Wtf have I just read? Toddlers/babies/children being forced to quarantine separate from parents in Shanghai?

[Sorryfornamechanging]

This has made me feel sick to my stomach. Those poor babies and parents.
It seems like such a massive overreaction as well?!

I can’t seem to link but it’s a Daily Mail article.

I can’t believe they are doing this!

At this point I don't believe their actions are about Covid. I believe it's about inspiring terror.
With inflation, food and fuel shortages looming Chinese people have received a timely reminder that their government feels completely comfortable locking them in their homes to starve and taking their defenceless babies into 'facilities'.
This is about staving off civil unrest with terror.

@HesterShaw1

No one has the right not to be offended, as Stephen Fry said.

I too am fucking bored and pissed off with the endless preoccupation with and over reaction to Covid. I see people in the street in a fresh breeze wearing masks and just want to point and laugh, though don't of course. I inwardly roll my eyes. If that's offensive then 🤷‍♀️

Really couldn't care what you think, TBH.

@Snazzyjazzpants

At this point I don't believe their actions are about Covid. I believe it's about inspiring terror. With inflation, food and fuel shortages looming Chinese people have received a timely reminder that their government feels completely comfortable locking them in their homes to starve and taking their defenceless babies into 'facilities'. This is about staving off civil unrest with terror.

I agree. This has very strong we can do what we like with you energy. The regime are going to need to manage many millions of cases going forward, inevitably some deaths and morbidity, economic damage and all the while try and keep as much egg as possible off their faces. There are some Chinese residents who'll already have realised this, and the rest are going to soon enough. Naturally, the regime will want them all kept well in their place.

BTW, the sodding stupid boring COVID virus? That's offensive to all those who have died, who had suffered badly with the virus, who have struggled in lockdowns or have been frontline workers throughout.

Oh, do pipe down. It's possible to feel bad about people who have died AND also think that COVID is a terribly boring virus. Because that's what it is. Boring in itself (no exotic symptoms) and causing us to live in a boring way too. Doubt there'll be any thrillingly moving films or novels about this one. Even most TV series etc. did their best to pretend it didn't exist. It'll be quite odd for future people to look back on popular culture created at this time--"Why is there no trace of COVID in any of the films and things being made at this time? It's like everyone was trying to pretend it wasn't happening."

I'm actually beginning to see how the 1918 flu got memoryholed, despite killing about 1% of the entire world population at the time, and we remembered WWI but sort of collectively forgot about the 1918 flu because it was just crap and shitty and boring and nobody wanted to think about it again.

I have a feeling that a few decades from now, the early 2020s will be known as "the turbulent time when major wars started to break out across Europe and Asia" and then there will be a sort of footnote about "oh yeah, and of course there was that bloody crap COVID thing that happened just before that so everyone was already in a bad mood."

And you are rude.

It is, unbelievable though it may seem, possible to have a difference of opinion without calling someone deluded.

To the poster who asked about sensible precautions - I mean not abandoning wearing masks. I mean continuing to encourage vaccinations. Even more importantly, I mean making it possible for people on low incomes to be able test for covid without having to decide if they can afford to.

They're big on masks in China and Hong Kong, is it making a difference there?

I have my doubts about how effective they were in this country

@greenteafiend

That's lovely for you. I'm very happy that my children have experienced normal life for pretty much their whole lives here....

Calm before the storm, frankly.

Any foreigner choosing to stay in China right now needs to think very carefully about the wisdom of this--especially if they have children

It's not even really about COVID any more. It's the fact that you are living at the mercy of a government that does not respect the rule of law, will do almost anything to avoid being humiliated on the international stage, and is viciously eager to blame foreigners/outsiders/fifth columnists/stooges for absolutely everything and anything that goes wrong in China.

The Chinese government has now developed a societal framework for incarcerating people at will, removing their children from them, monitoring their every movement and stopping them from leaving the country. They are not going to relinquish any of this even when the acute phase of COVID eventually passes.

No, they haven't.

As I mentioned above, children are not being separated from parents.

@bellac11

They're big on masks in China and Hong Kong, is it making a difference there?

I have my doubts about how effective they were in this country

I think it has been, but it's hard to tell, especially given how many people here wore masks before this virus.

I mean continuing to encourage vaccinations

They might have wanted to roll out one that worked, then.

As I mentioned above, children are not being separated from parents.

