The tragic news of this Omicron death

[User135644]

Very sad news that someone has now died of Omicron. Are the media going over the top though? I always thought a death was likely at some point. Sadly they may not he the last either.

Is it just the old adage of one death a tragedy, many deaths a statistic?

@RunningInTheWind

It has been said this person was 94 years old and already in hospital.

Potentially wouldn’t have been having another full 20 years of life.

Really? Ok 94

I'd also like to be informed if it was hospital acquired but we won't be.

No @MaxNormal - it’s not a case of one day something being unacceptable and next day it’s ok. Dismissing a potential 75000 deaths as not newsworthy - is still an offensive things to say IMO. Think it’s sad we’ve got to a situation where that amount doesn’t matter anymore, with an assumption that they were either elderly/poorly anyway - so long as the rest of us are ok.
It sounds like a ‘survival of the fittest’ type agenda - which, is NOT something our two main political parties are supporting (Tories maybe more so).

@Beadebaser I genuinely think you have confused my post with someone else's. Literally the only comment I made on the other thread was questioning whether the single death with omicron should have been breaking news.
There was discuss about the 75K number but I wasn't contributing to it.

When did we get to a point where people think it’s acceptable that people die in ICU gasping for air? But write those people off as being old/vulnerable - so it’s not important?

@Beadebaser

When did we get to a point where people think it’s acceptable that people die in ICU gasping for air? But write those people off as being old/vulnerable - so it’s not important?

What deaths do you think are acceptable then?

Not many deaths are pleasant and peaceful unfortunately.

Hope I did misunderstand @maxnormal. Apologies if that’s the case.

Whoever it is, and whatever their circumstances, I'm feeling increasingly icky about the way politicians, media and people on forums on all sides of the argument are using this person's death as a point-scoring exercise.

One person's death is, presumably, sad at a personal level for their family and friends (although not all deaths are sad) but purely from a statistical or medical standpoint, not anything we can attach significant meaning to one way or the other.

Old people die. That is a fact. Or isn’t it? There seem to be people who are convinced that every death is avoidable. What a crowded planet we would be if death were to be “cured”. And what a miserable “life” for those condemned to the purgatory of senility for eternity.

@Getyourarseofffthequattro - preventable deaths are unacceptable?

And how many people yesterday died of; cancer, MND, suicide or road accidents.

[quote Beadebaser]@Getyourarseofffthequattro - preventable deaths are unacceptable?[/quote]
Well I assume quote a lot of deaths are preventable but in reality many aren't prevented because of circumstance.

If you do enough "preventing" Im sure you could keep lots of people alive a bit longer but is that always a good idea? Absolutely not.

Being alive and living are not the same thing.

Mil’s death was prevented on a few occasions. Her care home sent her off to hospital with infections, she was pumped full of antibiotics and back she came for more years of lying in a bed, not knowing anyone and crying with distress. In spite of a DNR she was kept going as she could be treated. Her death was not a tragedy. Prolonging her life was.

@DottyHarmer but there appears to be a ‘brush off’ - they were old anyway. So they don’t matter. They do. Every life has meaning. I wouldnt want my elderly mum to catch Covid, die in ICU alone. Or anyone else’s elderly relatives. But then this thinking tends to extent to the vulnerable too. Hence ‘survival of the fittest’.

*extend

What about the tragic preventable deaths due to missed cancer operations, scans, suicides, people too scared to go to hospital and GP's then dying at home.

When did the NHS become the National Covid Service.

It is borderline criminal that all other services are being cancelled and the kitchen sink thrown at this virus.

Yes a covid death is tragic, however, we need to add some propotianlity to this.

[quote Beadebaser]@DottyHarmer but there appears to be a ‘brush off’ - they were old anyway. So they don’t matter. They do. Every life has meaning. I wouldnt want my elderly mum to catch Covid, die in ICU alone. Or anyone else’s elderly relatives. But then this thinking tends to extent to the vulnerable too. Hence ‘survival of the fittest’.[/quote]
Absolutely nobody has said they don't matter. Of course they matter. Would I be heartbroken if my elderly relative died? Of course. Would it be tragic? No. Because we know it will happen in the near future because people aren't immortal. Would I expect anyone else to be outraged depending on what killed them? No. Would it be equally as sad if they died of anything else? Yes, it would.

I’m not sure what publishing more death statistics daily would achieve?

I'd have thought that was obvious, Cornettoninja, in that context gives the kind of balance so badly lacking ATM

The death of a 94yo is sad for that family. Countrywide it's a daily occurrence and only made the news because they had omicron at the time. Otherwise let's be honest, majority of people would be saying 'oh that was a good innings!' rather than viewing it as a tragedy - and rightly so. 94 IS a good innings.

the issue here is there are people with OMI in hospital if we have significant hospital spread this will result in HCP contracting it. Even if they are not ill themselves they will be unable to work which will have a significant implication to all medical care. this impacts the whole of society.
Patients in hospital but not terminal will either be returned to care homes carrying it which will cause problems in care homes or be kept in hospital taking up beds.
If hospitals are busy - care will be limited and ill people who would have rcovered wont get the care they need

this isnt a black and white situation its very complex

@fromdownwest - but then does that mean that ICU beds should be freed up to treat cancer patients? What do you do with the elderly/vulnerable patients with Covid? Deny them treatment in ICU?

I think there's a big difference between being callous about elderly and clinically vulnerable people, and being realistic about how risk factors will vary across different population groups.

Don't forget that scared people seek to reassure themselves first and foremost, too. Sometimes that comes with clumsy language. It doesn't mean they genuinely don't care. It just means they phrased something badly in the moment.

[quote Beadebaser]@fromdownwest - but then does that mean that ICU beds should be freed up to treat cancer patients? What do you do with the elderly/vulnerable patients with Covid? Deny them treatment in ICU?[/quote]
Non comparable - Cancer treatment is not in ICU.
However, they are re directing resources from Cancer Wards (nurses, consultants tec) to deliver boosters. In addition, they are cancelling appoitments based on a risk factor, which is disproporinate to the alternative risk.
Also, ICU always run at near capacity this time of year, there is no evidence at all that shows Omnicron is any more lethal, if anything evidence suggests it is less lethan than Delta.
More transmissiable, yes, lethal no.

They died WITH omicron it’s been in every press release. They could have died of cancer or been hit by a bus.

Their cause of death has not been published.