Concerns over visiting UK

[burningfromtheinside]

I'm due to visit UK to see my family soon, haven't been there for two years due to the pandemic. I live in Italy, in the north, in one of the places hit by COVID at the very beginning in Feb 2020, however despite this, I still personally don't know one person who has contracted it, not even the Delta, no one pre and post vaccination. I have a large network of friends and work in large company ( although we're still WFH) Reading here and hearing from plenty of friends in the UK, so many people seem to have had it there, despite being double vaccinated. I don't know if it's because masks are still mandatory here indoors, or that COVID passports are mandatory for nearly everything, but I can't understand why it's so different. This is making me concerned about coming to UK, I feel like I'll catch it there no matter what. The whole family are Pfizer double vaccinated ( most of Italy is Pfizered, could it be this?!) I wonder if a large proportion of people are not vaccinated there or if because the vaccine program was much earlier in the UK, most people are no longer covered ( I'm in my 50s and was vaccinated in June) Anyway does anyone, like me not know a single person who has had COVID or it is just rife there? I should add I also don't know anyone who is not vaccinated here.

I don't know what your friend was doing when he arrived in the UK @Dishhh, but your post suggested that the UK is absolutely rife with Covid and all you have to do is step off a plane and Bam! you're going to get infected.

The reality is that the majority of people getting Covid in the UK right now are teenagers who haven't had the chance to get vaccinated yet (a fact about which I am really fucked off!), and their parents. In all other age groups, Covid infection is really low. Where I live though (just outside London), Covid infection among teens is currently high.

I think in large part it's also media coverage of the UK. Have had a work visitor from another country and you'd think he was about to visit Somalia, with the amount of hyperventilation he was doing about Covid in the UK (he's double vaccinated, too). And I think we don't get the message out there enough that while cases remain relatively high, the vaccines and other measures seem to have broken the link between cases and hospitalisations and/or death - which is good news. And while Covid may be 'ripping' through schools , the reality is that kids, teens etc. are simply not the ones that have ever been putting the NHS under pressure due to Covid.

Depends which nation you mean in UK @EileenGC
In Scotland it is legal requirement to show proof of vaccine for nightclubs, large indoor events and outdoor sporting events like football over a certain size.
So you would be turned away without proof of vaccine, negative test is NOT accepted, must be vaccinated.
It's also law to wear face masks in indoor crowded places and public transport

I find it odd you didn't know anyone who had it tbh, I know lots of people in the badly hit area in Italy and they basically all had it! I also know that our testing system is about 50 million times better than Italy. We are testing approx 1m per day. You can argue about how we are dealing with the positive cases when we find them but we are finding them.

Unless you are planning to hang out in a year 9 maths classroom or similar you'll be ok.

I only know one person who has not taken the vaccine. I know lots of people who have had it. All the recent people are in year 7 at dd's high school (including her!).

*have had it = had covid.

@rookiemere

NZ has lower levels of circulating covid, but we wouldn't be able to have this conversation as no one is able to go there. So OP wouldn't- in that scenario- have the ability to visit her relatives. That's the reality and the trade off.

My cousin is flying into Auckland (I believe) from Singapore tomorrow morning.

Presumably he has the quarantine hotel spaces that were sort after as New Zealand doesn’t distinguish between low levels and high levels so Singapore is no different to UK

They did release the hotel places fairly recently demand outstripped supply by a huge margin

People can fly there if they get a coveted place but it’s more onerous to do hotel quarantine. I know what I’d prefer - slight risk of Covid in U.K. or stuck inside for two weeks.

Plus it’s equally risky and unpredictable if you ask anyone delayed in quarantine or Melbourne etc recently. Higher risk of being caught out I reckon recently

@pommedeterre

I find it odd you didn't know anyone who had it tbh, I know lots of people in the badly hit area in Italy and they basically all had it! I also know that our testing system is about 50 million times better than Italy. We are testing approx 1m per day. You can argue about how we are dealing with the positive cases when we find them but we are finding them.

Unless you are planning to hang out in a year 9 maths classroom or similar you'll be ok.

I only know one person who has not taken the vaccine. I know lots of people who have had it. All the recent people are in year 7 at dd's high school (including her!).

UK tested 800,000 on Monday, Italy just under 400,000. Do the self-administered tests count in the UK? Italy doesn't allow those. I'm in the south of Italy and we have remained pretty untouched by Covid where I am. During the first wave I didn't know anyone with Covid and my town (100,000 people) had 11 cases, all traced back to Milan when the fuckwits fled the night before they closed the regions. 6 of them died.

@Geamhradh

LFTs do count here but only if you register the results. I’ve never bothered nor has anyone I
Know but must have done close to a hundred (as a family) already. I think the number of tests in the UK is vastly underestimated if you consider the amount of LFTs done.

[quote Frazzled2207]@Geamhradh

LFTs do count here but only if you register the results. I’ve never bothered nor has anyone I
Know but must have done close to a hundred (as a family) already. I think the number of tests in the UK is vastly underestimated if you consider the amount of LFTs done.[/quote]
Wow, yes, it must be. I didn't know that. Thanks!

