Furlough to return ?

[Henrieta2]

Do you think furlough will return ?
I’m worried 😟 how can they tell peoooe to wfh and potentially have people lose jobs because if everyone wfh how can hospitality / cafes / cleaners go to work ???

@Tryagainplease

Yeah, so basically everyone working from gone again will force canteens to shut, office cleaners won’t be able to work, businesses that reply on passing trade won’t need as many staff but there is NO furlough?? So what do those people do? Just lose their jobs?

Very valid and interesting point tbh. I suppose with no govt furlough scheme they are expecting business owners to sort themselves or as you say, people will lose their jobs, never nice, but worse time of year. My husband is in aviation sector, luckily military, but so many of our friends have stepped over to civil sector and have lost their jobs. Some are engineers or drivers at amazon etc now, not what they want, but they've had no choice. Luckily there seems to be jobs out there atm... but for how long?

@Fairylights25

No chance of furlough. Zero chance of schools closing. We will carry on in some twilight lockdown with half baked measures and limp on until spring and things improve.

I think this is likely correct.

But realistically do you expect the employer to pay the workforce for doing nothing?*

We pay the Prime Minister...

@Thunderpunt my old work (left due to the unscrupulous culture & practices) had a minimum of £2,000,000 in fraudulent furlough & bounce back loan claims for approx 50 clients (clients just as dodgy & well aware of the situation).

Most of the companies are now being wound up & the Directors are starting again with new companies.

That's just one smallish accountancy practice so I dread to think what the final total of fraud would be.

Sorry @Unphased I don't understand what you are asking me?

[quote JenniferWooley]@Thunderpunt my old work (left due to the unscrupulous culture & practices) had a minimum of £2,000,000 in fraudulent furlough & bounce back loan claims for approx 50 clients (clients just as dodgy & well aware of the situation).

Most of the companies are now being wound up & the Directors are starting again with new companies.

That's just one smallish accountancy practice so I dread to think what the final total of fraud would be.[/quote]
This is horrendous
Why on earth can’t you anonymously whistle blow?

Defaulting on a bounce back when you could pay it back is not something a to be recommended. Certainly not for an entrepreneur

Most banks are taking BBL defaults into consideration for further business loans
Plus it will be pursued in much the same way as any other loan not paid… the bank will use bailiffs, court action etc

@Happy1982ish technically you can but the online form doesn't allow you to provide enough detailed information without leaving your details for follow up & HMRC are not currently accepting fraud reports sent through the post.

I can provide them with full details of at least 30 employers who have fraudulently claimed furlough but not without giving over my own details which I'd rather not do.

I bet there are loads of employers cancelling their Xmas parties now and won't give anything to make up for it. Don't know how businesses are surviving.

[quote JenniferWooley]@Happy1982ish technically you can but the online form doesn't allow you to provide enough detailed information without leaving your details for follow up & HMRC are not currently accepting fraud reports sent through the post.

I can provide them with full details of at least 30 employers who have fraudulently claimed furlough but not without giving over my own details which I'd rather not do.[/quote]
Well then do it

The HMRC is explicit on reporting via the online form

* You do not have to give your personal details, and any information you give will be treated as confidential.*

If furlough was to return, they'd have to create a more robust and fair system. Multi millionaire owners should pay their own employees wages not rely on the taxpayer

The amount of money wasted during furlough was ridiculous and many cases of people taking the p and commiting fraud. I'd have preferred a basic income, as it seems unfair that some people profited e.g. multi millionaires who didn't have top pay their staff, but others lost out.

@Happy1982ish because the online form doesn't give enough space to provide the required info (company name, PAYE references, overview of fraud etc) & they won't accept postal reports - so it's either I make a general report online & give my details for follow up, make over 30 individual reports which would take hours, or call them & I'm not convinced you'd get away without giving your details over the phone.

If there was a way I could hand over a spread sheet with the info without having to give my details I'd have done it by now.

You give what the form permits
And allow Hmrc to investigate further
As simple as that

[quote JenniferWooley]@Happy1982ish because the online form doesn't give enough space to provide the required info (company name, PAYE references, overview of fraud etc) & they won't accept postal reports - so it's either I make a general report online & give my details for follow up, make over 30 individual reports which would take hours, or call them & I'm not convinced you'd get away without giving your details over the phone.

If there was a way I could hand over a spread sheet with the info without having to give my details I'd have done it by now.[/quote]
As long as the money went to rich people that is fine.
They are rich because they are so clever and successful and contribute so much to the country by avoiding paying taxes.

If the money went to poor people that would be a bad thing because they are feckless scroungers and probably foreign.