Dh has been told to get back to the office

[SmiledWithTheRisingSun]

For a minimum of 2 days per week.
Is this an end to WFH?

@wheresmymojo

I can definitely see smaller, less progressive companies going back to the office full time.

They're always behind the curve - partly because of outdated ideas in their management team and partly because they haven't ever invested in management skills so they don't have the level of management capability to cope with anything outside of hierarchical, bums on seat management (which you can see through some of the comments on this thread).

These type of companies always take longer to adopt new ways of working. Some don't change until the MD changes.

But it's a million miles away from the modern corporate workplace.

My old firm was like that (and the one I trained at). I ran from both as soon as I could. I'm in a career where WFH is eminently doable (law), as long as the individual has a decent work ethic. I'd never go back to 5 days in the office.

[quote PegasusReturns]@WhenSheWasBad I’m not sure if you’re being obtuse or contrary for the sake of it, but it’s interesting that of my 6 examples you picked the one health related option as negotiable v the 5 childcare related.

Since it’s so straight forward perhaps you can answer this: if I have a project that requires the team to collaborate for a total of 15 hours a week over 6 weeks and there’s only 9.5 hours a week when they’re all available simultaneously due to all wanting different 30-60min slots away from their desk a) where do I find the extra 5.5 hours a week from and b) is it my responsibility as a manger to manage the teams diaries to ensure that the ask is spread evenly across the team.[/quote]

This doesn't seem difficult?

No-one on this thread is arguing for absolute flexibility in working hours and location.

You simply mandate the times they need to be available for co-working that work for the majority.

So in my hybrid role I am expected in the office on Tues & Weds, as are the rest of the wider team and this is when such co-working takes place.

@wheresmymojo I work as GC for a Nasdaq 100. I report into the board and I’m currently part of a team engaging on mid-long term plans for future working models.

We’re working with a number of consultants (E&Y, McKinsey, PwC) around work optimisation so all my comments come from direct experience of my own team and information shared through these projects.

I agree that retaining top talent is a critical objective for boards, but so is meeting business demands (perhaps more so than a year ago as many organisations grapple with the impact of covid on revenue) and whilst hybrid is definitely under consideration it will come for us with strict parameters and the flexibility that was permissible in the acute covid phase won’t be a long term option.

I’ll also add my DH runs his own architects firm, with approximately 100 employees. Generally speaking as an industry they’re much more progressive and also have a vested interest in design of space.

They’re actually exploring moving to a four day week but all in the office.

@PegasusReturns My friend works for EY, they are definitely doing a hybrid model.

@gagrag they might be, but that doesn’t mean it’s the right solution for all organisations or all functions within an organisation.

They will do an analysis of our scenarios and come up with a tailored recommendation which will appropriately address the business risk of a hybrid model across multiple functions.

It’s not as simple as saying we do it so you must.

It’s not as simple as saying we do it so you must.

I certainly don't think that.

I totally agree that the flexibility of the COVID world won't work, neither will working from home full time be the chosen model of the majority.

But most of the organisations I work with (global financial services and insurance) have worked through things and chosen a hybrid model, or are about to choose a hybrid model albeit that it hasn't been announced yet and is still working its way through the approval/governance process.

I'm definitely not arguing that everyone should just be able to do whatever they like, wherever they like and whenever they like.

The ones I know are reducing office space where possible in the short term...most of their leases won't allow for that so they are using the interim period to get people used to working on a hybrid model, changing to hot desking with more collaborative co-working and bookable meeting spaces and want to put in place more upskilling of their management population around managing in a hybrid environment.

Then, when the leases come up they will reduce their office spaces.

They're also looking to offer more flexibility around which office people work from should they be closer to another regional office for example.

@wheresmymojo that's my experience (law firms & investment banks). Some are looking at leasing out space in their offices until the end of the lease.

A lot of companies renegotiated their leases during lockdown 1. And now understand what their profits look like with vastly reduced office costs.
Drops in productivity may be outweighed by lower rents etc plus companies can probably get away with lower salaries if staff can WFH. Plus less support staff etc

DH and I both own companies in different industries and we’re both finding the same thing - young uns want to be in the office. As do many of the more senior staff.
The folk in the middle with kids want to carry on WFH.

