Could this be any more selfish?

[whatatanker]

Father has tested positive on LFT. He does a hobby which involves lots of other people (3 days a week and 60 people). It is outside, but does involve close contact. He's done this hobby twice since he's found out he's positive.

He's been going about as usual with symptoms. He is not isolating (in fact went to his second home - over 100 miles away) last weekend, knowing full well that he was positive. He's been going in to shops, meeting up with people etc.

He has only told DM that he's positive. I'm not supposed to know.

I'm appalled. He's a selfish narcissistic bastard and it doesn't surprise me, but I'm not sure that I can have a decent relationship with him now that I know the extent of his selfishness.

Disgusting behaviour.

Yet people are still unimaginatively hectoring others about how 'easy' it is to stay caged up... Fine if you have a secure, comfortable home that you share with pleasant, reasonable people; an income or plenty of money in the bank etc. Much less fine if you are living with a bully or an abuser, working in a low-paid, precarious job that cannot be done remotely, stuck in a cramped flat with young children etc.
Then consider the decisions some key workers have to make if their jobs are understaffed - do they risk possibly infecting a vulnerable person or do they risk that person being left without essential care because there is no one else to cover?

Who do you think the CEV are? A different species?
CEV people are just as likely to live in this way as the rest of society.
People have been calling for the CEV to be locked alone at home since early 2019, and many have expressed that many disabled people should stay at home to avoid disconveniencing others since as long as the Internet has existed.

It sounds like you subscribe to the middle-class, Tory idea that disabled people are living the life of Riley on benefits, with everything they've ever needed at their fingertips.

@wreath21
Not sure the OP dad has to worry about living with a bully and he isnt going out to scrape together the money to feed his children. he is on a jolly outing which could have been missed for 10 days

@BabyBornThisWay

Calm Down

What a mature and intellectual response! My mum is CEV and with twats like this man going around it means she can't have much of a normal life, so it's not about calming down, it's about keeping things safe so people can use the nhs if they need to.

If you get hit by a bus today will you be saying "calm down" to the medics when they tell you they can't get you to hospital for 4 hours, and then it could be a 20 hour wait for treatment as they are so busy?

@Walking4You where are you getting those figures from? The number of deaths are remaining pretty level, especially considering the number of cases. This is a good thing. In fact Chris Whitby said as much - he said the lack of rise in mortality rate was "extremely good news", and said "we are not seeing the surge in mortality that we saw in previous waves".

Yes cases are high and people in hospital are testing positive, but they aren't being admitted for Omicron necessarily.

Just keeping a little list of the most eye-opening posts. Worriedandannoyed is the winner so far.

Worriedandannoyed 11:06

Sadly for those who are CEV I think we need to get on with life and if people feel they need to be careful/shield that's what they should do. Unless we get another variant that is more deadly Omicron at the moment doesn't affect the vast majority

Worriedandannoyed 13:30

The tide is turning regarding testing and isolating. This cannot and will not go on forever. Those on this post who have such strong views are CEV I assume. I'm sorry you have to assume YOU will have to take precautions, not the rest of society.

Worriedandannoyed 13:37

Have you seen the latest data? Hospitalisations and deaths HAVENT spiked, there is only a very small increase. Life has to go on for us all. If you are CEV then stay home, take precautions. Change your job, don't go to crowded places. Use your common sense and don't be bitter towards those of us who are finally able to live our lives.

I'm keeping my eyes peeled for more.

I don't agree with the OP's father going about spreading it though. Anybody who is ill with any infectious virus should stay away from people.

From a Professor Resia Pretorius today in the Guardian:

One of the biggest sources of concern is that even mild and sometimes asymptomatic initial Covid-19 infection may lead to debilitating, long-term disability.

So it's not just a bloody cold the OP's dad is schlepping about his group. And it's this long-term disability that I fear the most, what with already being disabled from inflammatory arthritis - you know, the thing off the telly that even pretty young people can get, that one.

Since early 2020, we and other researchers have pointed out that acute Covid-19 is not only a lung disease, but actually significantly affects the vascular (blood flow) and coagulation (blood clotting) systems.

This ain't no ordinary cold.

@carrythecan

Im glad you mentioned Whitty. As he also said Omicron isnt mild and most cases in hospital are there as a direct result of covid and not incidental. 10 to 20% of hospital cases include in hospital transmission, and incidental positive (ie broken leg and found on testing). however in hospital transmision is also a worry because covid could worsen the condition they are in for.

People arent either blowing their nose mild or dead. there are many variations from really ill at home but not needing hospital, till needing hospital care to stop you becoming worse to severe medical need/death.
From the NHS point of view if those who couldnt manage at home all died very quickly before the ambulance could get to them it would actually not be causing problems but as hospital level sick people are going to need alot of care and attention which is quickly becoming more and more unlikely to be available to those who need it for covid reasons or for any other reason

@MilesJuppIsMyBitch

Whether you like it or not things will change soon. Remember the uproar that whole households no longer had to isolate if one person was positive? Now it's just accepted. Soon no-one will have to isolate at all when they test positive.

@worriedandannoyed

soon isn't now. Currently it is not ok to go out about when positive for Covid.

