Someone somewhere needs to articulate the lost quality of life

[Gguin]

Firstly, I am not saying I think there shouldn't be restrictions as needed, masks, reduced social contact. I do. Just to reemphasise that, to prevent people misreading the title, I support and abide and have abided by restrictions, both statutory and advised.
I also hated every single second of the lockdown. I hated what it did to friends. I hated the disregard of single people. I hated the criminalisation of social lives. I hated the lost opportunities for young and not so young people to build or change their lives. I hated the paranoia and judgmentalism. I hated the NHS worship and everyone else can go hang.
And yes I hate this feeling, somewhere between anxiety, depression and a grinding underlying fear of future regret on all that has been lost. I drove past a pub in rural Ireland where I live today and it was shut, boarded up and probably will never reopen. The sign "craic agus ceoil" (laughter and music) was worn and frayed, like a relic of the times when we were able to enjoy themselves with abandon.
All I would like as the latest chapter of shit unfolds is for someone, somewhere to actually articulate the sadness of all the lost opportunities. The friends that have never been made, the months and years spent indoors, the catastrophic toll on mental health and above all this awful feeling that the many of the very things that make life worth living are so expendable and in some quarters, not even mourned.

Pre Covid if anyone had said they were keeping their (healthy) child shut up in the house for the entire school holidays there would have been cries of abuse.
Now its normal.

Yes, and two years ago there was so much fretting over teens spending all their time online and forgetting how to interact in real life.

Now we're telling them that 'learning' online is 'just as good' as the real thing, and that so long as their education is 'delivered' to them via a computer, they've no reason to complain if they are missing out on so many life experiences.

Makes me feel ill how easily that was pushed.

Yeah ☹️

I'm so grateful for this thread and hearing other people's experiences. I feel like we've all been forced to accept and normalise things that are far from normal instead of being allowed to reflect on how bad things are and grieve for what we've lost.

DD had repeated isolations and that, combined with other restrictions meant she missed loads of important Y6 experiences. No residential, no chance to perform their leavers play, they did their assembly in individual videos from home. It broke my heart watching that. I've seen people on here say but at least you haven't got covid etc in response to similar but my DC have lost 3 GPs in the last few years anyway to non-covid things.

I remember seeing an advert early on saying we're staying apart now so when we get back together no-one is missing. We knew at that point MIL was terminally ill and wouldn't be able to see her again.

This thread is incredible.

I've also nominated for Classics.

It needs to be saved.

I couldn’t stand everything moving to zoom. We had a “party” over zoom.

Imagine a party where there is no atmosphere, nobody makes an effort (because what was the point in getting out of your pyjamas), there is no eye contact, everyone talks over each other or suddenly mutes (but there’s nothing good to talk about in a lockdown anyway).

It was incredibly shit and wasn’t a real social interaction. I didn’t feel like I had seen my friends.

So glad I’m not alone in feeling like this.

@iBrows

I couldn’t stand everything moving to zoom. We had a “party” over zoom.

Imagine a party where there is no atmosphere, nobody makes an effort (because what was the point in getting out of your pyjamas), there is no eye contact, everyone talks over each other or suddenly mutes (but there’s nothing good to talk about in a lockdown anyway).

It was incredibly shit and wasn’t a real social interaction. I didn’t feel like I had seen my friends.

So glad I’m not alone in feeling like this.

I did a few Zoom 'get togethers' last year.

I felt miserable every time. Far from feeling like I had met with my friends, it just reminded me how abnormal this was. Normally we'd be out having fun, maybe getting dressed up, eyeing up the talent, bumping into other friends and so on. Here we were just squares on a screen. Nobody is ever going to convince me it's anything more than an emergency substitute at best.

This thread 😭. My goodness. It's unlocked and articulated so much that I just haven't been able to express. Thank you.

I'm thoroughly in agreement with the poster who said there needs to be a website or place online or somewhere where people can actually get together to record their thoughts on all this, without censure. Day you are a person who has lost someone during this to Covid. Does this stop you empathising from someone who is lonely but not bereaved in the traditional sense?
It is as if people are afraid that empathy is a scarce resource and if it is being used up on someone there'll be none left for them. The result of this of course is a self fulfilling prophecy, because people start to fear their voice not being heard so much that they kind of think that if they show empathy their own suffering will be minimised

I live in Ireland, a country which has a recent history of cover ups of the most appalling behaviour imaginable. I was talking to someone about the apparent tolerance of this by the population in the past. She said she reckons what happened is that people were faced with a choice.

