France on “dark amber” list

[PersephoneJames]

You have to quarantine if coming back from France, doubly vaccinated or not.

So sorry anyone with relatives in France.
My aunt and uncle meant visit next week as son emigrated France last year with 2 grandkids one of whom my aunt met handful times as Welsh rules on travelling over 5miles.

I had no idea were different shades of travel.

Surely France is now red.
I fear the government know more than we do on how prevalent beta south African varient is last I read 15% in jan within France..
Thats the strain that renders astrazeneca useless.
So maybe government very worried.
Why not stop international travel all countries

@3asAbird Yes that's what I think, that the govt know more than they'll go public on about Beta and the AZ vaccine.

And yes France has more sequencing capacity than it did pre-covid but not as much as it needs to produce reliable data.

@Mummyoflittledragon

Ivor. Yes as have people moving round this country. We haven’t done that. We are double vaccinated. Shouldn’t we get to see family we haven’t seen in 2 years?

and @EasterIssland Movement in this country is spreading the variant we have in this country. Foreign travel to a country with a different variant risks bringing that here so obviously will be treated differently It is shit not seeing family and I agree this is awful for you but these decisions should be made purely based on science/fact

Just feel disgusted. Completely political. Beta is not a new variant and it's not more dangerous or more contagious than Delta.

Each time things like this happen, I have hard time to believe this government is a product of this democratic society. Just sad.

Movement in this country is spreading the variant we have in this country. Foreign travel to a country with a different variant risks bringing that here so obviously will be treated differently

You’re assuming the variants here stay the same. In fact our huge and increasing case numbers risk a entirely new variant (or several) developing here - this is a far greater concern than the existing Beta variant, which we know is out competed by Delta.

@IvorHughJarrs, I thought even the scientists have made clear this government doesn't make decisions following strict science/data...

@minipie

Movement in this country is spreading the variant we have in this country. Foreign travel to a country with a different variant risks bringing that here so obviously will be treated differently

You’re assuming the variants here stay the same. In fact our huge and increasing case numbers risk a entirely new variant (or several) developing here - this is a far greater concern than the existing Beta variant, which we know is out competed by Delta.

I fear this is going to happen surely. Gut feeling is that each time when Johnson makes a stupid decision, things would go out of control and drive this government to make a U-turn.

@theotherfossilsister

It's horrible. My elderly parents live there and my Dad has pancreatic cancer. Work cannot let me have the leave plus quarantine so there goes my chance of seeing them. I'm devastated.

I can't really get too upset about people whose holiday plans have been messed up. People booked in the middle of a pandemic and should have been prepared for any changes. However, I really feel for people in your situation, which is heartbreaking. I'm so sorry about your dad. Pancreatic cancer sucks.

@theotherfossilsister go off sick and go and see your dad! That’s an official mumsnet order! In 10 years time are you going to think, “I’m glad I did all that work in the summer of 2021.” Or “I’m glad I got to see my dad.”??

Do children (primary age) need to quarantine on return from France?

@GonnaBeYoniThisChristmas

Do children (primary age) need to quarantine on return from France?

France seems to be put back under old style Amber list rules, and in those there were no exemptions from quarantine for children, so I suspect the answer is yes, they have to quarantine, though the rules might change any minute now…

www.gov.uk/guidance/red-amber-and-green-list-rules-for-entering-england

“ The changes to the amber list rule for fully UK vaccinated people will not apply to France. If you have been in France in the 10 days before you arrive in England, you must quarantine for 10 days on arrival in England and take day 2 and day 8 COVID-19 tests.”

Hope everyone on the thread is doing okay today 💜

Why not stop international travel all countries

If only it were that simple. Read my posts and the other posters’ on this thread.
Most European countries have managed to open their borders and take logical decisions regarding quarantines and vaccination certificates, and are not being overwhelmed by all these variants who are apparently the cause of the UK’s latest decision.

Just read a news article about the situation regarding France and it said:

"A senior government source said: “They are worried about the South African variant because they think it escapes the vaccine, although they don’t have evidence of that yet"

Weren't we all worried to death about this variant months ago and then it just turned out to be nothing to really worry about with the vaccine working fine against it? So why are they now saying that there is no evidence? This has got to be a political move surely?

