Is it ok we are just letting our kids get Covid?

[Moonopoly]

DD5 has just tested positive for Covid. There have been several cases in her Year 1 class but school remains the same. Under the old rules the ‘bubble’ would have closed and she would perhaps have stood some chance of not getting it.
Is it ok that we are letting the government pursue a herd immunity policy with a novel virus amongst our kids?
We seem to be the only country doing this?

But it isn't just deaths.

It is the disruption to education, which the CMO used as a major rationale for vaccines in 12-15s.

Unvaccinated kids getting covid and missing lessons/ mocks/ exams.

Teachers getting ill.

The threat of school closing.

Some pupils being off for weeks or months at a crucial time.

And also it would be much nicer for the kids if

their parents and siblings were less likely to get ill

the health service functioned better

we weren't quite so likely to have a Plan B generally

@herecomesthsun we sadly dont seem to have a Plan B for anything at the moment. The problem is not only do we not have an effective Government those that arent in Government seem even less effective. If you cant even manage a party conference then how can you manage this

And of course we should be looking at those things - vaccinations in particular should have been rolled out before. DD (12) has been vaccinated and her brother just had Covid and she didnt and I think a previous infection plus vaccine was good enough to avoid.

But we also have to remember that mitigations we put in place do have negative aspects - it is creating a balance and I think some posters (not you) are so focussed on Covid above all else that gets forgotten

I do also think we need to manage our own risks a little as well and not totally rely in the goverment
As a family we all still wear masks in shops etc and we try and maintain 2 m with strangers
We haven't had huge indoor gatherings and we test with lvt's both kids in college , they have to wear a mask walking around inside college as well so guess they are free to make there own rules.
We wash hands regularly and do out best to avoid , whilst accepting to some degree that we will catch it eventually
Despite all this we have been having a round of cough, colds and viruses for arund 8 weeks now
Older ds has had a cough for over 2 weeks , negative for covid , gp even tested for glandular fever and again negative, yet he can't shift it as I think our immune systems are just not up to speed with all isolating we have done

I don't think people are saying they want no risk. I think they are asking for a more palatable level of risk, rather than a guarantee of catching covid at school, with the knock on effects to physical and mental health, economy, education, life chances, recovery etc.

Well it depends what mitigations people want.
We have masks in Scottish schools - doesn't appear to have reduced transmission much, but who knows.
Keeping windows open where possible is fine.
Air filtration costs and takes time.
Distancing results in pupils receiving part time education.
Isolating bubbles for 10 days means pupils miss loads of education and may not even have Covid.
I have no issues with 12-15 year olds being vaccinated but it's a very marginal call.

If I was CEV or had a CEV child I'd feel very differently about this I'm sure, Unfortunately at some point pragmatism for the many has to take place.

@MarshaBradyo

I think it’s the last few standing wanting to impose measures

Most are happy with being back and it going better than many predicted on here

Well the fb page for my daughter's school has lots of parents asking for the school to bring in measures. At the moment they have none and loads of kids and teachers off sick with covid.

One parent has disclosed they've had a transplant so are unlikely to get much response to the vaccine and their consultant has advised against going out - meanwhile their son in school has no mitigations at all which he finds stressful given he knows how poorly his parent could be.

Most parents I know with kids in UK state schools want at a minimum ventilation and air filtration (of which there is currently none). People with kids in schools see how many kids (and teachers) are already missing lots of school with every indication it's going to get worse.

@beentoldcomputersaysno

I don't think people are saying they want no risk. I think they are asking for a more palatable level of risk, rather than a guarantee of catching covid at school, with the knock on effects to physical and mental health, economy, education, life chances, recovery etc.

But what is a palatable level of risk and what mitigations would actually achieve that. Most of them would be about delaying it and simply spreading it out to something more manageable in order to not close down schools or impact the NHS

Because it isnt a guarantee anyway. The outbreak at DS school hasnt hit everyone or indeed spread it all families?