@sartorius

Depends which nation you mean in UK *@EileenGC* In Scotland it is legal requirement to show proof of vaccine for nightclubs, large indoor events and outdoor sporting events like football over a certain size. So you would be turned away without proof of vaccine, negative test is NOT accepted, must be vaccinated. It's also law to wear face masks in indoor crowded places and public transport

I went to theatre today with DD who is 18 and has only had one vaccine so proof of negative test was accepted

@Davros don't think theatres are covered by the Scottish vaccine passport scheme.
It's unseated indoor events, so nightclubs, concerts that sort of thing.

No the lateral flow tests are not counted in the our world in data figures used to compare countries. Only PCR tests and antigen tests are (which the UK doesn't use).The UK really does test a huge amount in comparison. And that's coming from someone who despises our government for many many other reasons!

Italy has been hit worse by coronavirus than the U.K. with more excess deaths per 1000.

@Volhhg

No the lateral flow tests are not counted in the our world in data figures used to compare countries. Only PCR tests and antigen tests are (which the UK doesn't use).The UK really does test a huge amount in comparison. And that's coming from someone who despises our government for many many other reasons!

Totally agree. Having used the pcr system a lot recently in the Uk as dd had covid and also at the same time tried to get a staff member a pcr in Italy I was really very struck by how good our system is in comparison!

@Volhhg

No the lateral flow tests are not counted in the our world in data figures used to compare countries. Only PCR tests and antigen tests are (which the UK doesn't use).The UK really does test a huge amount in comparison. And that's coming from someone who despises our government for many many other reasons!

Yes - it’s why it’s so impossible to compare countries. If we had Italy’s positivity rate here I would be freaking out (rather than feeling mildly worried about current numbers and wishing they’d get the fuck on with teenagers and boosters). But in the context of Italy’s testing rate, it’s not as concerning.

They used to quote the statistics of 1in 3 cases being asymptotic.
Don't know if that's still the case with delta?
But because of our system of testing whole households when there's positive case we must be picking up thousands of asymptomatic cases (likely mainly youngsters) which wouldn't be picked up elsewhere.

Also people who have negative test and still have symptoms, even mild, couple days later go back for another test here and may then be positive.
In other countries, where you book through GP, that's not so easy to do.

I thought antigen was a different name for LFT - are they totally different types of tests then? The antigen test I bought in the French pharmacy looked identical to the nhs LFT.

Other countries test households too - that comes under “close contact testing.” But o agree our positivity rate is probably low because of all the LFT daily testing people do for school, which they don’t have to do abroad, although much of Europe got their secondary kids vaxxed before term started which would have made much more sense here

In Germany we don’t test as much because if you’re vaccinated, you’re good to go about your daily activities. No more need to test for work or school (law-mandated to do it twice-weekly if unvaccinated). So of course the numbers will be lower when it comes to tests. People don’t test for EU travel so less tests there too.

Positivity rate is definitely a bit more useful when comparing countries.

At the same time, you only have to read on here about what happens when one member (let’s say Child 1) of an UK household tests positive. Everyone else, if vaccinated, is advised to get a test and then they can go out. First test comes negative, everyone goes on. A couple of days later mum gets symptoms, she takes a test. Still negative but the symptoms persist. Another day and dad gets symptoms as well. Now everyone takes a test again and the parents are positive. Child 2 still negative but might take another test in a few days to make sure. A family of 4 could be taking 10 tests in less than a week.

Here if you’re positive, you isolate with your household. Doesn’t matter if you’ve had the vaccine. Everyone gets a test a couple of days down the road but that’s it. So 4-5 tests max, for the same situation as above. Of course the numbers are lower.

And yes, antigen is the same as LFT. When a country asks for an antigen test it mostly means that it has be done under supervision - at a pharmacy or test center or your GP.

[quote sartorius]@Davros don't think theatres are covered by the Scottish vaccine passport scheme.
It's unseated indoor events, so nightclubs, concerts that sort of thing.[/quote]
I'm not sure I was clear that we are in England so DD could go to the theatre with a negative LFT because she has only had one vaccination. I am triple vaxed and DH is double vaxed but we still have to do and report negative LFT every time we visit DS in his residential placement, vax is not enough

Positivity rate is definitely a bit more useful when comparing countries.

I don’t think that’s necessarily true - it will depend on the demographics of who’s being tested and therefore how many asymptomatic people in particular are being picked up.

@EileenGC

And yes, antigen is the same as LFT. When a country asks for an antigen test it mostly means that it has be done under supervision - at a pharmacy or test center or your GP.

No this is incorrect they are totally different. You can find this online

@Volhhg LFTs don’t exist where I live - as a name. When you go to buy the multipacks of home tests they are called antigen tests. When you go to the test centre for an antigen test, they use exactly the same tests you can buy in the Lidl next door. The little test thingy, same swab and liquid mixer - or whatever you call those things in English.

Antigen and antibodies though yes. Those are two different things. Antigen and Lateral Flow Tests are the exact same thing.