Australia in a mess - NZ with a plan

[StartupRepair]

More than half of Australia is in lockdown now, sparked (imo) by the intransigence of the NSW Premier who ignored all warnings about Delta. Our procurement of and messaging around vaccines has been dangerously incompetent.
It all feels a bit bleak today. At least NZ seems to have a plan.

Yes, we've had delta outbreaks here twice and twice eliminated it with a short sharp lockdown.

That’s going to be a totally different story when your borders are open at a semi normal level. And no doubt there’ll be more new variants after delta.

so everyone's getting the picture.

I hope you’re right. Managing expectations is absolutely crucial.

@sashagabadon

The reason I say a date is that immunity seems to build over time, a longer gap between doses also helps as you probably need say 3 months, first jab, 8-12 week gap, second jab, 2 further weeks to full immunity. So waiting is foolish with a date in play, say 1st February 2022 ( or whatever)

Sorry, I'm not really following your logic here.

In any case, it doesn't seem to be affecting people in the way that you fear. there's been an enormous increase in people coming forward for vaccination and the issue is supply at the moment, otherwise our rate would already be a lot higher.

Are there stats on UK death rates in the vaccinated? In the US 99.5% of deaths are now in the unvaccinated. So the chance of dying if you're vaccinated seems to be absolutely minuscule, which is very positive and encouraging.

I don’t know how else to explain it. It takes say 3 months to get someone double jabbed full immunity. If you set 70% as your target , then 70% if who/ what? All adults? All eligible adults? All 16 plus? All 12 plus? Does it count from first jab? Second jab? 2 weeks after 2nd jab? It could go on forever as the target changes continually.
If you set a date, it’s a date, everyone understands it. Boris set the 20th June iirc back in Feb, it did actually get pushed back once to the 19th July and various people were pushing him to move it back again to September but he stuck to the date. It gave us all a date to work to, us over 50’s ( higher risk) knew we had to be double jabbed well before then. Some people weren’t / aren’t but that was/ is their choice. The setting of a date worked here in the U.K. imo.

@sashagabadon

I don’t know how else to explain it. It takes say 3 months to get someone double jabbed full immunity. If you set 70% as your target , then 70% if who/ what? All adults? All eligible adults? All 16 plus? All 12 plus? Does it count from first jab? Second jab? 2 weeks after 2nd jab? It could go on forever as the target changes continually. If you set a date, it’s a date, everyone understands it. Boris set the 20th June iirc back in Feb, it did actually get pushed back once to the 19th July and various people were pushing him to move it back again to September but he stuck to the date. It gave us all a date to work to, us over 50’s ( higher risk) knew we had to be double jabbed well before then. Some people weren’t / aren’t but that was/ is their choice. The setting of a date worked here in the U.K. imo.

Oh, I see. No, it's 70% of eligible, which is 12 plus. And it's fully vaccinated (2 doses) So the detail is there.

They're doing Pfizer 2nd doses after 3 weeks. We're just getting it done as quickly as possible now and can give boosters as necessary later on when the supply issues are gone. The focus is on vaccinating everyone ASAP.

Australia is a very pro vaccination country in general, more so than UK/USA so I'm sure we'll get higher rates of vaccination more quickly.

@TattyDevine

Just to add, lockdowns are like crash diets. They work, temporarily, then they rebound.

And the more of them you do the less motivated you get to do them.

So true, rebounding out to a Roaring 20s of binge socials.

@disco123

Australia is a very pro vaccination country in general, more so than UK/USA so I'm sure we'll get higher rates of vaccination more quickly.

Why do you say more than U.K.? Out of interest

I think for the Covid vaccine we’ve been one of top uptakes iirc

Really like the crash diet analogy, very true

Is there any info yet as to how the vaccine take up is spread through the age groups in Aus? As age is such a significant risk factor with covid there will need to be very high take up in the older age groups for the vaccine to have the maximum impact.

If your 20% (or whatever you end up with!) of unvaccinated people are under 20 it's unlikely they will be too much of a burden on the health service. If your 20% are over 70 they will create a very significant burden on the health service. Not every vaccination is equal in terms of benefit if that makes sense.

@MarshaBradyo

Aus vaccinates kids for chickenpox and hepatitis as a matter of course. UK does not. DC must be fully vaccinated to attend daycare or school in Aus and for parents to receive childcare subsidy etc. This is not so in UK.

[quote disco123]@MarshaBradyo

Aus vaccinates kids for chickenpox and hepatitis as a matter of course. UK does not. DC must be fully vaccinated to attend daycare or school in Aus and for parents to receive childcare subsidy etc. This is not so in UK. [/quote]
I know this (am Aus)

But I don’t think it definitely converts for Covid vaccine. Particularly with issues around AZ

We’ve had a lot of messaging to create high uptake.

Other countries that have undermined it now how have to do passes, which some are unhappy about and protesting.

If there’s one thing that’s helped is messaging here.

