Insane panic

[Acidburn]

Hi All
I feel like the majority of people around me have lost the plot really. If Omicron is essentially a cold (for the vaxxinated people) then why is everyone so scared of it? Why is there a conversation for more restrictions to come? Why do we need restrictions to fight a common cold (which is what Omicron is apparently)? In New Zealand and South Africa they have removed all the restrictions, because it just a cold ffs - people don't even self isolate anymore if they get it! Why the panic mode again?
I suppose for those who chose not to get vaccinated - it might be more than a common cold. But then it's a consequence of their own choice - I'm sure they thought it through.

So why do we panick again?

@QueenZoopla the underfunding plays a part but all healthcare systems in the world become overwhelmed if there is too many people acutely ill. Healthcare isn't infinite and cannot run at near capacity for long periods of time without problems, which is why we are not the only country with capacity problems and restrictions.

@NeedAHoliday2021 this is exactly the issue in my area of Scotland. They are very vague about why the hospital is so busy so people automatically assume it’s covid but I work in community nursing and know it’s due to lack of care packages and community hospitals still being closed so no where for people medically fit for home to go and it’s going to get no better, there are more older people here than younger people who are willing to work as carers to care for them

I don't think people being cautious is insane panic. At least I don't see it around me.

They have to isolate for 10 days in NZ, then plus 72 hours symptom free.

They absolutely have not removed all the restrictions in New Zealand. My auntie has been trying to get back there for the best part of a year but along with tens of thousands other NZ nationals have not been able to get a space in a quarantine hotel which you must enter and stay in on arrival. The reason life is fairly normal there is because they kept covid out although seeing the rest of the world has spectacularly failed I'm not sure how they move forward in future

@Takemine

You can't spell panic which makes me think you either have dyslexia or don't have the benefit of further education.

I'm saying this because to understand, you would have to read and analyse.

There are many threads explaining why increased transmissibility increases hospitalisations more than increased severity of illness. Also other threads pointing out that our vaccines don't give full cover so if even a small proportion are ill, it could still be a very large number. Also plenty of threads pointing out that it's not just the unvaccinated who are at risk but the elderly, CEV and anyone who might need the services of the NHS while they are being cared for. The unvaccinated are not going to be left to die so they're a problem, as is waning nation with waning immunity and a virus that moves faster than the booster roll out. This is not panic (though thanks for writing off my well founded concern for my CEV son as such) but just stating the facts.

So before you spend the afternoon listening to yourself posting from a place of apparent ignorance, I suggest you do some reading.

Gosh, you’re a long way up yourself!

Don't know anyone who is panicking about Omicron.

@AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii absolutely. It’s been like this winter upon winter but covid has exacerbated the situation rather than created it. It adds another layer of complexity to a crumbling system.

@vodkaredbullgirl

Don't know anyone who is panicking about Omicron.

No neither do I

Tbh most 'panicking' I've come across lately has been from people worrying about not being able to spend their Xmas as planned with family, not being able to get on planes or being stuck abroad, having to isolate and miss work that they can't afford to do. No one is panicking about the illness in its self unless particularly vulnerable

[quote AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii]@NeedAHoliday2021 this is exactly the issue in my area of Scotland. They are very vague about why the hospital is so busy so people automatically assume it’s covid but I work in community nursing and know it’s due to lack of care packages and community hospitals still being closed so no where for people medically fit for home to go and it’s going to get no better, there are more older people here than younger people who are willing to work as carers to care for them[/quote]
Well said. We also as a Nation have to start accepting our role in the care or our elderly Parents. When I was young it was normal for Granny to come and live with one of her Children. This freed up both housing and home care capacity.

Like you I'm in Scotland and the Covid numbers in hospitals are taking up a small fraction of capacity.

www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/

Covid 19 is NOT "a cold" or anything like a cold. It is essentially an endothelial disease,

academic.oup.com/eurheartj/article/41/32/3038/5901158

the long-term sequalae of which is unknown.

www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fmicb.2021.698169/full

That's partly what the worry is about.

@Youarefakenews I see where you are coming from but I’m not sure how this will become reality, especially for those whose elderly relatives have dementia and cannot be left alone, caring for relatives would rely on someone giving up work or reducing hours which isn’t going to happen with rising prices, I know myself I wouldn’t be able to care for my relatives with working in nursing so not sure what the answer is but I think opening the closed community hospitals (many staff redeployed at the start of covid who could go back) and paying carers more with better incentives may help

@Youarefakenews i should add that my local authority tried with a pleading social media post to get families to take relatives home, I’m not sure how well this worked but I know many peoples families live no where near here or live abroad, no easy answer

[quote toomuchlaundry]@Acidburn have New Zealand got rid of all restrictions? Are all the travel restrictions lifted? Is there any distinction between vaccinated and unvaccinated?[/quote]
At one point my family in NZ had had a year or more of close to normality. (Just travel restrictions.)

