NZ back into lockdown.

[Malin52]

1 case in the community. All of NZ back into lockdown Level 4 because no link to border found.

Hard and fast.

Maybe if everywhere else did the same then Covid would be all but gone?

Yes. How selfish of all the ordinary people in India and Brazil and Iran, choosing to leave the house and work to feed their children, rather than staying home and obediently starving in order to eliminate COVID.

Full lockdowns are not sustainable for most poor and middle-income countries, and few people can keep watertight border controls for long either.

I don't know whether this has been used in quite this way before anywhere else - mainly because by the time the method was available in Europe cases were already evefywhere. I know the Netherlands used it to get an idea of the scale of the number of cases in an area but not actually to determine lockdowns or policy as such.

It was definitely used in the North West quite a while ago where there were local outbreaks.

@Bryonyshcmyony I think that you might need to refresh yourself historically. Perhaps your understanding of history is limited to school projects on the Romans and Henry VIII?

Wastewater monitoring has been used already for quite some time in Singapore - they are currently monitoring 200 outlets. The government are hugely expanding this into 2022. Many clusters were found through this method.

www.straitstimes.com/singapore/wastewater-surveillance-sites-for-covid-19-to-double-by-2022-from-current-200-nea

@FourTeaFallOut Colonisation is very much a construct that goes beyond a historical phenomena. The effects of colonisation are felt in NZ and Oz today and the pain for indigenous people is real. Colonial attitudes are still alive and kicking and are harmful in a contemporary sense because they, for example, restrict Maori access to health and result in inequitable educational outcomes. The way that Nz has been dismissed for its approach to COVID by UK based media and posters on this type of forum is an example of how colonialism exists on a world stage. Even now,after all these years, there is a Eurocentric superiority around how to do things and an assumption that the colonials will fail. Before anyone jumps down my neck, I have dual NZ/UK citizenship as do my children and I love the UK. But I do not love some of the attitudes towards others.

@MarshaBradyo

I don’t know if anyone has actually tried locking down in response to delta to be able to confidently say one way or another.

What about Sydney and Melbourne?

Will be interesting to see what happens in Melbourne, where they've done this several times (I think they're on lockdown 6, and have fewer cases than NSW). Sydney took ages to take things seriously, and they seem to be in lockdown-light even now. Up to 80+ cases before lockdown; NZ locked hard with only 1 case. So NSW in particular can't be used as an example!

NSW allows travel for exercise, parks and playgrounds open, beaches open and busy. NZ has gone in hard. We're allowed to go to the supermarket and pharmacy. And that is about it. Watch this space! I don't think anyone realistically thinks that this will last for 3 (or 7) days depending on where you are.

@Bryonyshcmyony 'we speak from experience'. And my point on colonisation is illustrated.
FYI NZ has accepted that it will have to live with COVID, hence the plans for borders reopening next year after a measured vaccination roll out and close co-operation with our Pacific neighbours. This is preferable to knee jerk reactions and unnecessary deaths.

Blimey, this thread has taken a turn since I last logged on this morning……..

And I thought that the situation in Afghanistan was bad, this is fucking rabid!

I do realise that I was banging off on one last night but whoow (made up word) this is something else!

Thank you @50ShadesOfCatholic and @shiningcuckoo for your measured posts. Unfortunately there are some in the UK who will never understand.

I’d just like to add that my view is that where ever we are in the world we are protective of what we are doing. That’s natural.

I’d also like to add that when I was out in NZ back in 2015 for the cricket World Cup I found the Kiwis so very welcoming, much more so than the Aussies but that for another post lol.

I’m spent a few weeks in NZ staying in both Wellington and Queenstown and had the most amazing time. I didn’t leave rubbish or shit on the streets (as one poster accused me of) and I stayed in local establishments rather than chain hotels, even if the bed and breakfast in Queenstown almost killed me every day with the walk…. bloody hell those mountains are brutal!

@shiningcuckoo I agree. I see the impact of colonialism and white superiority almost every day in my work.

I reckon we are in for a month. Hopefully some of that will be level 3.

I am reassured by Shaun Hendy's comments today and the fact that Queensland have contained a Delta outbreak with a early and hard lockdown.

I would love to go back and explore further, one of my besties lives in Christchurch and another has a hotel in Mount Maunganui.

Let’s hope the tourism stop doesn’t prevent me from visiting in future years.

@Turangawaewae I think that you're right. Although it might be different in the SI. Interesting that Devonport isn't getting the same unpleasantness that was dished out to South Auckland. Although unsurprising.