With the right technology / attitude to working unsupervised, there's no excuse to fail at WFH.

What about those of us without the space to work from home? I've obviously done it during the pandemic but why should I be expected to work from my dining table permanently? You could give me all the technology in the world but what I really need is another room.

@PinkSparklyPussyCat

With the right technology / attitude to working unsupervised, there's no excuse to fail at WFH.

What about those of us without the space to work from home? I've obviously done it during the pandemic but why should I be expected to work from my dining table permanently? You could give me all the technology in the world but what I really need is another room.

A good company would give you tje chance to go back full time to the office but also allow that person that wants to mainly wfh carry on and out the technologies in place so that the communication doesn’t fall between you Two.

I think my company will do that @EasterIssland. I was just making the point that it's not all about technology, it's about peoples' home lives as well. If I'm not allowed back full time I will leave, I'm not prepared to compromise my home life any more

@PinkSparklyPussyCat

With the right technology / attitude to working unsupervised, there's no excuse to fail at WFH.

What about those of us without the space to work from home? I've obviously done it during the pandemic but why should I be expected to work from my dining table permanently? You could give me all the technology in the world but what I really need is another room.

Nothing in what I said was suggesting it should be mandatory. Just that WFH shouldn't equal a drop in productivity levels. You've extrapolated something from my comment which simply wasn't there, because of your circumstances.

I didn't think you were saying it should be mandatory, just pointing out that it's not just technology that has to be in place.

I’m surprised no one has commented on the lack of informal training created by wfh. The amount junior staff learn by osmosis from being in the office with more senior colleagues should not be underestimated. Its absence may not be noticed for a year or two but I’m sure it’s a problem building up and will be a significant productivity drag for the business.

A PP mentioned that their company is good because they allow partial wfh due to wanting a “good work life balance”. I think more people should be upfront about this - it’s not because you’re worried about covid or you’re SO much more productive at home, it’s because for the vast majority of you wfh is easier. Obviously that isn’t the case for everyone, but it is for a lot of people wfh. My life would be easier if I was in a job I could do from home. Let’s not pretend the reluctance to get back to the office isn’t anything at all to do with the fact that you get a longer lie in and access to your own fridge all day.

And just to point out, I’d feel exactly the same in that position!

Technology and the right work ethic are needed to ensure that productivity doesn't go down. Not having a desk shouldn't slow your work down. I worked from home before I had a desk. No drop in productivity.

Getting up at 4 to get half a days work in before homeschooling was pretty far from a good work-life balance to be honest.

Our boss didn't send us home in February 2020 for a good work-life balance. He did it because it was obvious that the tube and office blocks full of thousands of people would spread covid.

That's still true. Only more so.

@PrincessNutNuts presumably you’re not still homeschooling though, are you?

MrsWobble I think training is definitely an issue with WFH.
And a reason why the young seem keen to go back in (plus the fact that they don’t think zooming from their bedroom is a particularly interesting way to spend the day).

pegasus this was my full post. I clearly talk about childcare. Really not sure why I’m being accused of being obtuse.

^You trust your team to put their work first during work hours.
If Bill is normal free at 2pm of course he can spend 30 minutes doing yoga. If the team needs to schedule a meeting at 2pm - then no yoga for Bill.
Don’t plan to collect your kids at 3.30pm unless you have a backup plan for someone else to get them instead. It is genuinely not that hard^

It’s up to us if we want to go into the office. We’ve reduced the number of desks considerably so only half the staff can be in at one time. I’ve told them I’ll be in one or two days a month if that. I suppose it depends how strict the management are. We’ve all worked perfectly well at home so the MD sees no need to have us back in - ‘it’s all about work life balance’ we his words.

@CrownKettle

I’ve been going back voluntarily for 1-2 days per week. We’ll be getting phased back to the office from 21 June, although they expect most people will do hybrid working - probably 2 days at home, 3 in the office.

Me too