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Cummings evidence today

999 replies

Dirtystreetpie · 26/05/2021 09:57

Anyone listening?

OP posts:
QioiioiioQ · 26/05/2021 17:23

I think this will either 'kill' Johnson, or make him stronger

ICanSmellSummerComing · 26/05/2021 17:23

Kenn I can't imagine how horrendous it would have been under corybn I really can't, as bad as Boris has been and that says something m

EvilPea · 26/05/2021 17:23

@billysboy

Jeremy Hunt chairing it as well
He looked like he bloody loved it.
SueSaid · 26/05/2021 17:23

'Interesting to see some of the posters who minimised the Barnard Castle trip now claiming DC is not trustworthy & lacks integrity!'

Thing is BC was because they were apparently sick and potentially needed childcare. I absolutely agreed with that.

Security threats would seem an odd reason to flee.

If he has facts I'm all ears but it all had a ring of 'my truth' about it.

EvilPea · 26/05/2021 17:24

Nick Clegg would have got it sorted

emmylousings · 26/05/2021 17:24

If DC thinks Johnson is unfit to be PM (he said it was 'crackers' that someone like Johnson was PM) why on earth did he help him get re-elected? The fact he directs all the criticism at Hancock and Johnson looks sus to me, where is Sunak & Gove? The cabinet has collective responsibility, they are supposed to agree to and take decisions together, cabinet government is not about individuals.

ICanSmellSummerComing · 26/05/2021 17:24

Re Boris I just don't know, things are, touch wood, relatively stable at the moment, I don't think there is much appetite for more change?

sundowners · 26/05/2021 17:25

Why exactly in your clearly superior opinion?MaudBaileysGreenTurban?

sundowners · 26/05/2021 17:25

MaudBaileysGreenTurban

DuncinToffee · 26/05/2021 17:25

@tobee

How many of us on here think Johnson will get his comeuppance on this? In the near future?
Not me
MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 26/05/2021 17:26

@tobee

How many of us on here think Johnson will get his comeuppance on this? In the near future?
I think it's more likely that the Tories will be another 3 points ahead in the polls tomorrow, tbh.

Much of the country is still in thrall to the cult. And this of us that aren't, are not in the least bit surprised by anything Cummings said today.

ICanSmellSummerComing · 26/05/2021 17:26

I didn't see JH.

JH FACE at various points during last year, summed up how I felt, bursting with incredulity and frustration

SueSaid · 26/05/2021 17:27

'No, Jeremy Hunt, who chairs the health select committee, says its joint inquiry with the science committee will continue in two weeks' time, when they will be hearing from Health Secretary Matt Hancock.'

Yes but claim wise is that Cumming's evidence finished. 'He said/she said' seemed to be the gist of it? If he has 'receipts' ie recordings and documents why weren't they presented today.

goingtotown · 26/05/2021 17:30

Any body language analysts out there?

IEat · 26/05/2021 17:30

Remember he got fired, some of what he says is going to beaded on anger . He’s still a twat

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 26/05/2021 17:30

@sundowners - because people like you keep on with the lie that 'no one knew how to manage a pandemic', for one thing. It's tedious, wrong and it's the kind of attitude that will let the govt off the hook over and over again.

MarshaBradyo · 26/05/2021 17:31

@tobee

How many of us on here think Johnson will get his comeuppance on this? In the near future?
What were the worse allegations?

It was very long but most felt like rambling

Those who think it’s serious what we’re your top ones in terms of seriousness?

Not necessarily you ToBee just in general. I don’t think anything will stick but it is a bit behind the scenes mess

DuncinToffee · 26/05/2021 17:32

Oh ok, I misunderstood your comment.
I don't know, presumably he will need to produce evidence of his claims to the committee when asked?

Notonthestairs · 26/05/2021 17:33

Johnson won't get his comeuppance (yet). But Hancock was always destined to be thrown under the bus at some point. Protective ring my arse.

