Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Covid

Mumsnet doesn't verify the qualifications of users. If you have medical concerns, please consult a healthcare professional.

Original poster

Australia in a mess - NZ with a plan

999 replies

StartupRepair · 13/08/2021 03:20

More than half of Australia is in lockdown now, sparked (imo) by the intransigence of the NSW Premier who ignored all warnings about Delta. Our procurement of and messaging around vaccines has been dangerously incompetent.
It all feels a bit bleak today. At least NZ seems to have a plan.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
MRex · 23/08/2021 07:57

Sorry, bizarrely that was Canada. Also deplorable.

The one mentioned above is more likely Melbourne: www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9914557/amp/NBA-Star-Andrew-Bogut-slams-police-firing-rubber-bullets-protestors-anti-lockdown-rant.html.

DetMcNulty · 23/08/2021 08:22

I'm guessing a child was caught in the crossfire from reading that, rather than deliberately targeted as I'd interpreted the initial message about this. Still traumatic, but not indicative of policing overkill necessarily.

Toesies · 23/08/2021 09:18

[quote MRex]@Toesies - according to the father, they weren't even attending the demo originally: www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/video-police-mace-child-eviction-protest-b1906242.html?amp. I'm sorry, but you can't use "patent took them on a public street" as sufficient justification for using pepper spray on children.[/quote]

  1. This is in Canada. 2. The father states in the article that he and his daughter were just "walking around in the area, saw the protest, and recognised a friend there" and decided to stay and listen to the speeches. He also said he thinks kids should be exposed to these things.

So not so innocent really.

PicsInRed · 23/08/2021 09:36

So not so innocent really

These things feel so much safer when we apply blame, reasoning that we would have avoided it through "good behaviour", therefore it could never happen to us. That is the slippery slope.

Toesies · 23/08/2021 09:57

@PicsInRed

So not so innocent really

These things feel so much safer when we apply blame, reasoning that we would have avoided it through "good behaviour", therefore it could never happen to us. That is the slippery slope.

No, it's easy really. Don't take kids to a protest you know is likely to be violent. And don't behave like a violent loon at a protest.

Ozgirl75 · 23/08/2021 11:13

I read on the ABC today that Gladys was working on the “one thing” that she has promised us we’ll be able to do next month. “One thing”???
What about schools for goodness sake?
Reading some of the things on the abc about how children are suffering through this is heartbreaking. I know it’s important to protect our 80 year olds but this period could lead to lifelong trauma for children.

DetMcNulty · 23/08/2021 11:21

Yep, keeping schools going should be the main priority, I know from calls back to my friends and family in Scotland over the past year how hard school closures were on them as working parents, and on the kids. My nephew is autistic, and he really struggled with the lack of routine and structure, was a nightmare for my sister.

MaxNormal · 23/08/2021 11:46

So I just saw footage of this Gladys person saying that even if there are no cases and 80% double vaccination has been achieved, that masks, social distancing and other restrictions will remain as long as covid and the delta variant still exist.
So, forever then?

Ozgirl75 · 23/08/2021 12:00

To be honest, masks and social distancing of some level I can deal with. But we need to get business open, schools open and people at least meeting in small groups, especially if they’re vaccinated.
Big events at this stage? I can see the argument for not having them, but schools and most business should be back ASAP.

Mango1982 · 23/08/2021 15:19

Ozgirl75

The people making those choices are getting full pay have large houses and gardens so why are they in a hurry to get back to normal oh and they get to boss everyone around I suspect if they all lived in one bed flats and were on furlough the choices made would be very different

ajandjjmum · 23/08/2021 15:34

DS lives in a small studio in Bondi - he says it is totally weird to walk out of your front door to find the forces patrolling and checking up on your movements.

EccentricaGalumbits · 23/08/2021 23:50

[quote Kingstonmumof1]Anyone else seen this article:
www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/24/ending-lockdowns-with-80-vaccinated-could-cause-25000-australian-deaths-new-modelling-suggests?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other[/quote]
My heart sank when I saw this. All throughout this pandemic we've been told to trust the science, but science doesn't always agree with itself.

90/95% seems unachievable.

