Whats the big deal with mixing with unvaccinated people?

[ssd]

This is genuine, its nit a debate whether to get the vaccine or not. I personally got them as fast as i could because I'm scared of covid. And i accept others can't due to health reasons and others won't cos they choose not to.

But i keep reading here questions about mixing with unvaccinated people. How others determine this is a mystery to me.

Ive know vaccinated people still catch and spread covid. Having the vaccine doesn't stop that. It just hopefully stops you getting more ill if you catch it. So why the anxiety over mixing with unvaccinated people??
I genuinely dont get it. Has it been proved somewhere that unvaccinated people spread it more??? I've missed it if it has.

I think it's actually an identity politics thing rather than anything rational

At least un vaxxed are more likely to have symptoms- so you would see them coming so to speak. That and the tin foil hats ;-)

@RedRiverShore

Children aren’t vaccinated but there doesn’t seem to be the same fuss and worry about them. Very odd

Unfortunately there is in our family. We went abroad to see family for the first time in nearly two years and my DCs were not allowed indoors and had to stay outdoors in the pissing rain for the crime of being the only people in the whole family too young to be authorised for a vaccine or required to test. And I am not violently assaulting a child with ASD to pacify the anxieties of the worried well.

I will not forget in a hurry.

@MotherOfCrocodiles

I think it's actually an identity politics thing rather than anything rational

At least un vaxxed are more likely to have symptoms- so you would see them coming so to speak. That and the tin foil hats ;-)

It’s a risk assessment thing.

It's really hard to believe that it makes an appreciable difference to transmission when you look at our sky high cases and substantial vax rates. Elephant in the room, but people are desperate to believe it's not the case.

Just going to leave this here to raise awareness if you can't get a vaccine for medical reasons and can't be tested then you can get a Covid Pass by phoning 119. This is thought to also exempt people from having to isolate if they come into close contact with a positive case.

So you could be mixing with unvaccinated people and never be any the wiser.

www.gov.uk/guidance/covid-19-medical-exemptions-proving-you-are-unable-to-get-vaccinated

Why don't people advertise their vaccinated status. It is as useful as a qualification in my opinion

Is this serious....?

I don't have anxiety about mixing with anti-vaxers, I just have no desire to mix with absolute morons.

@MatildaIThink

I don't have anxiety about mixing with anti-vaxers, I just have no desire to mix with absolute morons.

Not being vaccinated doesn't necessarily mean anti vax.

@DressedUpAtAnIvy

People who can get vaccinated but choose not to are telling you something about themselves and their attitude to risk, their social conscience and their understanding of Covid. That makes people trust them less.

It’s not just fear of catching it for some but things like the quote above. Everyone has their own criteria for who they choose to spend time with.

Just like on lockdowns, lots complied snd lots didn’t. Now, many respect shops etc requests for masks but many don’t. I’ve let a few friendships slide as they saw nothing wrong in breaching lockdown and won’t wear a mask to help protect others.

Vaccinated people are less likely to spread it but I don't think it would bother me usually to be near unvaccinated people as I've been vaccinated.
I am however about to have a newborn so no I probably don't want the unvaccinated around such a small baby.

@WoMandalorian

Vaccinated people are less likely to spread it but I don't think it would bother me usually to be near unvaccinated people as I've been vaccinated. I am however about to have a newborn so no I probably don't want the unvaccinated around such a small baby.

"the unvaccinated"????

and just how can tell who exactly these unvaccinated are? Your midwife in the hospital may be unvaccinated. Your health visitor coming to your home may be unvaccinated. You have no way no of knowing. For example the Health Visitor may not be able to be vaccinated for medical reasons and because of this is entitled to a Covid Pass just like someone who is vaccinated. The Health Visitor is under no obligation to disclose her medical info to you at any stage. If asked the Health Visitor can just show her Covid Pass.

None of us are going to have any way of knowing who is vaccinated and who is not unless the person directly tells us.

I think it's disingenuous to talk about those who cannot be vaccinated in the group who are unvaccinated by choice because the numbers who genuinely cannot have the vaccine for medical reasons are very, very small.

Health visitors and midwives will, at least, be wearing PPE and so will the patient so hopefully that reduces transmission spmewhat if they are unvaccinated

I don’t care about who is/isn’t vaccinated. I am healthy/early 20s and have only just had my 2nd jab; due to age restrictions on the vaccine initially & my own reservations. The vaccine doesn’t benefit me much, it benefits others so I undertook it for the sake of everyone else and for the sake of moving on with life. I can see why people may want to wait before going ahead.

I am a “key worker” so worked through the entirety of the pandemic whilst “mixing with the unvaccinated”. I never caught covid so being vaccinated now doesn’t fundamentally change anything for me. I don’t feel more safe nor do I feel scared of “the unvaccinated”. I’m just continuing exactly as I was before

Itsgrand- sure you won’t know and people may lie. But in general most nice people understand concerns for health reasons. if you have to see a medical person because you need their help or a check up, that may be unavoidable and they will generally wear ppe - you are only with them for a short time.

But if you have a large extended family you could reduce visits, ask if they are vaccinated, ask if they have attended large gatherings, request LFT, if not then arrange an outdoor meeting or request PPE. At least until baby is a bit bigger and settled.

