had COVID last month and my injection site flared up and was painful again. Not convinced it’s half life is as low as we are led to believe.

those speaking have been shut down.

Clearly they haven't, given their claims are being repeated by you and are all over the internet @loulouljh

Malhotra has quite the following, for example.

There is good quality, robust, research looking at things like prevalence and mechanism of side effects, assessing whether vaccination is overal beneficial in certain groups (e.g., young men). This research is widely promoted and publicly available.

Most reputable places (e.g., credible news outlets) are not going to report on fake or unsubstantiated claims about vaccination, because it is harmful and unethical.

So not my mind will not be changed when the evidence overwhelmingly supports my views.

There is no evidence supporting your views. If you think there is, do link it to the thread. You are of course entitled to think whatever you want, but people will point this out @loulouljh

@loulouljh but the fringe social media science you are listening to is even worse. It’s completely unregulated, it’s very, very lucrative. It manipulates data. It’s harmful and unsafe.

It’s like going to a backstreet clinic for an operation.

Not convinced it’s half life is as low as we are led to believe.

Do tell the molecular geneticists!

exogenous mRNA being degraded in 24-36 hours in vivo has been a real problem when developing therapeutics where ideally you'd want it lasting longer. It's a major limiter of the field.

It certainly isn't hanging around your body for months on end, despite what people are claiming.

I was never scared of Covid for me personally. I'm young healthy and very low risk. I wasn't bothered about contracting it. I didn't get the vacccines. I've had anaphylaxis previously and didn't think it was worth the risk for me personally.

I was very very pissed off that people like me were excluded from travel , events etc and were shunned/scapegoated during 2021/22.

I got Covid eventually and it was a non event. Less than a cold. Having to isolate was more of a pain than the disease.

A lot of antivax online is utter crap by flat earth type people. I distance myself from it. If people want a vax I think it should be a free choice. I don't believe in coercion.

But people also shouldn't be manipulated and scared by fake promises that it was a save all and 100% safe. There is no such thing.

I do not know one unvaccinated person who has been ill with covid. Not one. Not saying at all there are none...of course not

I do. I am not vaccinated, nor is my neighbour (for various reasons, I'm needle phobic). I have had Covid quite recently (was ill for a week) and previously in July 2020 I encountered it but didn't get ill at all, just made antibodies. My neighbour also had Covid recently (as did her unvaxxed teenager). Both were ill for about a week or so.

I don't know why you think SARS-CoV-2 can't make you ill. It can, it can be very serious. It can have effects we are only just beginning to discover.

@loulouljh

Drs are being paid to promote this stuff!!! It is lucrative to do so.

No, they aren't. No, it isn't.

the evidence overwhelmingly supports my views.

No, your views support your views. The evidence overwhelmingly supports the opposite.

Do people not understand the meaning of the word evidence anymore?

That truly is the last place I would go for information.

Well where are you getting your information @loulouljh ? Because it sounds like you're just repeating claims from people making a career out of being anti-vaccine, rather than thinking for yourself.

Drs are being paid to promote this stuff!!! It is lucrative to do so.
Like this - nope and nope. I like how you've borrowed the term lucrative though!

So not my mind will not be changed when the evidence overwhelmingly supports my views.

It is very telling that instead of linking actual evidence, you keep repeating you have it.

for people saying the evidence does not exist against the jab. I am afraid it does.
Your phrase "evidence against the jab" shows quite a bit of naivety. As has been posted, there is much research looking into vaccine side effects, we know these occur. This is well publicised and available online. No one is saying this does not happen, and a huge amount of resources have been invested into investigating aspects of this.

It is the likes of Mccullough who follow the money by promoting misinformation. Funny how he reckons the vaccine can shed by intercourse when he and his associates sell supplements said to counteract the spike protein.
Check out The Wellness Centre.

loulouljh
@MinkyGreen you cannot ignore all the injuries, all the yellow card data, all the sudden deaths though. Even if you think those speaking out are "fringe" and wrong, the evidence is becoming very very clear. You may not like it but its not just staring us in the face, it is shouting at us!!!!

61% of the world population have been vaccinated. You can not ignore that @loulouljh

That is staring you in the face and shouting. The side effects are a pin prick in comparison.

Quite. People seem incredibly focussed on not being scammed by "MSM", "big pharma" and the like, but totally happy to buy into obvious con artists.

His website includes "Dr. McCullough's Healthy Heart & Muscle Formula is designed to keep your body’s cardiovascular performance and muscle functionality at its optimum condition" - 60 DOLLARS for a combination of vitamins that a) you could buy a fraction of the price, and b) have no evidence in actually doing the things he claims they will, you just produce very expensive wee. And yet he says it will detox you from the vaccine, prevent COVID etc etc.

Not even going to comment the "Dr. VanDeWater's Spike Recovery Formula
Inhibit spike viral effects, blood vessel blockages, and support T-cell activity" - We recommend this formula to protect your body against shedding and spike protein exposure. Particularly in cases of "long haul" illnesses, this product can help your body repair itself and recover to optimum health..

It's an absolute joke and I don't want them to make a penny off people. Imagine going to medical school and deciding to do this with your life.

Imagine going to medical school and deciding to do this with your life Yes that is strange I must say, especially considering how successful he was at publishing good research prior to covid, and how respected he was. Most odd.

Pseudoscience is incredibly lucrative. I work in education and Brain Gym was being peddled by schools everywhere a decade or so ago. I went on a Brain Gym course which cost my school £200. It was complete and utter bollocks.

There are a lot of forceful views on this thread.

You just do you. Anyone else's medical decisions are private.

I don’t know about any of those but two colleagues of mind died suddenly between Xmas and new year. Healthy young men. Is this covid or lockdowns, or god forbid, is there something in what Malhotra is saying? I would like confirmation that such sudden deaths are properly investigated