I've seen plenty of evidence that they are. But leaving that aside, starving them in their homes isn't great either really.

@LiquoricePickle

And you are rude.

It is, unbelievable though it may seem, possible to have a difference of opinion without calling someone deluded.

To the poster who asked about sensible precautions - I mean not abandoning wearing masks. I mean continuing to encourage vaccinations. Even more importantly, I mean making it possible for people on low incomes to be able test for covid without having to decide if they can afford to.

With you on the vaccinations, but how do either masks or widespread free testing qualify as sensible at this point, given that neither can be relied on to control Omicron at all? They're essentially just preferences you have.

@LiquoricePickle are people being fed? Are animals being beaten and stuffed alive into sacks? Is this what it takes to respect the victims of covid?

As I mentioned above, children are not being separated from parents.

Even if it's not happening right now, it was happening until very recently, and there is no way to stop it happening again other than hoping that the CCP will choose to do the right thing, because the CCP does not respect the rule of law.

And it's not what's being done right now in this specific situation that concerns me with regard to outsiders with children choosing to live in China. It's about the bigger long-term picture. The relentless government surveillance, the wolf warrior diplomacy, the rising odds that China might decide to make a snatch at Taiwan in the next few years.

[quote GiveMeNovocain]@LiquoricePickle are people being fed? Are animals being beaten and stuffed alive into sacks? Is this what it takes to respect the victims of covid?[/quote]
I can't comment on everyone. Everyone that I know in SH has been receiving food and water parcels. I accept that this is unlikely true for everyone though.

I can comment on the recent video of cats that's been flying around the internet though.... It's horrifying, but it isn't from Shanghai and it isn't covid related.

I'm not sure why you're relating it to respecting victims of covid, unless maybe that wasn't aimed at me?

@greenteafiend

As I mentioned above, children are not being separated from parents.

Even if it's not happening right now, it was happening until very recently, and there is no way to stop it happening again other than hoping that the CCP will choose to do the right thing, because the CCP does not respect the rule of law.

And it's not what's being done right now in this specific situation that concerns me with regard to outsiders with children choosing to live in China. It's about the bigger long-term picture. The relentless government surveillance, the wolf warrior diplomacy, the rising odds that China might decide to make a snatch at Taiwan in the next few years.

That's obviously a valid point of view and concern.

I have young children here. I'm not an idiot, I'm aware of current events and I've still decided to be here. It's not like foreigners here aren't making informed decisions.

@LiquoricePickle

I'm not sure why you're relating it to respecting victims of covid, unless maybe that wasn't aimed at me?

It was more likely aimed at me in an odd roundabout way, although I can't quite decipher it.

Even if it's not happening right now, it was happening until very recently, and there is no way to stop it happening again other than hoping that the CCP will choose to do the right thing, because the CCP does not respect the rule of law.

Yes. I'm not particularly reassured by a government basically saying we have developed systems to remove your toddlers from you whenever we judge it expedient, and have benevolently decided to pause that process for now but with no guarantee that it won't come back.

@LiquoricePickle

And you are rude.

It is, unbelievable though it may seem, possible to have a difference of opinion without calling someone deluded.

To the poster who asked about sensible precautions - I mean not abandoning wearing masks. I mean continuing to encourage vaccinations. Even more importantly, I mean making it possible for people on low incomes to be able test for covid without having to decide if they can afford to.

But masks don't work. It's been shown again and again that they don't work.

Oh people weren't wearing them right? And they weren't wearing the right sort?

Or maybe, mitigations apart from total and utter shutdowns of society and the economy just don't work? Covid just keeps coming back. What is Shanghai's plan for what happens next? Rolling lockdowns forever?

@HesterShaw1 Yep And yet the NHS Confederation want to bring masks back and are asking for ppl not to visit family AGAIN this Easter.
And yet on the other hand ppl were/are being asked to share their home with Ukrainian refugees . Are they supposed to make the Ukrainian family wear masks and live in the garden. After all they have been though
Make it make sense

And you are rude.

You live in China, I'd suggest what the Chinese government is doing and has done for sometime is lesser than being rude.

@HesterShaw1 Yep And yet the NHS Confederation want to bring masks back and are asking for ppl not to visit family AGAIN this Easter.

Ah I'm guessing people will give a big two fingers to this, and hopefully so, as its first Easter in England we can have without restrictions since 2019.

They would've done better to focus on the funding issues and ventilation.