If you think it's too soon for normal life to be resuming...

[TheVampiresWife]

...when do you think it won't be? What criteria would you like to see met?

I've seen lots of posts here saying that the trials going on in Liverpool/hospitality reopening/the pencilled-in end to restrictions in June and so on are all happening too soon. If your thinking is along these lines, why so - do you think we should be aiming for zero covid before things reopen fully? Or are variants your main worry? And if you do feel this way, will you continue to SD/stay home/not participate in large events etc beyond June?

My own thinking is that we're in a better position now than we've been since all this began - the majority of adults have had at least one vaccination (and vaccines have been proven to reduce transmission), rates are incredibly low or suppressed in many areas and over 60% of people have antibodies. But I'm interested to know why people may feel differently.

For me I am happy with the current relaxation of rules, and will be happy with the relaxation in May. My concern is foreign holidays, I am worried that the government could very quickly unravel all the good work they have done by allowing non-necessary foreign travel.

I would like to see all adults in the UK vaccinated before opening big events like nightclubs. Remember that a fairly significant percentage of people in nightclubs will actually not have been vaccinated by June. But I may feel differently when the time comes it depends what's going on with our hospitalizations

I would very much like life to start getting back to normal, but I feel right now like we are walking on a very thin sheet of glass that could easily shatter if we are too quick or keen to reduce restrictions. I cannot wait for the day when I dont have to wear masks to the supermarket, and I am singing and dancing with my arms around my friends but I would rather not risk the freedoms we are starting to gain.

@sleepwouldbenice

twitter.com/MattHancock/status/1356892990720122881?s=20

Matt Hancock
@MattHancock
·
Feb 3
Vaccines are our way out.

Oxford vaccine protects against Covid and helps reduce the spread.

I'm eight weeks from a second jab at which point even if I've had a good response my immunity will be lowering substantially.
It's not over.🤷

I'm all for outdoor events but with the lack of perfect effectiveness of the LFTests I cannot see the indoor stuff being anything but spreading events.

www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-9537949/DAN-WOOTTON-need-lives-back.html
The article is interesting but more interesting is the comments below. We can all dismiss the DM all we like but it's a pretty decent bellwether of public sentiment. People are seriously fucked off with being lied to continually and treated like muppets.
I seem to recall the plebs were ignored on another major issue a few years back which ultimately led to the creation of a separate political party and a referendum...

So that's why there'll be another wave soon, and probably another lockdown

The U.K. isn’t pursuing a zero Covid strategy.

You do realise that?

I think unvaccinated people in their thirties should get a bit of perspective. Their risk of death or severe illness is pretty much the same as that of the fully vaccinated fifty-and -sixty-somethings now swanning around without a care in the world. And the fact that the fifty pluses are now at least partially vaccinated means that they are much less likely to be contracting and spreading the virus or clogging up the ambulances and intensive care wards if they do catch it. It’s all good. (I’m not talking about unvaccinated people who are genuinely at higher risk but have slipped through the net for some reason).

I do however think that the border controls and quarantine situation need to be tightened up considerably, both to keep track of existing variants and also so that if there is the need to lock the borders against a very dangerous new mutation we finally know how to do it.

We don't really know if we've been vaccinated whether we are one of the unlucky ones who don't get a useful response. Herd immunity does require a big proportion of us to be vaccinated.

I think unvaccinated people in their thirties should get a bit of perspective.

Agreed. Lockdown measures were not about shielding healthy 30 somethings.

I'd be happier if children had also been vaccinated. See: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7927578/

yes exactly! as a healthy 36 year old i know i’m low risk but after 14 months of sacrificing my rights and freedom to protect others as well as reduce my chance of long covid, it will be ridiculous if i now get covid because people don’t want to wear masks or socially distance before all adults are vaccinated.... just because they are now vaccinated.

Tempting as it is to blame the pressure to open up on people who are now vaccinated, it's not just those people. There have been large numbers of people not at all bothered about catching or spreading covid all the way through - often these people are younger with a lower risk - and they've said so on Mumsnet many times (often with comments about people who did want to avoid catching it 'hiding away at home').

