Will employers be allowed to force us back to unventilated offices?

[feelingcold3]

My employer seems to think everything will be back to normal and we can all come back from 21st June.

I am concerned because our office has no opening windows. At the moment I am doing half working from home half office so we are socially distanced, but if we are all back every day I will be working closely next to people with no ventilation.

Is my employer being reasonable

They can in theory but if the Indian variant takes off and working from home is working, I’d expect lots of companies would continue being flexible and maybe even save on rental costs. Having people sick and isolating isn’t great for business. I think a lot of businesses will change how they do things forever which will probably rile the government.

Won’t you be vaxxed by then?

@ajmouse

You'd have to prove that they're not Covid Secure, and as long as the correct policies and procedures are there (probably) then it'd be very difficult. In other words yes they can. We have been back for a bit now.

OP is talking about June 21st. No need for anywhere to be covid secure then - that's kind of the point of having a 'back to normal' date. Everything should be back to normal.

@TheKeatingFive

Won’t you be vaxxed by then?

Lots won't! My age group (32-33) only got the invitation to book today. I've booked the earliest I could which is in two weeks' time, so my first dose will probably be just about effective by 21 June (if we make reasonably optimistic assumptions about vaccine effectiveness against the Indian variant in particular). So I reckon very few people under the age of 30 will be protected by then, and given we've spent more than a year being told how dangerous it is i do think its a bit much to expect everyone to feel comfortable with a sudden U turn.

Yes sorry but I’m lacking sympathy from people that have wfh for the last year and now have been told to go back and are trying to find any excuse not to .
Firstly ask if you can wfh part time / Part time in office if not no most have had to work through . I’m assuming you have left the house in the last year if so yabu go back to the office or argue that you are more productive at home .

So I reckon very few people under the age of 30 will be protected by then, and given we've spent more than a year being told how dangerous it is i do think its a bit much to expect everyone to feel comfortable with a sudden U turn.

A healthy under 30 has little to fear from COVID and that’s been clear from the data for quite some time, no matter what the government says.

I work in scientific research, have done since this started. No windows, 30+ colleagues.

Yes . If it was reasonable for me a 63 year old teacher to work through the whole pandemic in a box like room with 30 others it's fine for you. Me and the many thousands like me. I've been polite for long enough. :)

We've been back in the office since last week and periodically been back in over the last year. I just feel grateful to still have a job tbh. We're mostly all unvaccinated too. There are plenty of people who have been at work throughout, and life has to start getting back to normal at some point.

@TheKeatingFive

So I reckon very few people under the age of 30 will be protected by then, and given we've spent more than a year being told how dangerous it is i do think its a bit much to expect everyone to feel comfortable with a sudden U turn.

A healthy under 30 has little to fear from COVID and that’s been clear from the data for quite some time, no matter what the government says.

I don't disagree (I definitely don't personally feel at risk, most of the time), but I think there's been such a lot of emotive messaging (and continues to be - isn't the Indie Sage message that the Indian variant seems to be having a much more significant effect on younger people?) that I think its understandable many people are now anxious. Mainly though I am frustrated at how many people (including many decision-makers in my work at least, largely people in their 40s ish) have had their jabs and forgotten that many of their workforce are lagging a long way behind them.

(Fwiw I'll personally be thrilled to be back, vaxxed or otherwise. I like wfh part time but being at home all the time is driving me mad.)

@Colourcones

Yes . If it was reasonable for me a 63 year old teacher to work through the whole pandemic in a box like room with 30 others it's fine for you. Me and the many thousands like me. I've been polite for long enough. :)

Agree entirely... Think some of the ‘working from home’ brigade may have got a bit comfy and are being a tad ‘precious’.

At some point we're going to have to go back to something like normal. If you've been wfh since the first lockdown then I think you're lucky you a)worked from home that whole time and b) still have a job.

@Muchmorethan

I work in a hospital with no windows or fresh ventilation.... and we're still continuing.

Same here. And the temperature in the summer is unbearable!

I work in a shop inside a shopping centre so no windows etc. Hundreds of people in and out, lots not wearing masks m. Unfortunately we have to just get on with it.

but I think there's been such a lot of emotive messaging (and continues to be - isn't the Indie Sage message that the Indian variant seems to be having a much more significant effect on younger people?)

Well there’s been a lot of scare mongering from indie sage, let’s cut to the chase. Again, I don’t recall seeing any data backing this up.

Anyway, essential workers, much older than 30s have been putting up with this all along, so there really isnt going to be a huge amount of sympathy for under 30s who’ve been ‘safe’ at home for more than a year now.

Oh bless you! Some of us have been back in the workplace since pre vaccine times with just a flimsy face mask and a bit of anti bac for protection 🤦‍♀️

I think unfortunately those returning after either long periods of furlough or long periods of wages are not going to do well in the sympathy stakes. Our whole office has been working all through the pandemic and people complaining about having to do what we have been doing all along just doesn't sit right.

Do you just want to stay in your house forever?

It all depends where we are by early June.

If cases are low and the majority vaccinated, then a more normal office scenario is fine. If cases are higher, then it wouldn't be.

It may be that some distancing remains in June, Johnson is very gung ho at the moment but if cases do rise with the variant he will potentially not get rid of all distancing. However if cases stay low, it should be OK.

The thing we should all be worrying about is schools more than offices.

@picturesandpickles

It all depends where we are by early June.

If cases are low and the majority vaccinated, then a more normal office scenario is fine. If cases are higher, then it wouldn't be.

It may be that some distancing remains in June, Johnson is very gung ho at the moment but if cases do rise with the variant he will potentially not get rid of all distancing. However if cases stay low, it should be OK.

The thing we should all be worrying about is schools more than offices.

No rise in cases would justify any measures. A sharp rise in hospitalisations and deaths might, but we’re not seeing that, and we certainly don’t have any obligation to be worried about schools at this stage!

@MiddleParking no obligation but pretty dim if the government weren't worried about a large pool of unvaccinated transmission when we all know variants are the biggest risk to the vaccination success.

I've been working with others throughout... but I do empathise.
You've felt safe all this time and now you're being pushed out of your comfort zone and are expected to act like the last year hasn't happened.
Ask to see the policy/ health & safety updates about how the office will be.
Good luck. It's not easy going back to normal, but it doesn't take long for it to feel OK.

Social distancing is rumoured to be scrapped if the June unlocking happens so that basement bars, nightclubs etc can reopen.

Considering that schools have no windows in some rooms and how many people have been vaccinated, I think that it's likely that you can be required to go back.

I dont get all these posters OP or any they are giving you a hard time.

It makes no sense to make people go back who can work just as well (or better) from home. Comparing to people who cant is irrelevant. People wfh for no benefit of furlough, all jobs are different. Why should you have to just because they have had it worse.

The more people who can and are happy wfh the less spread and chances of mutation which is good for all

Unfortunately that doesn't mean you will have a right to

But Tory donors include owners of office buildings who will be lobbying MPs to get people back in the office. It's no coincidence that Rishi has been photographed picking up coffee in Pret who depend on office workers.