1. Choose to believe that the priests who were accused of sexually abusing children, or the nuns who beat and humiliated single mothers were (in some cases) guilty and they had been preached to and controlled by criminals
2. Choose to believe the accusations were all false and a sign of the evil of the world and cleave to the old certainties

Most people chose 2 not because they were bad people but because it was just too hard to face the awful truth. Until the weight of evidence became so overwhelming that the edifice of lies was washed away.

With this, yes it is different but also with one similarity. If you're a person with relative privilege either economic or social, well isn't it easier to question and shut down and say "world war 2, NHS, Captain Tom" over and over again rather than listening to others pain. And of course when you listen to others pain the next step, perhaps the most painful of all, is confronting your own pain

@Gguin

I'm thoroughly in agreement with the poster who said there needs to be a website or place online or somewhere where people can actually get together to record their thoughts on all this, without censure. Day you are a person who has lost someone during this to Covid. Does this stop you empathising from someone who is lonely but not bereaved in the traditional sense? It is as if people are afraid that empathy is a scarce resource and if it is being used up on someone there'll be none left for them. The result of this of course is a self fulfilling prophecy, because people start to fear their voice not being heard so much that they kind of think that if they show empathy their own suffering will be minimised

I live in Ireland, a country which has a recent history of cover ups of the most appalling behaviour imaginable. I was talking to someone about the apparent tolerance of this by the population in the past. She said she reckons what happened is that people were faced with a choice.

1. Choose to believe that the priests who were accused of sexually abusing children, or the nuns who beat and humiliated single mothers were (in some cases) guilty and they had been preached to and controlled by criminals
2. Choose to believe the accusations were all false and a sign of the evil of the world and cleave to the old certainties

Most people chose 2 not because they were bad people but because it was just too hard to face the awful truth. Until the weight of evidence became so overwhelming that the edifice of lies was washed away.

With this, yes it is different but also with one similarity. If you're a person with relative privilege either economic or social, well isn't it easier to question and shut down and say "world war 2, NHS, Captain Tom" over and over again rather than listening to others pain. And of course when you listen to others pain the next step, perhaps the most painful of all, is confronting your own pain

OP that was me who suggested that. I am Irish too and I totally echo what you say re clerical abuse denial and cover up. The church was the most important institution in Ireland and it's not that long ago that people who pushed against it especially in the political domain (think Noel Browne) were cast out and ostracised which is mirrored today in the way people are cancelled sometimes for just trying to articulate an alternative narrative to the lockdowns. There has been no political will to take in to account the huge trauma of lockdown, and the public health authorities both here and in uk and across Europe have been scandalously silent too. Maybe we should set something up/start a movement website or campaign to highlight this...🤔 I think that would be a good thing to do, and much needed, just like this thread has been.

There was a project during WW2 wasn't there for ordinary people to diary their experiences (sorry for another ww2 reference!)

Victoria Wood was in a drama about one. Was it called Housewife, 49? It was beautifully sad. She was unhappily married and her only son away in the army. No Blitz Spirit just drudge and very quietly sad.

@MrsDeaconClaybourne

There was a project during WW2 wasn't there for ordinary people to diary their experiences (sorry for another ww2 reference!)

Victoria Wood was in a drama about one. Was it called Housewife, 49? It was beautifully sad. She was unhappily married and her only son away in the army. No Blitz Spirit just drudge and very quietly sad.

Housewife 49, I watched it on youtube the other day. Brilliant film

Thanks I will check that out. I feel a Big Idea coming on - OP you've sparked something here ❤️

isn't it easier to question and shut down and say "world war 2, NHS, Captain Tom" over and over again rather than listening to others pain. And of course when you listen to others pain the next step, perhaps the most painful of all, is confronting your own pain

I understand what you are saying but I feel there has to be balance with this. Acknowledging pain is different to dwelling on it and focusing on it so much that anything positive doesn't even register. Which magnifies the pain and suffering making it the predominant experience in life. Now, I acknowledge fully I really do not like to dwell on negative stuff and this is why. Focusing on pain is like reliving it.

