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Cummings evidence today

999 replies

Dirtystreetpie · 26/05/2021 09:57

Anyone listening?

OP posts:
PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 11:38

Don't you? I remember Blunkett resigning because because he'd had an affair (I think he was single but the woman was married).

Seems kinda quaint now.

PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 11:40

I've never been short of things for which to criticise the Blair/Brown administration, but I'm shocked by the depths to which we have now fallen.

HarrietPierce · 29/05/2021 11:43

PerkingFaintly Sat 29-May-21 11:40:17
"I've never been short of things for which to criticise the Blair/Brown administration, but I'm shocked by the depths to which we have now fallen."

The depravity of the Johnson Government is shocking, yet still they rise in the polls.

PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 11:44

There are some things I can never forgive Blair for.

The current government managing to make him look like a shining example of management, integrity and leadership is a shocking indictment of their incompetence, cupidity and vacuousness.

PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 11:47

I have actually genuinely thought we would be managing Covid better and indeed enacting Brexit more competently if Blair were in charge.

I never thought I'd see the day when I actually wanted him back. It makes me want to bleach my brain. And yet.

Emilyontmoor · 29/05/2021 11:53

Tony Blair did some bad things but he also did a lot of good things, and he was at least a centrist who governed pragmatically. For instance when it became clear the NHS had problems he funded it. I am not a Labour supporter, they too have an issue with their own extremists, but they are not in power, and never were.

Whist Starmer is wet he has got common sense. Day after day in PMQ he makes sensible points about the handling of the pandemic that Boris has no answers for but lies or trying to say he is commenting with hindsight though he has been perfectly consistent. Starmer would not have sidelined all the public sector expertise in testing track and tracing, and thrown money at someone in the private sector who had no experience or competency and predictably produced too little too late . Indeed he and Munira Wilson made regular visits to the testing initiative at the Crick Institute which, funded by Cancer Research U.K. was providing thousands of tests a day in March 2020 for GOSH, the Marsden, UCLH and other North London hospitals. It provided a model for other public sector initiatives in Cambridge and Scotland, the U.K. ones had to be funded by charity because it wasn’t until September that Hancock could bring himself to acknowledge the contribution of public sector labs and provide funding. This is just one example of the incompetence and croneyism that has characterised Boris’s handling of the pandemic. It is quite clear and on record that Starmer would have locked down earlier in March and September, thus avoiding many of the deaths and economic damage caused by having to have a longer lock down to dampen down a much bigger wave. He would have listened to the Scientists not reveled in the chaos and put little value on human life.

Boris has ridden on the shoulders of populist extremists to come to power and is now using that power without morals or integrity. All those Conservatives who do have the skills and integrity to govern effectively have been thrown out or sidelined in favour of idiotic who subscribe to the populist project that is Brexit.

We are on a ship of fools.

Emilyontmoor · 29/05/2021 11:55

The current government managing to make him look like a shining example of management, integrity and leadership is a shocking indictment of their incompetence, cupidity and vacuousness. This

SueSaid · 29/05/2021 11:55

@PerkingFaintly

There are some things I can never forgive Blair for.

The current government managing to make him look like a shining example of management, integrity and leadership is a shocking indictment of their incompetence, cupidity and vacuousness.

Grin Grin

Although actually it isn't that funny is it. Weapons of mass destruction my arse. I don't think any of the relatives of the 179 armed forces personnel killed in the Iraq war would join in with your pom pom waving, nor infact the inhabitants of Iraq.

'A shining example'. Jesus.

HarrietPierce · 29/05/2021 11:57

Nazir Afzal " Can’t think of any document that’s been ignored more by it’s creators than the Ministerial Code?
“Bullying, Leaking, Misuse of Public Money, Conflicts of Interest, Dishonesty”

Who’s final Judge of whether it’s been breached & imposer of sanctions?
Yes, the PM himself"

It seems the Ministerial Code is only relevant when it relates to Nicola Sturgeon.

Tealightsandd · 29/05/2021 11:58

Tony Blair did some bad things but he also did a lot of good things

Erm - you started so well... The correct sentence is 'Tony Blair did some bad things'. Actually scrap that. More accurate to say 'Tony Blair did many bad things'.

PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 12:00

There's some research to suggest that teaching about the glass ceiling, while in some ways necessary, may possibly be perpetuating it.

I haven't looked into this, but I can sort of see how it might work. Once we're no longer taken by surprise at an injustice, it becomes "normal" and could start to feel inevitable.

I wonder if comments that "it'll make no difference, people will still vote for him" might have a similar effect.

I'd almost rather hold onto the thought that, "people are fed up with this shit and won't put up with it any longer". I mean, I know some will vote for him regardless. But I'm not sure that's the majority.

The fact that the guy who put Johnson in power now thinks he can put the very same, unchanged Johnson out of power just by the force of trash-talking him (because it's not like Cummings has said anything very new) suggests that PR is more important than content. Alas.

Tealightsandd · 29/05/2021 12:02

Boris has ridden on the shoulders of populist extremists to come to power and is now using that power without morals or integrity. All those Conservatives who do have the skills and integrity to govern effectively have been thrown out or sidelined in favour of idiotic who subscribe to the populist project that is Brexit.

It's exactly that attitude that landed us with Boris. Had alternatives accepted the popular i.e. democratic vote wrt Brexit, we could have had a more competent and capable prime minister. Rory Stewart, for example. His failing and the reason why he didn't win the leadership contest was his stubborn refusal to move away from Remain.