Some newly vaccinated people may throw caution to the wind for the first time, but lots will still be careful. Those that are newly reckless - they're joining a fair few people who've been reckless all the way through even when unvaccinated. Some lower-risk people on here have been complaining about having 'sacrificed too much already' and saying it's time to 'stop hiding', or whatever, since mid-2020.

It's always been frustrating to read, knowing that their impatience could put our slow climb out of the pandemic at risk. As someone over 50, I've always found it infuriating to be cast as some kind of covid phobe or wimp for wanting to avoid catching something that was always going to be worse for me than someone in their 20s or 30s. It's not just vaccines that make some people reckless.

@StillRailing

We don't really know if we've been vaccinated whether we are one of the unlucky ones who don't get a useful response. Herd immunity does require a big proportion of us to be vaccinated.

Vaccines cut severe illness/hospitalisations dramatically. Of course there's a risk you may be one of the very unlucky ones for whom it doesn't take, but are you going to be ultra cautious forever just in case?

I think the opposite. We are moving too slowly. Businesses are going under. We need to get on with our lives. It is madness now.

Oh-and I am unvaccinated!!!! Let's move on.

@StillRailing

I'm all for outdoor events but with the lack of perfect effectiveness of the LFTests I cannot see the indoor stuff being anything but spreading events.

I daresay there might be an increase in infections once nightclubs etc reopen, but that won't translate into the horrific number of deaths we've seen previously. Younger people not yet vaccinated are not likely to die from covid, and those who have been vaccinated are much less likely to become seriously ill.

Of course there's the variants question but there will always be a variants question, whether we reopen now or in a year's time.

Variants should be slowed by further vaccination though. There will likely be a difference, given time.

Thirty somethings are still at risk of long covid. It's not all about being hooked up to a ventilator.

Lockdowns were about protecting the nhs from being overrun by critical care patients, not preventing everyone from getting long Covid.

@MapleBee

Thirty somethings are still at risk of long covid. It's not all about being hooked up to a ventilator.

Vaccines cut transmission though. That benefits everyone, vaccinated or not. The chance of catching covid is low to begin with at the moment, so it follows that the chance of catching it and going on to have long covid must be very, very small. And by the time clubs etc reopen, more younger people will be vaccinated anyway. I suppose those who aren't can choose to just hang on for a few more weeks until they are and have some immunity, but I honestly can't imagine many social life starved twenty somethings doing that!

@TheKeatingFive

Lockdowns were about protecting the nhs from being overrun by critical care patients, not preventing everyone from getting long Covid.

A lot of people never could get their head around this, but it's true nonetheless.

@TheKeatingFive

You're right but at the moment we're looking at a high percentage of the population needing NHS help due to the long term effects of this pandemic. Everything from delayed cancer ops to a mental health crisis and long covid.

If we go back to "normal" too early and create more variants and risk another lockdown then we're screwed. It's a fine balance. Just because the older generations have been vaccinated doesn't mean we should assume everything will be fine.

If we go back to "normal" too early and create more variants and risk another lockdown then we're screwed.

The risk of variants is so much greater from outside the U.K. and the under 16s who won’t be vaxxed. A few weeks while 30 somethings get their jab is really neither here nor there.

Just because the older generations have been vaccinated doesn't mean we should assume everything will be fine.

It’s not about things being ‘fine’ but things being manageable.

People seem to forget the immense costs of lockdown. Economically, socially, personally. Plus the natural limits of compliance. It was never going to be realistic or even beneficial to maintain lockdown until all the adult population had their jab.

Who are these 30k that are predicted to die?

Also no point in waiting until we are all fuly vaccinated as apparently over 50s will have a booster for winter.

And if its so deadly to younger people then why the fuck are well at work and going to school etc. I honestly can't get my head round any of it.

When travel starts don’t expect people to self isolate, They didn’t last time. Don’t demand forms and then not check they have been filled in.

The price of PCR tests are a disgrace. Countries are demanding 72 hour tests and unless you get a 24 hr turn around at circa £200 EACH you will have to time very carefully. You then need as test to return to the UK.