Iirc someone said 90% adult have had single dose so far - that is incredibly high

I think it means the government are more likely here to make vaccination a requirement for certain activities and people are more likely to accept that. In NSW they're already saying that construction workers from x suburbs must be vaccinated to come on site.

On the vaccine front - I took DS2 (16) to a mass vaccination hub today (in Brisbane). I booked him in on Friday.

In three weeks we will all be double vaxxed (Pfizer). So the programme is finally gaining traction.

Scott Morrison, is the most inept politician in this country. I think Bob Fucking Katter could do a better job - at least he has some genuine convictions. Scomo is so utterly lacking in charisma or any sort of genuine care, I despair.

Sadly our options are limited to old white man politicians. Scary times.

On the covid in schools front. My children have to wear masks at all times - even during PE/sport practice.

@GADDay

On the vaccine front - I took DS2 (16) to a mass vaccination hub today (in Brisbane). I booked him in on Friday.

In three weeks we will all be double vaxxed (Pfizer). So the programme is finally gaining traction.

Scott Morrison, is the most inept politician in this country. I think Bob Fucking Katter could do a better job - at least he has some genuine convictions. Scomo is so utterly lacking in charisma or any sort of genuine care, I despair.

Sadly our options are limited to old white man politicians. Scary times.

That's great - I'm so glad this has been set up. How did you actually manage to get an apt? Were you already registered and they invited you, or is there another way?

I don’t really see the point of masks in schools. Whenever I’ve seen news reports about it and they’ve shown footage of kids in classes or the playground, they’re all constantly fiddling with them, pulling them down to speak etc. Seems like performance to me. I don’t doubt they work, I just doubt that kids can correctly wear them all day in a way that makes them work.

If you click on the link in your own invite email (you get the option to register somebody else) - Qld Health.

@sashagabadon

I’ve always thought of Australians as a hardy stoic sort. Australia is ( to a Brit) a genuinely dangerous country. You have the worlds most venomous spiders and snakes that can kill you instantly. You have a fish that can paralyse instantly by stepping on it and a small jellyfish that can do the same with a slight touch. You have great white sharks! When I found out that salt water crocodiles could also swim in the sea I was terrified and wondered how anyone ever dipped their toe in the sea. One of your prime ministers disappeared going for a stroll on a beach, presumed taken by a crocodile So little old Covid is nothing compared to all that imo. Australians don’t live in daily fear of being bitten and dying of black widow spiders hiding under their toilets (as I read in a book once, might have been Bill Bryson) as you understand and assess the risks and this will become the same in time. U.K. has no deadly wildlife at all. We are “zero deadly wildlife” whereas you guys are “living with deadly wildlife” .

not to nitpick but Holt disappeared in Victoria... no salties there.... more chance been gobbled by a great white (or picked up by the elusive Russian submarine)

I worry about fires and droughts more than I do the wildlife... covid sits somewhere between them

Yeah. Fire scares me. Covid worries me for its capacity ti make a lot of people sick at the same time. Once it is endemic it will just move to the middle/back of the pack.

It's obvious now that people still catch it when double jabbed, so yeah there will be cases, we all know that. But we want that to happen after everyone 12 and over has had a chance to be vaccinated

This. We are going for elimination (or close to) until everyone who can get vaccinated has a chance to. Not elimination for ever and ever.

I'm in Victoria. I've done more lockdown time than most. And I'm still in favour of them. Until my DP, family and friends are all double vaxed.

Anyone who doesn't want the vaccine, well you can take your chances at that time and I wish you luck. Because you'll need it.

Fire scares me a bit too as we live on the edge of the bush (although in the suburbs). We have a bushfire plan though and we have a fire station quite close, and good insurance!

@GADDay

On the vaccine front - I took DS2 (16) to a mass vaccination hub today (in Brisbane). I booked him in on Friday.

In three weeks we will all be double vaxxed (Pfizer). So the programme is finally gaining traction.

Scott Morrison, is the most inept politician in this country. I think Bob Fucking Katter could do a better job - at least he has some genuine convictions. Scomo is so utterly lacking in charisma or any sort of genuine care, I despair.

Sadly our options are limited to old white man politicians. Scary times.

What is the percentage vaccinated by age group. I've got to say, it terrifies me that they are vaccinating this age group when the overall vaccination numbers are so low.

I guess I am coming at it from a different view point, as in UK it was done differently but from our experience here, 16 year old are not at risk of Covid.

@AllHailTheGreatGoddess

Yeah. Fire scares me. Covid worries me for its capacity ti make a lot of people sick at the same time. Once it is endemic it will just move to the middle/back of the pack.

yes, same. Aust covid situation for the past 18 months is a bit similar to an approaching fire front... you prep, wait, wait, wait, anticipate the worst.... prep some more....it's exhausting and drawn out. but glad to have Aus delayed the inevitable until now, with vaccines effectively doing the job of backburning.