Are you letting child have the vaccine?

[GiveMeAUserName123]

I was just wondering if you have a child/ren between the ages of 12-16, that don’t have any medical conditions, or live with family members that are more at risk, will you be letting them have the vaccine?

My eldest will be turning 12 in the winter and I imagine will be given the choice to have it. I don’t think I want her too (I’ve had mine) but obviously it’s her body and her choice which is something that is held in high regard at home, so won’t voice against it, but if she does choose to have it, is she too young to decide something like this, as I’m not sure a child could really understand the full risk/benefit side of things.

How are you feeling about it in general?

[Refractory]

Nope, the statistics have been misreported by right wing US media, it's really important to go back to the source rather than biased media.
This is the actual researcher summary: ^www.upmc.com/media/news/072621-king-mejia-vaccine-hesitancy^
Generally, COVID-19 vaccine hesitancy was higher among the young (ages 18-24), non-Asian people and less educated (high school diploma or less) adults, and those with Ph.D.s, with a history of a positive COVID-19 test, not worried about serious illness from COVID-19 and living in regions with greater support for Donald Trump in the 2020 election.
The PhD disparity reported is that those with PhD who originally answered they would not be vaccinated were less likely to change their minds than those of lower educational attainment.

Incorrect. The actual study (not the summary) analyses educational attainment as an independent variable, results here:

www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.20.21260795v3.full-text

PhD hesitancy does remain fixed, as you say, but it is also higher than levels reported for university and masters degree educated.

[Pettyargument]

I live in NZ. My sons aged 14 and 16 are vaccinated as are all of their friends. It’s been approved in this age group for ages here

[CarrieBlue]

My 12yo has hers today, I just wish she and her brother were allowed the full schedule and have their second - the vaccinator today seemed convinced that they will be able to get a second dose soon, so fingers crossed for us!

[ClaraHedgehogs]

Nope, I’ve put off my 13 year old having it for the time-being. It’s really up to her as much as it’s up to me and she’s said she doesn’t want it and to be fair, I wouldn’t be over the moon if she got it 🤷🏼‍♀️

[Warhertisuff]

[quote MRex]Posted too soon...

A few people self-reporting themselves as PhD who decided not to be vaccinated and did not change their minds, does not change the overall pattern that lower educational attainment aligns with higher vaccine hesitancy.

Meanwhile, back in the UK, where we didn't have vaccines turned into a political issue because all major parties support vaccination...
Again we see higher education levels = lower vaccine hesitancy: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0889159121001100.

Same findings in other countries too e.g. Qatar: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8235273/.[/quote]
This is just a hypothesis but I'm thinking the link between educational level
and vaccine hesitancy isn't a direct causal relationship.

Vaccines have been heavily promoted by the Government and other senior health professionals, almost all of which are highly educated.

Those who are similarly more highly educated have more affinity with those with a similar level of education, which leads to greater trust, and consequently greater vaccine uptake.

[1dayatatime]

In May, the WHO director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus called the prioritisation of low-risk groups, such as children, in rich countries a "moral catastrophe".

He said: "I understand why some countries want to vaccinate their children and adolescents, but right now I urge them to reconsider and to instead donate vaccines to COVAX."

Many countries are struggling to control the spread of the virus with limited vaccine supply. Less than 30% of the population in Paraguay, Colombia and Peru have received even one dose and are recording some of the highest rates of COVID deaths.

[ollyollyoxenfree]

@Jorriss

And the idea that their "research into the vaccine" done on the internet is superior to the research done by multiple virologists, the world over, is laughable

Oh well. You can go ahead and get your children vaccinated can't you. And others will make their own decisions about their own children. Not much you'll be able to do about that really if people decide they won't be going ahead with it. 🤷

This is what people want though?

Haven't seen a single poster demanding that all children must be vaccinated, just that their child in the age 12-15 bracket has the option of having it, given the context of rising cases, schools starting back, and the fact that pretty much the entire Western world has started offering it to this age group.

[Geamhradh]

@bumbleymummy

The Green Pass is either vaccination, or negative test or previous infection. (I think iirc you are in the EU, so am guessing it's the same?) The green pass issued on a neg test isn't really a green pass as you don't get the QR or the official registration, and if course it lasts for just 48 hours.

Italy is now at 79% of all over 12s with at least one dose of vaccination. That will go up pdq in September as over 12s could only book their vaccination from June onwards so are now getting their second doses.

[AlexaShutUp]

And that applies to your experience too.

Well, yes, obviously. That's why I said "these anecdotes" in my earlier post. I was very clearly including my own experience in that.

[Teamfemale]

@AlexaShutUp

Its not anecdotes its posters real life experience

Of course it's anecdotal, that's exactly what posters' real life experience is. I'm not denying people's experiences and I accept that they are different to my own. I am just saying that anecdotal evidence has no significance at a population level.

And that applies to your experience too.