Ozgirl75 · 23/08/2021 23:59

Sydney Morning Herald was reporting yesterday that K-2 and year 11 will go back next term at least. I don’t have kids in those years but I can see it would be fairest to get them back.
I’m semi hoping that in areas with very few cases they would let all kids back but even I can see how unfair that would be as it’s the poorer areas that have all the cases so to give school back to the richer areas isn’t a great look.
I just hope they’re looking to other countries to see how they got kids back. Another 13 weeks at home is quite daunting even for me, whose kids are actually doing fine.

Clearlyunhinged · 24/08/2021 00:13

Get the AZ out of the back of the cupboard and into people's arms fgs

Original poster
StartupRepair · 24/08/2021 03:39

2 different versions of living with Covid. www.theage.com.au/national/living-with-covid-could-end-up-two-very-different-ways-20210824-p58lcv.html?btis

OP posts:
Kokeshi123 · 24/08/2021 03:53

If someone chooses to live in the 17th century, perhaps we should indulge them and let them fulfill that dream.

newstart1234 · 24/08/2021 05:25

The guy who wrote that article in the age may know a lot about Australian health policy but he doesn’t seem to have an accurate perspective on the European situation.

To go back to my original quandary - he talks about 80% of the population vaccinated in order to live with covid in a modern sense. Again, this is likely unrealistic. Malta is the most vaccinated country in europe followed by Denmark. They have 78% and 69% vaccination rates and it’s not going higher.

Also, it’s not 17th century ‘let it rip’ in Europe. Again, there are ways to detect outbreaks in sewage and even air detectors, measures to stop the spread in terms of ventilation and air filtration, and most obviously identifying contacts and isolating them (if they’re not vaccinated). He either doesn’t know how Europe is dealing with covid right now or he doesn’t understand the 17th century. He’s a bit mixed up on this.

The article doesn’t even mention immunity through natural infection. The early data shows a combination of vaccination and natural infection provides the broadest immunity. He’s quick to compare Australia with the north west hemisphere but doesn’t even acknowledge this particular advantage that these places have now. It’s a totally unknown what will happen when covid spreads in Australia (and New Zealand) when the vaccination of the vulnerable happened maybe 18months prior and the rest of the population have only vaccine immunity and children will have no immunity.

Some mitigation measures will have to be in in Australia even once most people are vaccinated because it’s such and unknown what will happen.

MRex · 24/08/2021 06:55

[quote StartupRepair]2 different versions of living with Covid. www.theage.com.au/national/living-with-covid-could-end-up-two-very-different-ways-20210824-p58lcv.html?btis[/quote]
He's a bit confused. It isn't 17th Century in Europe, far more Europeans and US citizens are vaccinated than in Australia (and to a percentage level Australia may not reach), and hospitals are not over-run. It's nice to tell a story to get the point across, but it doesn't work in this case. What's also wrong is his suggestion that Delta will not spread at 80% vaccinated; unfortunately that isn't true and actually is a very dangerous lie to tell, because covid will spread when it comes. (That's why some of us have said you'll need motivations at that time, you'll be having a big wave like it or not.)

MRex · 24/08/2021 06:56

*mitigations, not motivations... But motivation to keep up social distancing will be important too, if it hasn't been all burned up by then.

TheKeatingFive · 24/08/2021 07:27

What an odd and throughly inaccurate article

Wakeupin2022 · 24/08/2021 07:37

That's a really daft article.

L1ttleSeahorse · 24/08/2021 07:42

I'm used to my (educated) extended family coming out with odd viewpoints about the UK as obviously each country puts a "spin" on things. (More recently - are you sending unvavcinated kids back to school?!) . I thought The Age was usually more on it?

Im loving the Guardian Australia live reporting as it's humourous/witty at times but sums up what's happening each day.

L1ttleSeahorse · 24/08/2021 07:44

Wow. The author is a director of a health programme!?!?

BunsyGirl · 24/08/2021 07:46

Very strange article. I am currently in the European country with the highest vaccination rate (Malta). No one can come onto the island unless they are fully vaccinated (or a negative PCR in the case of under 12’s), temperature checks are being made routinely (DH had his temp taken at the supermarket) and masks are worn everywhere indoors. Most definitely not the 17th century. The writer of the article needs to get on a plane and come to the scary place that is Europe!