Current rules on isolation are counter-productive

[Warhertisuff]

I can't be the only one who isn't doing lateral flow tests or overlooking mild symptoms because of the consequences to, not just my family, but the school community.

For instance, last week my 9 year old son had a headache and sore throat... nothing serious and a good night's sleep meant he was well enough to go to school the following day, and he was fine in the days ahead. I didn't do a LFT or get him tested as, had he been positive, he, and his entire year group, would have missed the last 10 days of school, with all the activities and end of year shows etc.

I took the view that the possible damage caused by him having Covid - if he indeed did have it which he probably didn't - and passing to other children (and other adults who largely would have had the chance to have been vaccinated) was less than having the end of the school year ruined for everyone.

If the rules were similar for other illnesses, which I'd argue they can be now that vaccines have made the impact of Covid more like the flu, then more people would take common sense precautions about keeping their kids off school if unwell.

@Stevenage689

OP, stop trying to claim that you know the effect of vaccines and that you know that vaccines make the threat of covid minimal. You don't know that. No one knows that yet.

A huge numbers of studies and real life population data shows irrefutably show vaccines are highly effective, not perfect, but highly effective.

So you trust the data but not the scientists who wont lift the regulations yet 🙄

I understand your point OP.

I don’t fully agree with it, but I can see why you feel the way you do and why you did what you did (or didn’t as the case may be).

I spoke with someone last week about a multitude of non- Covid viral infections (all tested negative) happening recently and concluded that - despite distancing and sanitising for over a year - the common cold virus survived, regardless. Covid will not 'disappear'. I expect isolation period will be reduced eventually (as it was previously from 14 days) to 5-6 days and this in turn will be for a long time but will apply to fever people/groups.

A huge numbers of studies and real life population data shows irrefutably show vaccines are highly effective, not perfect, but highly effective.

A lot of people haven’t had their second dose yet. A colleague of mine got Covid last week (healthy, no risk factor, 30 something) and is feeling pretty rotten, she had one vaccine.

@Covidworries

So you trust the data but not the scientists who wont lift the regulations yet 🙄

Exactly this Contradicting yourself OP to have so much faith in the vaccines yet still think it fair to others to not follow clear guidelines with regards to testing because you'd sooner watch your kids in a play Laughable 😂

I'm by no means Covid paranoid, but deliberately not testing even when there is the tiniest chance of a positive result is nothing but selfish and irresponsible.

@Rosesareyellow

A huge numbers of studies and real life population data shows irrefutably show vaccines are highly effective, not perfect, but highly effective.

A lot of people haven’t had their second dose yet. A colleague of mine got Covid last week (healthy, no risk factor, 30 something) and is feeling pretty rotten, she had one vaccine.

I'm sorry your friend is "feeling pretty rotten", but I can feel pretty rotten with a cold.

I'm by no means Covid paranoid, but deliberately not testing even when there is the tiniest chance of a positive result is nothing but selfish and irresponsible.
The Covid equivalent of "I'm not racist but..."

Basically op the government guidelines agree with you. Don’t do routine asymptomatic testing on primary school aged children and only seek a pcr for the 3 symptoms. So as much as restrictions haven’t been lifted there’s been no change to the testing and isolation requirement either.

@Rosesareyellow

Yes better they enjoy the end of year at school, get Covid, and then all those pupils and teachers can isolate for the first two weeks of the summer holidays. I bet lots of parents and teachers who made plans for those weeks would thank you for that.

All? Not a chance. People won't do it.

@ButteringMyArse

Yep and that is why we have had the long restrictions because some people haven't been doing which has resulted in numbers being high longer than was needed. Selfish people

We've had long restrictions for a myriad of reasons, but really it's very naive at this point to imagine compliance with isolation is going to be anything other than patchy.

I've read less than 20% of people comply with isolation instructions. The OP is not in anyway alone!

Isolation rules needs to be changed - as there is too high a proportion of healthy individuals isolating because of being a close contact. I work in education so myself and my 2 children test twice weekly. I have friends who work in the NHS which is really struggling due to healthy staff members either at home isolating or at home looking after isolating children. My auntie had her operation cancelled for the third time this week and not because there are no beds or no space in the hospital because there are no staff because they are isolating. So I can completely understand where you are coming from OP and there must be thousands of people walking around asymptomatically because their companies and workplaces are telling them to not to use LFT tests because a postive result means isolation and companies cannot afford to have numerous members of staff out isolating. It seems to me that the vaccination stops serious illness but doesn't seem to make a big difference to transmission.

'' I'm by no means Covid paranoid, but deliberately not testing even when there is the tiniest chance of a positive result is nothing but selfish and irresponsible.''

This is nonsense. We've all accepted that asymptomatic transmission is a thing. We're not all being tested all the time! Most of us have 'the tiniest chance of a positive result' most of the time! It's not 'irresponsible and selfish' to not want to subject your healthy dc to testing and isolating repeatedly when the risk vs benefit goalposts have moved so far from where they were.

