Are you letting child have the vaccine?

[GiveMeAUserName123]

I was just wondering if you have a child/ren between the ages of 12-16, that don’t have any medical conditions, or live with family members that are more at risk, will you be letting them have the vaccine?

My eldest will be turning 12 in the winter and I imagine will be given the choice to have it. I don’t think I want her too (I’ve had mine) but obviously it’s her body and her choice which is something that is held in high regard at home, so won’t voice against it, but if she does choose to have it, is she too young to decide something like this, as I’m not sure a child could really understand the full risk/benefit side of things.

How are you feeling about it in general?

[quote bumbleymummy]@leafyygreens you haven’t been able to quote a single bit of ‘misinformation’ that I am apparently ‘spreading’. I think you need to get over yourself. We are allowed to have different opinions and make different decisions for our families. If you do see me posting misinformation, please do call me out on it.[/quote]
People do, repeatedly, it doesn't make difference. There are probably hundreds of threads with posters trying to engage.

We are allowed to have different opinions and make different decisions for our families

Of course they are, no one has ever said this and again you're deliberately swerving. No one should be having a vaccine they don't to have, but equally, no one should be pressured into turning it down because of misinformation.

@illuyankas

"They’re only ‘problematic’ if you don’t want people to know that there are studies showing that infection provides durable immunity and that reinfection is rare. Do you not want people to know that?"

No one's hiding any information. If you can find it, anyone can.
If you really want to promote natural immunity in fair way, then you really should link the risk that involves being infected too, as well as advantage of it, so people can make their decision in properly informed way.

Of course. That’s why I’ve previously linked to studies and official figures showing the risks by age group.

The government are pushing the JCVI, but they will advise based on scientific evidence not government targets.

@leafyygreens I’m not ‘ignoring’ or ‘misinterpreting’ anything. You have accused me a few times of saying things that I haven’t said so I think it’s more a case of you misinterpreting something than me tbh.

I don’t think anyone is being ‘pressured’ into
turning it down.

"Of course. That’s why I’ve previously linked to studies and official figures showing the risks by age group"

Risks of the vaccine? How about risks of virus, the natural immunity you promote? Long covid? Brain deficit? Or do they only happen to the elderly and vulnerable?

I'm glad my two youngest two are not in that age range. They are well under 12 and wont be having it if its offered.

I've had the vaccine, DH and DD1 (26) has too.

[quote bumbleymummy]@Toesies No, my decision not to vaccinate my children was not based on the JCVIs decision. I do find it interesting that people think the experts have made the ‘wrong’ decision because they don’t agree with it.

@leafyygreens I’m not basing my decisions on the JCVI recommendations so my position is fairly consistent. It seems like you are happy to disagree with their advice though :) ‘Experts’ when they agree with you, ‘fools’ when they don’t? [/quote]
I didn't say say this! This is what I wrote - why doesn't your answer have any relation to this?:

England is one of the few larger countries not to as yet recommend Covid vaccines for this age group. Australia did just today; the US already does; many nations in Europe do. Some members of the JCVI have already published dissenting opinions on the subject, and the body may soon change course - if they do, will you?

@illuyankas

"Of course. That’s why I’ve previously linked to studies and official figures showing the risks by age group"

Risks of the vaccine? How about risks of virus, the natural immunity you promote? Long covid? Brain deficit? Or do they only happen to the elderly and vulnerable?

No, risk of the virus by age group. (Is there even a study showing risk of the vaccine by age group? ) And yes, the study about long covid in children that was released recently. Here it is again if you haven’t already seen it:

www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(21)00198-X/fulltext

I don't want to discuss other vaccines. I just want to challenge anyone who undermines the safety of our children because of their own agenda.

I have no problem with people who doesn't want to vaccinate their own children. I have problem with people who actively discourage other people from making right decision for their children by spreading misinformation, especially the ones who do it so subtly so MN cannot ban them. They are more harmful than the ones who shout out all the blatant anti vax stuff, imo.

Well at that comment, I throw it right back at you. Your the same. Both sides of this coin should be discussed fairly so parents can look, and balance and decide what is right for their child.

@Toesies

I didn't say say this! This is what I wrote - why doesn't your answer have any relation to this?:

The first sentence is a reply to the question in your last line. The next is an observation. I didn’t say that you specifically said that.