But the NZ authorities certainly have not said "just let everyone get it"

They have their traffic light system, are postponing reopening their borders, still quarantining arrivals and will lockdown if needed.

They currently have no detected omicron community spread.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2021/12/21/world/australia/new-zealand-omicron-response.amp.html

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2021/dec/21/new-zealand-delays-border-reopening-in-bid-to-strengthen-defences-against-omicron

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/new-zealand-covid-vaccines-omicron-b1979900.html%3famp

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/omicronfree-new-zealand-celebrates-christmas-without-curbs-101640402458211-amp.html

I'm a retail manager and staff are obligated to isolate if they contract covid ..

Don't want the staff in infecting everyone else

We are 5 staff down today and busier than we thought. We are rushed off our feet already stressed, day one after the Xmas 'break'

@Youarefakenews the issue is many families work full time. I can’t take my parents in as I’m not home and can’t afford to give up my career… also don’t want to end my career. Probably selfish but true for many.

[quote Acidburn]@Blubells lots of people are scared, yes. Mostly because of possible restrictions and no furlough this time.[/quote]
Where's your proof of this?

Or is that just your opinion?

@FangsForTheMemory proof of what? That lots of people are scared? Or that there won't be any furlough this time?

[quote AlaskaThunderfuckHiiiiiiiii]@Youarefakenews I see where you are coming from but I’m not sure how this will become reality, especially for those whose elderly relatives have dementia and cannot be left alone, caring for relatives would rely on someone giving up work or reducing hours which isn’t going to happen with rising prices, I know myself I wouldn’t be able to care for my relatives with working in nursing so not sure what the answer is but I think opening the closed community hospitals (many staff redeployed at the start of covid who could go back) and paying carers more with better incentives may help[/quote]
There are of course a lot of elderly people that need care that cannot be provided at home. But there are a lot who need a degree of care, as an example someone who has had a fall and needs someone to make meals and ensure they take their medication. A great many of these have carers attending twice a day. If these people were being cared for by their family, it frees up resources for the more serious cases.

I agree wholeheartedly more community hospital places would make a massive difference also. As well as paying carers a wage they deserve.

[quote Acidburn]@PAFMO so maybe in this case we should stop isolating all together? We don't isolate if we get flu - we take some paracetamol, otrivin spray and crack on. Not everyone with Omicron will have fever, it might be just runny nose and a bit of sore throat, why do we have to isolate for that?[/quote]
Maybe YOU don't isolate with the flu. That doesn't go for everyone.

If my colleagues or I go into work with a cold, flu, stomach bug, or pretty much anything contagious, we run the risk of seriously harming the lovely and vulnerable people we support. That's pretty much the opposite of our job. So if we have symptoms (of anything) we work from home.

[quote Acidburn]@toomuchlaundry all my info is from a friend who lives there. She says that 90 percent of people are vaccinated. The government said - no jab = no job, maybe thats why. They are required to do boosters every 3 months. No self isolation, nothing like that. They were told its a common cold now, so better for everyone to get it and be finished with it. No idea regarding travel restrictions, but I can ask.[/quote]
Someone is misinformed.

Here is the much lower current level of FULL vaccination in NZ (hover your mouse over NZ on map).

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/world/covid-vaccinations-tracker.html

Covid came a little later to NZ, giving them chance to prepare, lock down instantly and isolate the first cases.. Which their geography/location made possible. As a result their covid count is tiny compared to the northern hemisphere and UK

NZ has had a total of
13,899 infections and 50 coronavirus-related deaths since the pandemic began.

which may explain why they have been relatively relaxed and not panicking.

But as their fully boosted 3- vaccination rate is pretty low compared to UK, now Omicron is circulating in NZ it may still hit them pretty hard.

I’m unvaxxed as are several people I know including my elderly parents. We’ve all had COVID, me pretty severely, but none of us have used any medical care and we’re all absolutely fine. I think the demonisation of unvaxxed is misplaced. We’re being used as a reason for ongoing restrictions due to a cold! Why would unvaccinated people need hospital treatment for a cold?

@Queenzoopla

And I'm sick sick sick of this "NHS will be overwhelmed" business : if the government had been funding the NHS properly it wouldn't be "overwhelmed" would it.

Yes, it would, because that is the process of pandemics.
ANY health system has a finite number of buildings, beds, staff. When unprecedented circumstances produce a flood of additional inpatients, and staff infections reduce the number available to work, no system has enough resilience to take up the slack. While still maintaining the usual services.

Nurses and doctors take years to train so the supply can't just be re-stocked like goods on supermarket shelves.

@NeedAHoliday2021 this was the point I was trying to make, in an ideal world we would still be back years ago when people had time to care for relatives but we don’t live in that world. Fortunately as it was predominantly women who care for the relatives and we don’t want to take that step backwards. I wouldn’t be able to care for a relative even if it was short term with working shifts. Not to mention many many people don’t get on with their families and it can’t be just expected