[MRex]

On the other side topic, I don't see the EU "green pass" idea working in the UK at all, I'm immensely pro vaccine and can see why vaccines are necessary for care workers to reduce risks to vulnerable people as well as themselves. Anything that isn't related to working directly with highly vulnerable people cannot use that argument, because the effects on society are too broad for minimal benefit. Thankfully I can't see it being made legal to discriminate on this basis, because I can't think of where broad support would come from politically. What's more of an issue right now are companies like Pimlico Plumbers and and Goldman Sachs demanding that all employees get vaccinated to be able to work; I can see all the employer upside but it shouldn't be legal and I don't think it's reasonable. I've been waiting for the first legal case with interest, because I believe employers will find they are told they have no right to demand this even on health and safety grounds.

[bumbleymummy]

If it doesn’t work just put quotation marks around it so we know they’re not your words :)

[Peteycat]

Bumbleymummy I will try I'm not very good at technology!

[bumbleymummy]

@MRex I think people are just posting their experience because they differ from what you said -

Those with higher education levels in the less deprived areas are more likely to mix with others with higher education levels, and they are all more likely to identify the lower risk of vaccine than illness. Lower education and higher deprivation are more likely to mix together, but are less likely to decide to vaccinate.

I don’t think we’re trying to stretch our own experiences to population level.

[Peteycat]

Yes yours because you won't let it drop!

[TooBigForMyBoots]

I do accept that people are different. I didn't make it a class or education war! It isn't a war!

Except in some folks wee heads.

[bumbleymummy]

@Peteycat Does quoting not work for you? Sometimes I get halfway through one of your posts and then realise you’re quoting someone else! :) If you put at the start and end of the text you are quoting (right up against the text with no spaces) it will make it italic^ or you can use at the start and end to make it bold*.

[Peteycat]

Her point is that you just can't accept others feel differently. You have to make it some sort of class or education war. That's laughable.

[MRex]

Posted too soon...

A few people self-reporting themselves as PhD who decided not to be vaccinated and did not change their minds, does not change the overall pattern that lower educational attainment aligns with higher vaccine hesitancy.

Meanwhile, back in the UK, where we didn't have vaccines turned into a political issue because all major parties support vaccination...
Again we see higher education levels = lower vaccine hesitancy: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0889159121001100.

Same findings in other countries too e.g. Qatar: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8235273/.

[AlexaShutUp]

Its not anecdotes its posters real life experience

Of course it's anecdotal, that's exactly what posters' real life experience is. I'm not denying people's experiences and I accept that they are different to my own. I am just saying that anecdotal evidence has no significance at a population level.

[TooBigForMyBoots]

I didn't say I was going to do anything about it @Jorris. They've been refusing vaccinations for decades and I have done nothing. I'm not sure what your point is.

[MRex]

[quote bumbleymummy]@MRex I’m highly educated and yes, most of our friends are highly educated professionals and live in less deprived areas and more would probably be classed as ‘vaccine hesitant’ irt vaccinating their children against coronavirus.

I think there was a study from the US recently that showed that people with PhDs were the least likely to be vaccinated.[/quote]
Nope, the statistics have been misreported by right wing US media, it's really important to go back to the source rather than biased media.
This is the actual researcher summary: www.upmc.com/media/news/072621-king-mejia-vaccine-hesitancy
Generally, COVID-19 vaccine hesitancy was higher among the young (ages 18-24), non-Asian people and less educated (high school diploma or less) adults, and those with Ph.D.s, with a history of a positive COVID-19 test, not worried about serious illness from COVID-19 and living in regions with greater support for Donald Trump in the 2020 election.
The PhD disparity reported is that those with PhD who originally answered they would not be vaccinated were less likely to change their minds than those of lower educational attainment.

[Jorriss]

And the idea that their "research into the vaccine" done on the internet is superior to the research done by multiple virologists, the world over, is laughable

Oh well. You can go ahead and get your children vaccinated can't you. And others will make their own decisions about their own children. Not much you'll be able to do about that really if people decide they won't be going ahead with it. 🤷

[TooBigForMyBoots]

people couldn't possibly have a different opinion without thinking they are above others. Could they?

Of course they can, people have different opinions all the time. Different opinions are class. However, many MC folk absolutely think they are above those poorer and in more deprived situations. And the idea that their "research into the vaccine" done on the internet is superior to the research done by multiple virologists, the world over, is laughable.

[Teamfemale]

@AlexaShutUp

I'm also educated to post grad level, as are most of my friends and DH and his friends - they're mostly PhDs and plenty of medics. Adults all vax but no one in favour of getting kids vaccinated

But these anecdotes tell us nothing about what is happening at a population level. You have cited your experience above, but mine is completely different. And yes, I'm also educated to master's level and have a lot of friends who are doctors, PhDs etc. All of them have chosen to get their kids vaccinated where eligible. None of these anecdotes get us anywhere.

I do know one person (also master's educated) who doesn't want her kids vaccinated and hasn't been vaccinated herself, but she suffers with extreme health anxiety which is crippling at the best of times. Given that she is currently very unwell with covid, she may or may not change her mind.

Its not anecdotes its posters real life experience, just because your phd friends want it it makes out experience 'anecdotal'

I'd put a bet on it its actually 50/50