Why is one jab good enough for kids but not adults?

[Whatdoyawannado]

If one jab is adequate for under 18s how is it not enough for over 18s?

Thanks Jassy. They don’t seem to have considered previous infection irt reducing transmission etc. Unless I’ve missed it.

In what way?

For transmission in schools, there are several studies looking specifically at that listed as part of the key published inputs. I was interested to see the breadth there, and particularly the papers looking at mental health risks and impacts which seem to be on a more significant level than the tiny medical risks with either Covid or vaccines.

Mental health issues due to school disruption etc should not be an issue for children who are already immune.

[quote Peteycat]@herecomesthsun

"No, I was saying that you are pursuing a hypothetical issue with vaccine passports. The government will do everything they can to avoid implementing them because it will upset Telegraph readers so much and they have just said as much.

So your argument is a bit a pie in the sky isn't"

I am fully awareyou are talking about vaccine passports, because you replied to my previous comment about them.

How do you know they will try not to implement them? Guessing again. As for the Telegraph comment, I'm not getting into a slanging match about tabloids. You are on your own there.[/quote]
But you don't know that they will implement them do you? you are doing the guessing!

As for the Telegraph, first of all, it isn't a tabloid, secondly why would we be getting into a slanging match about it?

Mr Johnson is very keen to cultivate Conservative voters' opinion ( quite close to the general demographic of Telegraph readership) and they would hate vaccine passports for all sorts of reasons.

We need to get a wide level of protection against covid but I'm sure that if this can be done any way other than vaccine passports, that is what they will go for.

"Taking into account the latest data on the state of the epidemic, mandatory vaccine-only certification will not be implemented from the end of September. It would, however, be part of the Government’s Plan B if the data suggests action is required to prevent unsustainable pressure on the NHS. Mandating vaccine-only certification would be preferable to closing venues entirely or reimposing social distancing"

This, @herecomesthsun,is in the winter plan. Its there in black and white for all to read, yes it's a plan b, however I'm not guessing because the chances are it will be implemented.

I really hope not though.

Mental health issues due to school disruption etc should not be an issue for children who are already immune.

It depends on the kind of school disruption and other impacts, I suppose - if half the staff are off and the number of infected children goes past a certain level, all the immunity in the world isn’t going to be protective against disruption. Or if they bring class/year group bubbles back in.

And of course we don’t have a strong evidence base on duration of immunity after infection in that age group - the wider work that I’ve seen suggests that it wanes at a similar rate to vaccine immunity, but vaccination after infection gives antibodies a massive boost.

If the disease becomes endemic I’m not sure
I’d bank on lasting immunity from infection, particularly if infection was with earlier variants.

They will do everything they can not to.

if half the staff are off

Well whether the child has the vaccine won’t really matter in that situation irt disruption.

And of course we don’t have a strong evidence base on duration of immunity after infection in that age group - the wider work that I’ve seen suggests that it wanes at a similar rate to vaccine immunity, but vaccination after infection gives antibodies a massive boost.

What work would that be? We have longer data on immunity after infection than after vaccination and the studies have shown it lasts 9-12 months in the majority.

Because the risk of myocarditis increases exponentially with the number of doses. I can’t recall the exact figures but I think it was around four times more likely after second does (1 in 15,000 rather than 1 in 60,000 or something like that).

Given that children are more likely to have myocarditis after one dose than be seriously ill with covid it’s a bit of a moot point anyway but hey ho. Let’s just make up many convoluted rules that will keep them off school and then pretend that they need the jabbyjab to have an education.

SweetBabyCheeses99

Because the risk of myocarditis increases exponentially with the number of doses. I can’t recall the exact figures but I think it was around four times more likely after second does (1 in 15,000 rather than 1 in 60,000 or something like that).

Given that children are more likely to have myocarditis after one dose than be seriously ill with covid it’s a bit of a moot point anyway but hey ho. Let’s just make up many convoluted rules that will keep them off school and then pretend that they need the jabbyjab to have an education.“

Callum Semolr was in BBC a couple of days ago addressing this specific question.

If I recall correctly (it will be on iPlayer, BBC breakfast News), he said that cases of myocarditis in youngsters were between 16-32 per million, higher in boys if I understood correctly.
During the pandemic, over 40,000 children have been admitted to hospital with Covid, 142 (again, if I recall correctly, which I think I do) needed IC. Incidence of myocarditis due to Covid were higher than it is believed incidence of myocarditis will be in vaccinated children.

Semple!

Well whether the child has the vaccine won’t really matter in that situation irt disruption.

The idea would be disruption averted, surely, by reducing the risk of an outbreak taking hold in the first place? Lower case rate in the setting reducing the risk of breakthrough for those already vaccinated or with natural immunity as well as fewer first time infections and symptomatic illness.

What work would that be? We have longer data on immunity after infection than after vaccination and the studies have shown it lasts 9-12 months in the majority.

I’ll try to find it - I’ve seen several places but it’s in the PHE preprint on immunity duration, from memory.

I think those studies you’re talking show antibodies, but don’t go further into actual data on infection prevention/breakthrough infection?

The app is the NHS app that has been marketed and plugged for a while now.

I knew that. Was just a bit baffled to find it presented as some sort of compulsory thing that we had all been forced to download on our phones.

I’ve said this on another thread, but vaccination for children is not compulsory. Some parents will want their children to be vaccinated, others will not. Presumably those who don’t want their children to have it wouldn’t presume to stop other parents making a different decision?

"The app is the NHS app that has been marketed and plugged for a while now.

I knew that. Was just a bit baffled to find it presented as some sort of compulsory thing that we had all been forced to download on our phones."

I didn't say that!

"I’ve said this on another thread, but vaccination for children is not compulsory. Some parents will want their children to be vaccinated, others will not. Presumably those who don’t want their children to have it wouldn’t presume to stop other parents making a different decision?"

It's the fallout though isn't it that's a worry don't you think?

It's the fallout though isn't it that's a worry don't you think?

What fallout?

It's the fallout though isn't it that's a worry don't you think?

What fallout?