Actually, I've read that article. How you interpret is up to individual. Also the study was done from March 2021 to Feb 2021, this really don't cover the effect of Delta, which children are facing now.

*March 2020

Fair point, @Peteycat

@illuyankas ok, here’s what Kings college London said about it -

“ Long COVID uncommon in children, analysis finds

Fewer than one in 20 children with symptomatic COVID-19 experienced symptoms lasting longer than 4 weeks, and almost all children have fully recovered by 8 weeks, a new study has found.”

How did you interpret the study?

And yes, it only covers up to February 21. Is there another study into long COVID in children that you thought I wasn’t linking to?

Thanks @Peteycat it’s nice that someone else can step in and point out the need for balanced discussion!

"On average, the illness lasted for 5 days in younger children (5 to 11 years old) and 7 days in older children aged 12 to 17. Fewer than one in 20 (4.4%) experienced symptoms for 4 weeks or more, while only one in fifty (1.8%) had symptoms lasting more than 8 weeks."

So, from same article, 1 in 50 children suffer more than 8 weeks.

Almost all children recovered by 8 weeks, yet 1 in 50 suffers longer than 8 weeks. Is it a good result or not is up to how you see the results, really.

www.kcl.ac.uk/news/long-covid-uncommon-in-children

I just see these threads getting heated, I'm sure I'm guilty of it myself. We can't tell a parent of a CEV child they shouldn't have the vaccine. That would be very wrong. We also can't tell parents of non CEV children to have the vaccine. That would be equally wrong.

My heart hurts for parents of vulnerable children right now. My heart also hurts for parents of non vulnerable children who are worried about vaccinations.

I also don't think anyone has an agenda, they are just worried that vaccinating children will be either mandatory or socially required if you see what I mean.

Yes, same article. Sorry, forgot to paste the link after the quote.

“ 25 (1·8%, 95% CI 1·2–2·7) of 1379 children had LC56.2 The median symptom burden in these children was 6 symptoms (IQR 4–8) during the first week, and 8 symptoms (6–10) over their entire illness. The most common symptoms in these 25 children over their entire illness were anosmia (21 children [84·0%]), headache (20 children [80·0%]), sore throat (20 children [80·0%]), and fatigue (19 children [76·0%]).”

“Suffer” is quite an emotive term. “Experienced symptoms” is probably a less subjective way to describe it.

@Peteycat, if they start vaccinating children, parents or children have choice to opt out. Now the parents or children who wants vaccine don't have choice.
I'm pro vaccine, but I don't think it's wrong for parents not to vaccinate their children. I have worry too. Just that I don't like people down playing the risk or spreading misinformation.

On the comments above, bumblymummy posted the quote from the article, that almost all the children recover by 8 weeks. On the same article, it says 1 in 50 children suffer longer than 8 weeks. It gives such a different impression, doesn't it?

@Peteycat you have expressed how I feel. I am vaccinated, but don't want DCs pressurised either way.

I want to follow the JCVI recommendations when they have assessed benefits vs. risks. It could be different for different age ranges and medical backgrounds so a blanket vaccination programme may not be appropriate.

@Peteycat

I just see these threads getting heated, I'm sure I'm guilty of it myself. We can't tell a parent of a CEV child they shouldn't have the vaccine. That would be very wrong. We also can't tell parents of non CEV children to have the vaccine. That would be equally wrong.

My heart hurts for parents of vulnerable children right now. My heart also hurts for parents of non vulnerable children who are worried about vaccinations.

But no one has to take up the vaccine? Posters are keen for it to be offered to children in this age range, in line with the majority of other Western countries.

The argument from parents that don't want any children to have this option, on the hypothetical argument that this might lead to discrimination to their own children, is not a good one.

I know of 13-14 years olds kids (no underlying conditions) who has lost their sense of smell and taste post COVID and haven't recovered for months. Although they didn't suffer any of the other symptoms this one side effect has affected their food intake and lifestyle a lot. They can't even enjoy a pizza or takeaway and are limited in what they can consume. This is really a hard decisions for kids and parents and honestly I can see both sides reading this thread.

1354 out of 1379 children recovering within 8 weeks is ‘almost all’.

Enough4me, I just get upset with posters when they say that children Must be vaccinated. I don't want children growing up with vaccine passports etc, but equally I don't want CEV children dying or becoming really unwell. I want balance and choice.