HarrietPierce · 29/05/2021 12:04

Emilyontmoor" Starmer would not have sidelined all the public sector expertise in testing track and tracing, and thrown money at someone in the private sector who had no experience or competency and predictably produced too little too late . Indeed he and Munira Wilson made regular visits to the testing initiative at the Crick Institute which, funded by Cancer Research U.K. was providing thousands of tests a day in March 2020 for GOSH, the Marsden, UCLH and other North London hospitals. It provided a model for other public sector initiatives in Cambridge and Scotland, the U.K. ones had to be funded by charity because it wasn’t until September that Hancock could bring himself to acknowledge the contribution of public sector labs and provide funding. This is just one example of the incompetence and croneyism that has characterised Boris’s handling of the pandemic. It is quite clear and on record that Starmer would have locked down earlier in March and September, thus avoiding many of the deaths and economic damage caused by having to have a longer lock down to dampen down a much bigger wave. He would have listened to the Scientists not reveled in the chaos and put little value on human life."

Emily it's no good making intelligent comments about Starmer- Let's just call him Keith or even Kieth.

SueSaid · 29/05/2021 12:05

'Tony Blair did some bad things but he also did a lot of good things'

Well ditto for Johnson's government. They threw massive amounts of resources at critical care so they could cope with the surge, we all know about the vaccine success which somehow has nothing to do with government according to mn law, what about furlough? Have you heard of that??

They have done as 'well' or as badly as every other European country. Sturgeon had a much higher care home death rate yet is hero worshipped on mn and please, for the love of god do not compare us to NZ a teeny isolated country. Instead look at this and see that we have less deaths per million than Italy and Belgium and about the same as Spain and France. Similar cases per million too.

It's a pandemic you see, people will tragically die.

GoldenOmber · 29/05/2021 12:07

Rory Stewart, for example. His failing and the reason why he didn't win the leadership contest was his stubborn refusal to move away from Remain.

Hmm Rory Stewart who backed and pushed for Theresa May’s Brexit agreement? That Rory Stewart?

Emilyontmoor · 29/05/2021 12:07

Third one seems massively unlikely. First two, though? Not so sure. Maybe we’ll never know.

I highlighted that the Viruses that they were working on in the lab in Wuhan and in Australia and the U.K. had a different RNA to Covid . They were actually sampled from bats in caves in Yunnan thousands of miles from Wuhan. I forgot to add that the nature of the RNA is not that of a man made virus. The Scientist leading the Wuhan lab is internationally respected and has always worked closely with her colleagues across the world. No Scientists are subscribing to the escaped from the lab theory. It was as likely to escape in Kings Cross or Canberra as Wuhan. It occurred naturally somewhere in China. The lack of transparency actually means that there might well have been outbreaks elsewhere in China that we will never know about. We do know that they keep dressing up local outbreaks, on the north east coast, now in Guangdong , right across China as being transmitted by travellers when it is clear they have been community transmitted.

SARS which first emerged in Beijing has now been found to have originated months earlier in Guangdong and travelled along transport networks across the country. I suspect something similar happened this time.

Tealightsandd · 29/05/2021 12:08

I'd almost rather hold onto the thought that, "people are fed up with this shit and won't put up with it any longer". I mean, I know some will vote for him regardless. But I'm not sure

The issue is that people didn't vote for him. They voted against Corbyn (and the ghost of Tony Blair).

Until there's a decent alternative, people will keep voting for Boris. Keir's not the best, but he's not the worse either - his problem is the rest of his party (there are some decent ones, i.e. Yvette Cooper, but too much rubbish).

Emilyontmoor · 29/05/2021 12:09

And of course viruses don’t just emerge in China. Another coronavirus MERs emerged in the Middle East and of course Ebola emerged in Africa.

GoldenOmber · 29/05/2021 12:10

I highlighted that the Viruses that they were working on in the lab in Wuhan and in Australia and the U.K. had a different RNA to Covid

Yes, I think the point of contention here is whether or not China may have not been entirely honest about this particular thing.

PerkingFaintly · 29/05/2021 12:11

Not at all funny, JaniieJones, and neither is you attempting to describe my excoriation of Johnson as "pom pom waving" for someone else.

We're not going to fall for that shit of "if you're against A, you must be for B," any more.

(Also, you really don't want me to ask my family who served in Iraq and my friend whose family member was killed in Iraq, what they think of Johnson. I doubt they're fans...)

Emilyontmoor · 29/05/2021 12:11

Harriet OK Keef

HarrietPierce · 29/05/2021 12:14

At least Rory Stewart talks sense. He would have been a far better PM than Johnson.

twitter.com/WritesBright/status/1270841263634481159

QioiioiioQ · 29/05/2021 12:15

As far as I can see the escape from the lab theory is gaining quite a lot of traction currently

SueSaid · 29/05/2021 12:15

'No Scientists are subscribing to the escaped from the lab theory. '

Didn't you see my previous link?

meaww.com/angus-dalgleish-birger-sorensen-china-create-covid-19-wuhan-lab-reverse-engineer

Are these 2 not scientists then? They seem very credible going by papers they've had published etc.

'Yes, I think the point of contention here is whether or not China may have not been entirely honest about this particular thing.'

Indeed. Most intelligent people can smell a rat.

SueSaid · 29/05/2021 12:16

'At least Rory Stewart talks sense. He would have been a far better PM than Johnson.'

Confused