From a news article 13th April:

"On 1 April 2021, Pfizer/BioNTech published data looking specifically at 800 people in the trial who were living in South Africa. Their analysis suggeststhe vaccine is 100% effective at preventing symptomatic Covid-19 caused by the Beta variant"

So either they lied the first time or are lying now.

[quote LadyCatStark]@theotherfossilsister go off sick and go and see your dad! That’s an official mumsnet order! In 10 years time are you going to think, “I’m glad I did all that work in the summer of 2021.” Or “I’m glad I got to see my dad.”??[/quote]
Yes, I agree with this. I'm sorry about your dad.

@EileenGC*

*On 1 April 2021, Pfizer/BioNTech published data looking specifically at 800 people in the trial who were living in South Africa. Their analysis suggeststhe vaccine is 100% effective at preventing symptomatic Covid-19 caused by the Beta variant"

So either they lied the first time or are lying now.*

But that might still be true for the Pfizer vaccine…

Just maybe there are concerns in the UK about the level protection provided by vaccine(s) other than Pfizer…

“ Movement in this country is spreading the variant we have in this country. Foreign travel to a country with a different variant risks bringing that here so obviously will be treated differently
It is shit not seeing family and I agree this is awful for you but these decisions should be made purely based on science/fact”

But if many of the things that have opened up had stayed closed or if some areas have been banned to move around the virus wouldn’t have spread as quickly across the country. The reality is the countries take risks and even those with close borders every now and again have to go into lockdowns because few cases arise.

This government nor the Spanish ones (I’m Spanish) has ever made decisions based on scientific/ facts. It’s always been political and economical

Can you still test to release from this quarantine? If so, can’t you just go to france for less days, and incorporate the quarantine time in your original holiday time? Yes it may be rubbish only seeing your family for only a couple of days, but surely that is better than nothing?
And also for the person who said they can’t afford all the testing, but usually see their family every 8 weeks, surely you’ve saved a lot of money not making all of those trips?
I know neither situAtion is ideal, but it seems there are ways round it if you really need it. Definitely not value for money or time, but if there is desperation to see family then it might be worth it.

@LivinLaVidaLoki the current AZ vaccine is reasonably effective against death if you get the beta variant. But not very effective against moderate disease. So the NhS would be full of people in hospital who are not dying but still need oxygen.

Oxford / AZ have tweaked their vaccine to cover Beta, and I believe it went into trials last month. So will be rolled out in the autumn. I guess the uk has to buy time until then.

What’s the source for that, Lemons1571?

Agh. We were due to go there to see parents 26 July - 7 August. Currently trying to guess the chances that the quarantine will be dropped by 7 August when we return…

There is also the possibility France could go red necessitating a hotel quarantine for 10 days. That is what would worry me most.

Could you take two weeks leave, go to France for one week, then do the test to release on day five of quarantine to get let out in time to go back to work?

lifeturnsonadime Yes that’s true (although usually there is a short window given for people to return before rule changes take effect).

It’s also very possible that France will tighten its rules about Brits entering soon, given we have 10x their cases.

The number of cases and impact were known about earlier in the week and the announcement could have been made then.

Saved until Parliament is not sitting (weekend) so no scrutiny before it takes effect.

@minipie

lifeturnsonadime Yes that’s true (although usually there is a short window given for people to return before rule changes take effect).

It’s also very possible that France will tighten its rules about Brits entering soon, given we have 10x their cases.

Yes but it is interesting that no notice was given last night. That will cause problems for people who are already in France.

We were in France when the announcement was made last year for the q10. We managed to get back by the skin of our teeth but it was very stressful.

I suspect you're right that they will close the borders to us with the increasing rates.

It's all such a mess. My heart breaks for people who can't see their families.

It's also tough for those who just wanted a holiday this summer, mental health is important.

A globalised approach, at least with our closest neighbours , is required to ever step past this. Objectively I just can't see how things are going to change.