Kendodd · 26/05/2021 17:33

because those in government office should be held accountable if they were incompetent, if they lied

They wont be held accountable though, I mean, what does 'held accountable' even mean? I think this term comes from a time when politicians (and voters) valued honour and integrity, we just don't live in that world anymore. Do you remember when the press were going on that politicians might be held in contempt of parliament as if it was some huge consequence? Then they were held in contempt of parliament and we all realised that actually, nothing happens, its completely meaningless. I think the only thread they might take seriously is prison but unfortunately it doesn't seem to be a criminal offence to lie your way into office or cause thousands of deaths because of you own incompetence or indifference.

tabulahrasa · 26/05/2021 17:33

“ If he has 'receipts' ie recordings and documents why weren't they presented today.”

There were lots of questions about having emails, messages,etc. near the beginning, he says he’ll pass them on.

strangeshapedpotato · 26/05/2021 17:33

@AIMummy

What I really wanted to hear more about was what influenced the thinking behind herd immunity as the original plan. There wasn't concrete evidence at that point that it was achievable (i.e. there were reports of people getting covid more than once), also what made them think the resulting high death toll would be acceptable? The general consensus was that children were not affected and that elderly and those with comorbidities were dying, i.e. not the healthy, working population. Long covid wasn't widely known about then.

Some of the (quite horrifying if true) morbid ideas being rumoured at the time were that:
-hospital beds would be freed
-Housing crisis would be solved with the formerly elderly occupied homes now on the market
-pension pot would be healthy as less people about to pay pensions to.
-Hospital waiting lists would be shortened.
There were others but I can't remember all of them.
I wonder if the Government actually thought there would be a net benefit to the economy if the virus was allowed to run rampant through society. Some ministers were certainly quick to line up their cronies to benefit financially.

Cummings covered it.

The UK has had a plan in place for years, decades even, for dealing with an epidemic. It's updated every so often. The trouble is, it was completely based on flu - a disease that nearly everyone has SOME immunity to with a far lower fatality rate (one variant excepted). As part of the evidence backing the latest edition of this strategy, Ferguson at IC had done some number crunching on the impact of interventions like closing schools or restricting foreign travel. In each case, the epidemic was only slowed down slightly. The conclusion from this was that such interventions were pointless. What went into the government strategy documents was the (false) conclusion that once a virus was IN the UK, it was unstoppable, and the best you could hope for was to limit the damage.

A second part of this strategy was that once you have assessed some basic parameters regarding the virus, testing was pointless and should be limited to hospitals. No need to know where the virus is, if it's going to spread everywhere anyway. This was implemented in early March if you recall. I remember the day with total horror - it was the first inkling I had that our scientific advisors were hopeless.

SAGE concentrated on mitigating the impact - decisions were taken to protect the vulnerable, i.e. care homes, but unfortunately not communicated to the right people, so it never got implemented.

I'm fairly certain that NOBODY went into this thinking, great, let's USE this virus to kill off the elderly. That said, it wouldn't surprise me if once learning that the virus was going to spread and kill a lot of people, SOME in government quietly cheered about the money saved....

As we all know, it was Ferguson who first alerted the government to the true cost of the strategy they were undertaking. If the SAGE minutes from mid-Feb had been published at the time, MANY more voices would have been in there earlier, but as it was, nobody outside government knew the scale of the balls up taking place - it just dawned on us all slowly as March unfolded that the UK was slowly crawling over the edge of a very high cliff.

sashagabadon · 26/05/2021 17:34

I accept that he is probably right about the mess in government back in Feb to April. But I also don’t like his alternative solution (always with hindsight of course) of learning from China. Personally I don’t want to live in a country where people are locked in their homes with highly sophisticated track and trace. He suggested more severe punishments for rule breakers and prison sentences Hmm. To me that is one sure fire way to lose the goodwill of the public very very quickly. The public mostly obeyed our loser lockdown anyway, cases fell pretty quickly and the nhs was never overwhelmed. We didn’t need to be locked in our homes so he’s wrong about that.
Cummings imo seems to have some very authoritarian tendencies given the opportunity. Thank god he was not given full control at the time.
Just heard a behaviour scientist on the radio. Not happy at all with being referred to as a chalatan by Cummings

DuncinToffee · 26/05/2021 17:35

@DuncinToffee

Oh ok, I misunderstood your comment. I don't know, presumably he will need to produce evidence of his claims to the committee when asked?
Sorry that was a reply to JaniieJones
MarshaBradyo · 26/05/2021 17:35

LBC just went through a list of everyone DC thinks is rubbish. It’s pretty much everyone out there he’s worked with, for or up against