By the way I am not saying mitigations are wrong its just that we have to be careful in what we do and whether it works. I hugged a Covid + DS for 3 nights and sat in the same room for the majority of 10 days - I didnt get it (vaccinated and previous infection). DS was the last of the household to get it. My Mum saw DS briefly on the Sunday and caught it.

Delaying a bit till school vaccinations and boosters might make quite a difference though.

Masks in school (for kids 12+ who can wear them) is one way, for example.

Air filtration does cost and take time, but other countries have managed. The knock on effects of not putting them in also cost time, money, loss of education and health.

Schools are a safe space for many vulnerable, why not try to make them safer? Why are we also ignoring physically vulnerable families?

Emperor it’s very different here but even when mn was at its most panicky etc the school and parents were quite different. By now people are happy to be back normally.

It has been a few weeks and hospitalisation is down that is certainly better than many predicted.

Btw why do you think we won’t follow Scotland and peak in school age cases after a similar time frame?

Really all there is is masks for 12 plus.

My dc wear them in corridors so we’re talking about the classroom. For the slight delay they bring I’m glad they can access lessons without them now.

Delaying a bit till school vaccinations and boosters might make quite a difference though.

What specifically would it achieve and what would the impact be? That’s how we need to look at it.

Agree it doesn't always make sense who is affected and who isn't. I know elderly who have handled it better than much younger people who previously were doing triathalons. Others, the whole household has gone down with it, and others only half. There's lots that doesn't seem logical. The situation in schools though is currently excessively heavily weighted towards catching covid, than not.

Secondary age kids in Scotland went back mid August wearing masks and still had an explosion of cases. Mask wearing seems to have been pretty ineffectual at preventing spread despite what posters on here claim.

Rates in Scotland are now dropping considerably. Why wouldn’t it be the same in England - short peak then drop. Would much rather have it now than during winter or the exam period.

Yes, I think natural immunity / repeated exposure to Covid will mean that over the longer term Covid will become like other coronaviruses

So repeated disruption to education then

So repeated disruption to education then

But all these restrictions are also repeated disruption to education and are only serving to delay the inevitable

no

because the risks of infection for vulnerable children/ families/ teachers will be less if school jabs & boosters happen first

& some severe illness, hospitalisations & deaths will be avoided that are not inevitable

My understanding is that over time covid-19 will become less virulent and more like other common ailments. If DCs were only off school for the actual time they were ill as opposed to 10 days when they may or may not actually be unwell, then it would be in line with say a heavy cold.

yes but we aren't quite there yet with the "it's just like a heavy cold"

I didn't say we were @herecomesthsun

sorry

I suppose you could argue then that if children - and adults - delay getting the infection and get vaccines instead, by the time it gets round to them, they will not only have better immunity but also the virus hopefully may be less virulent itself.

So not just a delay in illness, but a much milder illness, better fought off, when it comes?

Sorry I was probably unnecessarily snippy there @herecomesthsun . I think we all want the same thing which is for as few DCs as possible to be seriously or mortally ill and to receive as normal an education as possible.

But there's only a small number of things that can be done to ensure the former without impacting the latter.

Anecdotally all of the (many) children that have had it at DS primary school have had a minor cold. For DS it wasnt on the top 10 and was less than the non covid cold he had in May and the non covid cold his Dad had at the same time.

For my Mum it was a heavy cold - with the added element of loss of taste and smell

The problem I think for me is still its unpredictable nature - those for whom is becomes something much worse. A 12 year old I know ended up in ICU over the summer and is still being looked at for why he reacted as he did. And that is the problem there is no telling for whom it will be like that and it is still a significant proportion to be seen in the hospitalisations and deaths - though not like it was before.

What I dont know actually is whether the proportion of cases that reacts like that is more than other cold viruses or flu or whether it is a similar number but due to a lack of previous immunity more get it. 1% of a very large number is a large number if that makes sense