And the empathy point? Yes, to a certain extent. However, with emotional empathy a person loses themselves and takes on somebody else's pain. This can be very destructive. The suffering becomes like a contagion. I prefer the compassionate empathy model whereby the empathiser can acknowledge the pain but also do something positive to alleviate the suffering. The only problem is for compassionate empathy to be effective it involves the person on the receiving end. They have to want to let go of some of the pain and accept the help to do this the empathiser is offering. It is risky as you risk offending the person on the receiving end when they don't want to be helped out of their situation. Unsolicited help or advice is rarely welcome. However how much of this comes from a genuine motive born out of compassion? (And posters taking offence is what I am risking here but in a hope towards better understanding).

My advice is if you don't want help or advice then don't vent or complain because someone will try to help or find a solution for you. Does venting require an audience?

My advice is if you don't want help or advice then don't vent or complain because someone will try to help or find a solution for you. Does venting require an audience?

@glimpsing the thing is that the very act of venting can in itself be helpful and even healing. That feeling that one is heard, just listened to and heard, is a comfort in itself. I don't expect anyone to help me or fix how I feel or make me feel more positive, but the very experience of being able to share my pain and trauma lifts some of my burden.

"My advice is if you don't want help or advice then don't vent or complain because someone will try to help or find a solution for you. Does venting require an audience?"

Yes venting does require an audience, otherwise it's just screaming in to the void.

I have no issue with people voicing how they feel, and have appreciated the thread.

I can’t see a downside in this for me.

No one has tried to provide advice (except ironically the post that warns this will happen) and I’m not dwelling,

Good to offload though, better than the last year or so on here where a range of views have been massively stifled.

I don't expect anyone to help me or fix how I feel or make me feel more positive, but the very experience of being able to share my pain and trauma lifts some of my burden.

And this can be the thing most difficult for people. Literally sharing the pain. It's got a hopeless ring to it. You offload and feel better but the person on the receiving end might be left feeling worse as they can't help, just watch and witness your suffering. And if you are suffering they might find themselves in the same situation and not be able to do anything about it. It's frightening isn't it? The your suffering does become like a contagion. Unless the person on the receiving end is very used to moving forward themselves and not focusing on the pain.

Glimpsing I don’t agree.

We’re just sharing on a forum and I’m not suffering reading other people’s posts - but appreciating a common theme.

Did you do a course on this stuff or read a book?

This thread is going beautifully UNTIL someone comes along telling everyone what they're allowed to feel or how to express those feelings.

It smacks of trying to shut down this debate.

Kindly bugger off.

@glimpsing

I don't expect anyone to help me or fix how I feel or make me feel more positive, but the very experience of being able to share my pain and trauma lifts some of my burden.

And this can be the thing most difficult for people. Literally sharing the pain. It's got a hopeless ring to it. You offload and feel better but the person on the receiving end might be left feeling worse as they can't help, just watch and witness your suffering. And if you are suffering they might find themselves in the same situation and not be able to do anything about it. It's frightening isn't it? The your suffering does become like a contagion. Unless the person on the receiving end is very used to moving forward themselves and not focusing on the pain.

Well I think the responses on this thread contradict your theory better than I ever could.

Also using the word contagion in respect of people's feelings and lived experiences during a pandemic is beyond insensitive imo

It is interesting to see how badly some people want to shut down these conversations though

And funnily enough I don't like to be on the receiving end of very much of emotional empathy. It feels intrusive, head tilting and mawkish. The NHS were very good at picking this up during my cancer treatment a few years back. I do have to keep myself in check, though, talking to a fellow patient I was friendly with I realised my least favourite HCP was her favourite. She expressed how lovely and understanding she thought she was when I felt she was overly 'head tilting' and a bit mawkish. I preferred the more jokey smiling HCPs. I didn't share this though, don't think my views there would have been appreciated.

@glimpsing

You may be well-meaning but you come across as deeply patronising.

It's been explained to you several times that those of us who have chosen to post here appreciate the space to share our feelings. You really have to business telling us how to feel or how to post.

With all due respect, who do you think you are?

@glimpsing venting your problems to someone who just listens without shutting you down or telling you what to do is what happens in many types of therapy, which people find healing.

Don’t ruin the thread, people are stating that it is helping them.