Covid Child Mortality

[Warhertisuff]

A horrible topic I know, but one which parents have a right to be informed accurately about.

I've read that over 100 children have now died of Covid in the U.K. However, that doesn't seem to square with the stats I can find. The ONS data below suggests that there have been 14 deaths of children under 14 since February, and 4 school aged children under 14 since the start of autumn term. I appreciate the pandemic has been here since before last February but even so.... especially since infections in schools have only really skyrocketed
since summer half term and through into this term.

Obviously all child deaths are tragic, but in order to determine our response, we need to know whether deaths are as prevalent as other diseases such as meningitis or other causes such as traffic accidents, or whether we are talking another level of magnitude.

www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/dvc1470/age/wrapper/datadownload.xlsx

@DumplingsAndStew you have a lot of incorrect information in that post!

The 75% figure has recently been reported in the news/parliamentary discussions iirc.

But it's OK to not test, just to self report that you think you had it, yeah? It doesn't need to be diagnosed based on the official diagnostic process

Where have you got this idea? Do you think this is something I’ve said?

You argue that the vaccines cause lots of side effects, as many people have self-reported them.

Where have I ‘argued’ this? I don’t think I’ve ever said they cause ‘lots of side effects’. Are you denying that they cause any?

Yet you continuously argue that hundreds of thousands of children are being left with longer term effects of covid, because you don't believe in a process by which the numbers are self reported?

What? seriously, have you confused me with another poster? I have no idea what you’re actually talking about here.

so important to not be bundling children with mild symptoms that may or may not be caused by covid with children with severe symptoms that have most definitely been caused by covid.

But how can you determine which is mild and which is severe symptoms? It's really clear that covid results in so many lasting results in different degree, like some people do with other viral infections too. It's a serious mater because the numbers are huge. And mild symptoms that may not be considered serious enough for other people can be debilitating to the people who is suffering.

We don’t determine what is classified as mild/severe. Medical professionals do. They can’t seem to agree on a definition though -

www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)01900-0/fulltext

The simple truth is, no one other than people suffering have to determine if it's severe or not. If the person suffering the symptom thinks it's bad enough, it's bad enough.
Why do we even need to classify if it's truly cause by covid or not? Someone became ill, and had lasting effects from it. They are suffering. And many are after contracting covid. All that matter is to deal with it to ease the pain and suffering, not to figure out if it's caused by covid or not.

At the same time, health-care providers must acknowledge and validate the toll of the persistent symptoms of long COVID on patients

From the Lancet article - also good advice for some people on mumsnet to take

@winterisaroundthecorner

The simple truth is, no one other than people suffering have to determine if it's severe or not. If the person suffering the symptom thinks it's bad enough, it's bad enough. Why do we even need to classify if it's truly cause by covid or not? Someone became ill, and had lasting effects from it. They are suffering. And many are after contracting covid. All that matter is to deal with it to ease the pain and suffering, not to figure out if it's caused by covid or not.

Being able to identify patients that are most at risk (perhaps due to certain genes) and developing new treatments does actually depend on correctly identifying the cases that were caused by covid. No one is trying to make light of any young person who did suffering fatigue, anxiety etc for several months (of course not!) but if their symptoms are not the result of covid then they should not be included with the covid figures. Surely you can understand how that could muddy the data and make it difficult to obtain accurate and useful information?

Who is* suffering fatigue…

No one is trying to make light of any young person who did suffering fatigue, anxiety etc for several months (of course not!) but if their symptoms are not the result of covid then they should not be included with the covid figures.

Do you think they are included with the covid figures? Do you have any understanding of the amount of time parents of kids with long covid spend in doctors appointments, seeing gps and/or consultants? With their kids having blood tests and swabs and scans? Every post shows you have no understanding of this, and just think people are self reporting for shits and giggles. Why? Would you?

@bumbleymummy

Being able to identify patients that are most at risk (perhaps due to certain genes) and developing new treatments does actually depend on correctly identifying the cases that were caused by covid. No one is trying to make light of any young person who did suffering fatigue, anxiety etc for several months (of course not!) but if their symptoms are not the result of covid then they should not be included with the covid figures. Surely you can understand how that could muddy the data and make it difficult to obtain accurate and useful information?

Weird This seems to be the definition of 'tying yourself in knots/bringing up a perverse point to avoid agreeing the other person in a debate'. Of course, in most instances, Covid patients suffering these symptoms over many months should be included in the figures as they are the result of Covid. It doesn't take Einstein to figure that out, and I'm really not sure why you are so anxious to make people think otherwise.

Did both of you miss the massive quote from the pp that I was replying to? She doesn’t seem to think it’s important if the person had COVID or not:

“Why do we even need to classify if it's truly cause by covid or not? Someone became ill, and had lasting effects from it. They are suffering. And many are after contracting covid. All that matter is to deal with it to ease the pain and suffering, not to figure out if it's caused by covid or not.”

I’m pointing out why it is actually important to know.

She doesn’t seem to think it’s important if the person had COVID or not:

Of course I do think it's important to find out the root cause, but that's
the job for doctors and scientist. And I'm sure they are all working on it.
It's not for us , you, me or any MNetter to determine those people are really suffering from covid or not.
Many people/children are suffering from long covid in different degree. That's only thing I, as a parent to know. It could be my child.

Ok, and where have I said that it’s up to us to decide it?

so important to not be bundling children with mild symptoms that may or may not be caused by covid with children with severe symptoms that have most definitely been caused by covid.

Why are you even bringing this up if you aren't? It's not your job, surely?

In response to a pp comments. Maybe you need to go back and read the previous couple of pages?

And, doing this for COVID, specifically, isn’t my job but I have to do it for other things.

I said we don't need to specify. You picked up part of my comment, and said I think it's not important to determine the cause.

Anyways, it really doesn't matter.

But the point is that we do need to specify these things for the reasons I gave above. And my previous post to you said that it’s medical professionals making the decisions so I’m not sure why you would write another post in the context of it having anything to do with us personally.

twitter.com/elisaperego78/status/1439966792760365064?s=21

Oh and 7 kids spent half term dying of covid.