Just because 1 thing doesn’t stop something 100%, doesn’t make it useless.
There’s a Swiss cheese model which is quite helpful:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-40ac92b1-1750-4e86-9936-2cda6b0acb3f

One of our (adult) children is not vaccinated. He's not an anti- vaccine, doesn't believe any tin pot theories about the vaccine, but is very angry with the government over Covid and refuses to get one as he feels it is giving the state too much control over people's health. I'm not saying it's logical, but that is the way he feels.

He was complying with all the rules at first, but became incandescent over the Dominic Cummings/Barnard Castle issue and the way DC. was protected by the government.

He hasn't ruled out having the vaccine but at the moment isn't having it. In some ways I think it's a bit "I would have chosen it but now I'm being told I have to have it, I wont".

All the rest of the family have been vaccinated.

@itsgrand I know, that's why I said "probably" won't be around unvaccinated people. People can lie. You just have to hope people wouldn't want to put a tiny newborn at risk, whether from cold sores, flu, measles or Covid.

I feel like we aren't being given choices.

Or rather that we are, but they are:

Get vaccinated
Or
Don't get vaccinated, you can't do half the stuff in your life you want to, oh and you can't possibly care about other people if you don't have it.

This includes our children too. Will they no longer be allowed to go to University without it?

I wasn't giving my consent for my teens to have it next week but now in two minds after a local 15 year old girl tested positive on the Friday and died on the monday with no other health concerns.

It feels like we are stuck between a rock and a hard place.

I couldn't care less whether or not the people I mix with are vaccinated. It's their private health information and none of my business.

I got vaccinated to reduce my personal risk of serious illness from Covid and to do my bit to protect the nation as a whole. When out in public or at work, I am not worried about catching Covid from unvaccinated people so in that sense it's none of my business. On a personal/friendship level, however, I don't really want to mix with people who are perfectly happy to leave it to everyone else to reduce covid pressure on the NHS whilst they don't bother.

@OliveTree75

Why don't people advertise their vaccinated status. It is as useful as a qualification in my opinion

Is this serious....?

I am in India right now and everybody from cab drivers and food delivery guys to hair salons are advertising their vaxxed status. You may call this Big Brother and argue it is not consistent with British values of privacy and bodily autonomy, and you may be right. However , I like it this way and am continuing to frequent establishments that advertise their vaxxed status.

People are relying far too much on the vaccine. Also a lot of younger adults haven’t all been double jabbed because of the way it was rolled out. So the high rates of unvaccinated aren’t all due to hesitancy! I wish people would remember that. For example where I live, I only got offered my first in august. My second - I’ve not yet had because I was on holiday (locally), then they closed the vaccine centre and the nearest one I could not reach. Then I got ill so had to isolate. Hoping to get a walk in next week - but there are no vaccine centres in my town and I have not been able to get petrol!

There are plenty in a lower age bracket who are probably only single jabbed.

Also the vaccines are wearing off. They’re not as effective after a few months but boosters aren’t yet rolling out. So people being complacent and not protecting others by wearing a mask, not avoiding crowded indoor places etc could end up catching it this winter.

Winter could be a bit of a shit storm because people are far too blasé about being double jabbed. I’m hoping the boosters get rolled out ASAP!!

@User5490453456

They might start shedding their stupidity.

🤣🤣 good one, how do you know if someone is anti vaxx, they tell you over and over again, they attempt to get others into their conspiracy shit, that's how.

Something to consider.....

If the vaccine is only 70% effective, why are so many giving up their masks?

If the contraceptive pill was only 70% effective, we would all use condoms too!

@duffeldaisy

For me, it's not just a Mumsnet thing. A member of my family is choosing to stay unvaccinated ("but being careful") and so the rest of us are not going to be meeting them in person for the forseeable because we don't want to risk it.

Hello duffeldaisy.

I have a few questions for you and those who agree with you.

You’ve already said that you won’t mix with a non-compliant family member. Would this, hypothetically, be the case even with beloved family members (sons, daughters, parents) and long-term friends? People you have known in the past to be decent, caring, intelligent people but have now suddenly made themselves untouchable due to their decision not to comply?

If they came too close to you, how do you react? Do you flinch and move away? Would you yell at them? Scold them? If they come to your door, would you let them in? If they ask for help in a non-health related matter, would you deny them that help? If they could help YOU with a problem you have, would you still refuse to contact them?

If in future the jab became absolutely mandatory for everyone, and you knew they weren’t jabbed, would you call the police?

Should their unjabbed children be removed from their households, and forcibly jabbed? Even newborns?

Do you think their unjabbed children should not be given an education?

Should they be denied medical treatment? What if they fall ill (not CV related) and need a life-saving operation; should they be refused this unless they get a jab?

Would you be happy if they lost their jobs? If they cannot shop for food? If they need a jab certificate to remove their money from the bank?

If they were renting their home, do you think they should be evicted by their landlords?

Should they be removed from society?

Would you be happy if they were jailed?

Would you support them being thrown into detention camps?

Should they be taken into centres and forcibly jabbed?

Would you even support them being killed?

And let’s take this a bit further.

As of this writing, a booster jab is being rolled out. Let’s say some of the double-jabbed decide not to take it, and they too are now classified as “unvaccinated”. And let's say you take it. Would you treat this new category of unjabbed as above?

Suppose this continues, with a new booster every few months, over years. Do you think it’s right for those people who have had a booster, to shun those who haven’t, because they are now unjabbed?

All of the above mentioned measures have been adopted, or at least been evaluated as a possible measure, or been publicly advocated as necessary, in one country or the other, so they are not as outlandish as they might seem.

Yes, even the desire to see them killed.