If we want as a society to remain in complete control of transmission and infection, then we have to have mandatory frequent testing, enforced social distancing, further lockdowns, increased isolations etc etc. No one wants to do this and in fact the government are talking confidently about ditching most of it in a fortnight. Therefore the OP is not an outlier in her behaviour.

It seems to me that the vaccination stops serious illness but doesn't seem to make a big difference to transmission.

As an aside, I agree that vaccination doesn't stop all transmission, but transmission is mainly occurring now in the unvaccinated part of the population. Looking at a graph for my area, the over 60s infection rate remains extremely low for instance, completely unlike other waves.

As I wrote in my original post, my son's symptoms were very minor and were gone in the morning - I didn't "think they were Covid", but thought it might have been a possibility. For those of you who think I was wrong to do what I did, how significant should symptoms be? For instance, I periodically have a minor headache, maybe once every two-three weeks - i put it down to combination of tiredness and dehydration. This morning I'm feeling a bit achey... though I put that down to exercising yesterday and how I slept. I have a bit of a dust allergy so can have episodes of sneezing. Any one of these could be a Delta symptom....Do I self-isolate myself and my family each time, an seek a test because there's a tiny chance it might be a symptom of Covid?

I've refused to download the app, or engage with the testing process, because I simply can't afford self isolation.

I'm self employed and can't WFH, so I'd lose all my income - there'd be no sick pay, no SSP, and I would be highly unlikely to get the £500 payment because I'm not on benefits.

I'd also have to pay £130 for a dog walker - my dog has behavioural problems and cannot be walked by well meaning volunteers. I'd have to bin perishable stock too. All my personal and business overheads would continue as normal.

I've already lost lots of contracts due to covid, and continue to lose more because of restrictions, and been denied both SEISS and furlough. That alone has left me feeling bitter.

So in summary I'd have zero income, higher than normal outgoings, and zero help from the government, after already losing loads of income and getting no help from government. Fuck that. I need to pay the rent and put food on the table, and there's nothing selfish about that.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/hundreds-children-isolating-sutton-coldfield-20921187.amp

My school has been horribly affected, but somehow we are still standing!
From a handful of cases at the start, by the end of year 8's 10 days isolation, over 50 kids had tested positive from year 8 alone. Some were still testing positive on day 9 of isolation. Imagine if they had just carried on at school - I believe the numbers would have been
Staff Covid rates have been enormous too. Most staff are vaccinated at least once, but are still catching it and suffering bad symptoms.

Interestingly, DD's school has told us that LFTs won't necessarily need to be done and reported back during the summer hols (except for the first week). I can't imagine that most people will risk their DC doing them for fear of finding positive results that will impact on plans. So presumably it's likely that the transmission is going to spread more with fewer breaks on it?

@DeathByWalkies

I've refused to download the app, or engage with the testing process, because I simply can't afford self isolation.

I'm self employed and can't WFH, so I'd lose all my income - there'd be no sick pay, no SSP, and I would be highly unlikely to get the £500 payment because I'm not on benefits.

I'd also have to pay £130 for a dog walker - my dog has behavioural problems and cannot be walked by well meaning volunteers. I'd have to bin perishable stock too. All my personal and business overheads would continue as normal.

I've already lost lots of contracts due to covid, and continue to lose more because of restrictions, and been denied both SEISS and furlough. That alone has left me feeling bitter.

So in summary I'd have zero income, higher than normal outgoings, and zero help from the government, after already losing loads of income and getting no help from government. Fuck that. I need to pay the rent and put food on the table, and there's nothing selfish about that.

I hope you aren’t customer facing then if you would refuse to test or isolate.

@Warhertisuff

Ah yes who cares if others get ill, so long as your child doesn't miss out on the end of year activities.

They would all miss out.... the year group sent home.

Continuing to treat Covid in the way we did pre-vaccine is disproportionate.

This might well be future policy But that policy will be based upon scientific advice from professionals at the right time Not just what you feel like when you want to

@Warhertisuff

It seems to me that the vaccination stops serious illness but doesn't seem to make a big difference to transmission.

As an aside, I agree that vaccination doesn't stop all transmission, but transmission is mainly occurring now in the unvaccinated part of the population. Looking at a graph for my area, the over 60s infection rate remains extremely low for instance, completely unlike other waves.

Again At this stage your view on data is not relevant

I hope you aren’t customer facing then if you would refuse to test or isolate.

I am customer facing - that's why I can't WFH

I'm happy to self isolate. I'm just not willing to push myself further into financial hardship to do so. I've already suffered enough financially for the sake of covid.

My DD has tested positive with minor cold symptoms. It showed up on a lateral flow (high school age so they are strongly encouraged to test twice a week for this very reason). Her school is now closed due to the number of cases, all because someone thought the rules didnt apply to them. She could only have caught it from school, she has been no where else. One of her friend's mums has just passed away from cancer but was very vulnerable to infection in the months before. Your attitude is very selfish.