Ah, chatting amongst yourselves, carry on……

Today is Melbourne's 200th day in hard lockdown in the last 18 months. Wastewater sampling is an important tool across the state. Suburbs will be notified that there is clearly cases and everyone is encouraged to come forward for testing.
We were on top of Delta until NSW started flirting with letting it rip in a largely unvaccinated population. They have allowed the virus to get into the most vulnerable remote Aboriginal populations which is (imo) unforgivable.

Okay, I think that we all know thatCovid is here to stay.

What can we do collectively to ensure that as a world we keep on living, trading, visiting etc?

I honestly don’t know the answer, beyond vaccines?

@superfairy. Tourism controls aren't aimed at people like you who are happy to play for accommodation and who attend events and basically behave like reasonable people. They are aimed at asshats who freedom camp in cars and leave their poo and toilet paper in parks, overseas visitors who eat at soup kitchens because they don't want to pay for food and people who wash their dishes in the water at Blue Lake in the Nelson Lakes National Park - the clearest water in the world. You'll be very welcome.

We did have to put up with quite a lot of “U.K. is a shit show” comments from NZ and Aussie posters last year. Which I thought was pretty short sighted at the time and rude considering it’s a U.K. based site but I tried to scroll past just like NZ posters should scroll past now if they don’t like to hear discussions. I wouldn’t dream of doing the equivalent on a NZ parenting /chat site.

This. Kiwi posters are welcome to post on a UK site, but it's a bit stupid to do so and then get angry about the fact that it represents primarily UK perspectives. If you want a Kiwi-oriented window on the world, join a NZ-centered group or start your own up.

[quote shiningcuckoo]@superfairy. Tourism controls aren't aimed at people like you who are happy to play for accommodation and who attend events and basically behave like reasonable people. They are aimed at asshats who freedom camp in cars and leave their poo and toilet paper in parks, overseas visitors who eat at soup kitchens because they don't want to pay for food and people who wash their dishes in the water at Blue Lake in the Nelson Lakes National Park - the clearest water in the world. You'll be very welcome. [/quote]
Ah, thank you but to be frank that happens here in the UK as well.

I live in the Peak District National park and know all about tourism here.

To be very very honest, to get the money you ignore the by products of that.

You have to, otherwise you don’t get the money that you so depend on to live in the winter months……

@SuperFairy I love the Peak District. Was my closet NP when growing up and used to go with my grandparents. The difference here is the delicate state of our environment and the protection of native species. The Department of Conservation is very active. Also as all of our visitors fly here at great cost, it's not too much to expect that they have the means to contribute towards the work of DoC and the local economy.

Interestingly I think many places will rethink their tourism models once this is over. It’ll be interesting to see how it pans out

@PinkTonic ~ have to agree with you. Pity Jacinda didn't apply her fairydust "let's do this" to seeing that NZ's vaccine orders were well-managed and there were/are sufficient MIQ spaces.
@Terhou ~ NZ did indeed pay "furlough" (called the government wage subsidy) last year and is doing so again for businesses who can prove a 40% loss of income in areas subject to a 7 day (or longer) lock down.

@IslandSnow

Interestingly I think many places will rethink their tourism models once this is over. It’ll be interesting to see how it pans out

Yes, I believe the Balinese are also re-thinking their focus on tourism, although I can't bear to think how bad things are there at moment.

The way that Nz has been dismissed for its approach to COVID by UK based media and posters on this type of forum is an example of how colonialism exists on a world stage

Serious question, did NZ media not criticise the approach of any other country? Know full well that people from there on here critisied the UK approach, don't remember people getting arsey about it mind, most people from here agreed that it had been handled terribly here.

[quote shiningcuckoo]@FourTeaFallOut Colonisation is very much a construct that goes beyond a historical phenomena. The effects of colonisation are felt in NZ and Oz today and the pain for indigenous people is real. Colonial attitudes are still alive and kicking and are harmful in a contemporary sense because they, for example, restrict Maori access to health and result in inequitable educational outcomes. The way that Nz has been dismissed for its approach to COVID by UK based media and posters on this type of forum is an example of how colonialism exists on a world stage. Even now,after all these years, there is a Eurocentric superiority around how to do things and an assumption that the colonials will fail. Before anyone jumps down my neck, I have dual NZ/UK citizenship as do my children and I love the UK. But I do not love some of the attitudes towards others. [/quote]
I too have dual citizenship and think at this point you need to look at what you’re doing today to resolve issues and more recent past, than go back to U.K. being any issue.