Yes it will likely be ok in the future but that isnt now. Do you know why it isnt now?
Its to try and prevent spread to stop society crashing at our feets which will negatively effect every person (yes even those in assumed perfect health)
When the scientists and experts believe it is time (possibly earlier than ideal from a scientific standpoint) the government will remove the need to isolate like they did for close contacts.

its currently legal to run someone over i could argue that this may not be the case one day but if i did it today i would be a twat even if it was just their toes and they had steelboots on so was fine. i would also been in trouble with the police

@Covidworries

I'm not saying it is now. I'm not saying her dad is right. I was trying to explain that we aren't soon off that point where we just need to get on with life. Where did I say it was ok now?

Do we all go round afraid of the flu? Of being hit by a bus or being in a car accident? No. We have to live with the risk at some point and that point is approaching

I don't think anyone is expecting life to be risk free or for restrictions to stay forever but currently there is a need to ensure that essential services can continue to limp along and not collapse entirely

I wouldn't break quarantine myself but I don't understand the outrage. Omicron is so contagious that it isn't possible to protect each individual from it. Even if quarantine rules are followed by most, you will catch it at some point from someone who doesn't know they've got it. And it's overwhelmingly likely that you will then be fine. Most people will wear masks and social distance to reduce their risk of spreading covid unknowingly, but we can't eliminate it. So if you can't face even this small risk, you need to stay at home.

Some of the outrageous and hysterical posts about long term disability are as dangerous as the antivaxx stuff, and should be treated as such by MNHQ.

[quote Covidworries]@carrythecan

Im glad you mentioned Whitty. As he also said Omicron isnt mild and most cases in hospital are there as a direct result of covid and not incidental. 10 to 20% of hospital cases include in hospital transmission, and incidental positive (ie broken leg and found on testing). however in hospital transmision is also a worry because covid could worsen the condition they are in for.

People arent either blowing their nose mild or dead. there are many variations from really ill at home but not needing hospital, till needing hospital care to stop you becoming worse to severe medical need/death.
From the NHS point of view if those who couldnt manage at home all died very quickly before the ambulance could get to them it would actually not be causing problems but as hospital level sick people are going to need alot of care and attention which is quickly becoming more and more unlikely to be available to those who need it for covid reasons or for any other reason[/quote]
The incidental rates are much higher than 10 -20%, it's more like 33%.

Why on earth did he bother testing if he wasn't going to do anything about it ?

When did he actually start with symptoms vs a positive test? It's entirely possible he had mild symptoms for days before hand and refused to test but then did it to shut your mum up but didn't get the answer he wanted.

Honestly I would be more worried if he was going to ASDA vs going to another property he owns as much as it's against the rules if he driven himself he's not really put anyone at actual risk.

You don't say what he does but if it's a close contact sport I can't imagine he's exposing many CEV people.

I agree we are nearly at the end of isolation it is causing more disruption than the virus

@Covidworries

I don't think anyone is expecting life to be risk free or for restrictions to stay forever but currently there is a need to ensure that essential services can continue to limp along and not collapse entirely

services are only at danger of collapsing because of isolation, not because they are lying in hospital beds.

Scrap isolation and we can all go to work regardless.

[quote worriedandannoyed]@Covidworries

I'm not saying it is now. I'm not saying her dad is right. I was trying to explain that we aren't soon off that point where we just need to get on with life. Where did I say it was ok now?

Do we all go round afraid of the flu? Of being hit by a bus or being in a car accident? No. We have to live with the risk at some point and that point is approaching [/quote]
Silly comment. We are living with the risk right now.

The reason that we are taking measures against spreading infection is not because of personal risk of catching Covid. So nothing to do with CEV or whatever othering your pet beef is about.

It is in order to stop our hospitals being overwhelmed which negatively impacts absolutely EVERYONE whether they are young or old, or at risk or not.

So that IF and WHEN we get hit by a bus or are in a car accident or trip on a curb or get skin cancer or need to have a caesarian or a smear test or WHATEVER- there is a hospital open that can take us.

services are only at danger of collapsing because of isolation, not because they are lying in hospital beds.

@worriedandannoyed

Do you have a source for that?

What we need is more funding for the NHS (to be spent on staff not shiny new buildings that, er, can't be used because there is no one to staff them), plus financial support for those who don't get sick pay.

We won't achieve those things by whining about the disobedience of other members of the public and we won't get them by hiding under our beds indefinitely (which 'we' can only do if the low-paid service workers keep on going out to work anyway).

www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/covid-latest-news-rules-restrictions-wales-boosters-omicron/

Some of the outrageous and hysterical posts about long term disability are as dangerous as the antivaxx stuff, and should be treated as such by MNHQ.

As far as I'm aware, MNHQ are perfectly comfortable with direct quotes from published articles by accredited university professors, from today's mainstream UK media.

I can understand going to the supermarket and being exceptionally careful as mother Teresa does not magically arrive with food if you have none and can’t get a delivery slot. When I go to Tesco I do mentally budget for at least one person in there being positive. So I keep well away from everyone and don’t let my mum go to the supermarket ever (cev).

But meeting up with people for fun is beyond the pale.

Thousand of doctors and nurses are off sick due to isolation. It doesn't mean they're not well enough to work, they just aren't able to because of isolating.