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Is it fair to say teachers need to be more committed?

178 replies

Ladytremain · 26/02/2021 17:22

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/covid-schools-reopening-ofsted-teachers-b1807935.html

Seems a tad harsh I think

OP posts:
EnoughnowIthink · 04/03/2021 21:16

some teachers need some perspective

Some parents need to accept that they don’t know the set up in individual schools - how many CEV/CV staff there are, how many were ill at a given time, what safeguarding concerns particular children represent, what safeguarding issues are faced by staff and their families, the number of staff unable to work because of issues other than covid - serious illness in the family, bereavement, maternity cover, cancer diagnosis etc. Because life went on, just as it did for everyone else.

Ibizababyy · 04/03/2021 21:17

@ChloeDecker your right I am angry. I’m angry not just on behalf of my own child but for all children across the country and the level of inequality that there has been in access to provision. It may well be the governments fault that the remote education guidelines were not robust enough to ensure that quality provision was provided and yes I blame them to some extent. But actually this thread started with the suggestion that teachers could have gone the extra mile. You’ll recall I completely disagreed with the suggestion that they should be willing to sacrifice their lives but that I agreed SOME teachers could have done more. Just as many have- yes the government ensuring that all went further would have been better but in the absence of that it is very apparent that some have chosen to meet the basic guidelines only whilst others have met the challenge of remote education providing the basic guideline needed and then some.

As for not doing the teachers work for them- in the absence of my child receiving any actual teaching, me ‘facilitating’ his work ie sitting down and reading him the PowerPoint and asking him the questions/ having the discussion with him, really is the same as doing the teaching surely.

Ibizababyy · 04/03/2021 21:20

@ChloeDecker

If you remember my original point was that some teachers need some perspective.

Except you didn’t say some teachers originally.

Fair point and I have since corrected as I know my experience isn’t that of many across the country.
YardleyX · 04/03/2021 21:21

During lockdown 1, our local primary school closed down. Completely.

No access for key workers children. No remote learning at all.

Closed down completely and all teachers were off enjoying a lengthy holiday.

This is what creates the negative optics.

Ibizababyy · 04/03/2021 21:24

You might want to read a bit more about actually what happened and how on that day (4th Jan) all schools were instructed to close by the government in agreement with the risk the rising cases in the new variant was posing to the NHS throughout the whole country.

No reading required as I stated before our school made this decision prior to the national instruction- we received message via dojo on the morning of the 3rd that they were closed due to so many notices.

ChloeDecker · 04/03/2021 21:30

As for not doing the teachers work for them- in the absence of my child receiving any actual teaching, me ‘facilitating’ his work ie sitting down and reading him the PowerPoint and asking him the questions/ having the discussion with him, really is the same as doing the teaching surely.

Really not exactly the same and if that is all teaching was, I’m not sure the government would bother having schools at all and I think that for someone who has had the relative safety of being able to work from home during the pandemic, I think it is unreasonable to not have any empathy for primary school staff who have been working hard every day for the children physically in school and also providing work home as well.

To give you context about what I have been doing, I have been lucky enough to work from home full time since January and had to rely on my own DC to sit in front of the TV most of the day so I can work and then catch up with home learning in the late afternoons and weekends. We do what we can. I get the impression your child is also at the younger end of primary school too and I have a Year 1. There isn’t a huge amount of work that has to be provided at that age and I don’t feel resentful to my DC’s teacher for doing the best they can. I too am a keyworker, as is DH but haven’t been able to access the in schools keyworker provision either and it just is what it is.

I have just been grateful that I have been able to work from the relative safety of my home.

echt · 04/03/2021 21:34

@YardleyX

During lockdown 1, our local primary school closed down. Completely.

No access for key workers children. No remote learning at all.

Closed down completely and all teachers were off enjoying a lengthy holiday.

This is what creates the negative optics.

What? Your school created all the criticism of teachers hers that has gone on on these threads?

What did you do about it?

Stickytreacle · 04/03/2021 21:34

[quote Hellebored]@herecomesthsun but there's testing and masks now and still plenty of teachers not wanting to go back. What about primary schools? There's been calls for schools to be closed all year and an awful lot of damage done.

Most teachers are not over 50 and not in high risk groups, especially in primary schools. I'm not suggesting those most at risk shouldn't have followed advice to shield or work from home but teachers not in those groups have often worked fewer hours (not all, but teachers I know have) at a time of national emergency.

"Teachers are in small rooms which are crowded in a way we don't generally see elsewhere in covid times." Except for buses, factories, call centres, construction sites and hospitals - all with higher mortality from covid.

Teachers can see their job in whatever way they want, but if they're going to pursuade people that they've been in mortal danger in a working environment which has seen no covid cases in a year (as our school and many others have) it's not going to happen.[/quote]
My daughter is a HLTA who has recovered from leukaemia, so clinically vulnerable. She was expected to be in an unventilated room in primary, where social distancing is impossible, returning home to vulnerable parents and ecv grandparent.

Two colleagues have had covid, it is a tiny school. Requests for her to use simple ppe (a mask) were refused.

Other professions have risks, but are at least given the chance to use ppe. For the paltry wages she earns it isn't worth it frankly. She was a comitted caring ta, who gave loads to the kids she is involved with. Now she just feels demoralised, worthless and unappreciated. I suspect she will change jobs soon.

She won't be vaccinated until next week, so is still at risk for several weeks.

AllDoneIn · 04/03/2021 21:38

He can show his commitment by taking my job, I'm out the door at Easter. Fuck him 😂

YardleyX · 04/03/2021 21:41

echt - I complained. It made no difference.

I’d hazard a guess that my local primary school was not the only one to perform poorly. Otherwise, like you say, all the criticism on these threads makes no sense.

Abraxan · 04/03/2021 22:28

@YardleyX

During lockdown 1, our local primary school closed down. Completely.

No access for key workers children. No remote learning at all.

Closed down completely and all teachers were off enjoying a lengthy holiday.

This is what creates the negative optics.

But that isn't the teachers at fault. Why did the school close? Under who's instructions? Where did key worker and vulnerable children go? A central hub? Who supervised these?

I don't know of any schools that closed so would feel that must be fairly unusual.

BungleandGeorge · 04/03/2021 22:42

We should all know by now that public sector workers should work all hours without adequate protection and be willing to risk themselves and their families. And not ever expect a pay rise. How on Earth else will these terribly important people get to sit in judgement whilst receiving an over inflated wage🙄

Ibizababyy · 04/03/2021 22:48

Really not exactly the same and if that is all teaching was, I’m not sure the government would bother having schools at all and I think that for someone who has had the relative safety of being able to work from home during the pandemic, I think it is unreasonable to not have any empathy for primary school staff who have been working hard every day for the children physically in school and also providing work home as well

So make up your mind- firstly you said that teachers are doing 2 jobs- teaching in school and at home, which I challenged pointing out that my child has received no ‘teaching’ when at home just work being sent and actually by me ‘facilitating’ that work I was doing more teaching than them. Yet now that isn’t the same as teaching (which obviously we all know) and so in that case back to my original point that they aren’t doing 2 jobs at all as the sending work home bit is hardly taxing on them and not teaching at all. As for the empathy you are mistaken I have bags of the stuff but not for all teachers. Yes for my teacher friend who did 30+ parent meetings over zoom one after another in a single day this week to ensure parents were up to date with their childs education and could express any concerns before the return next week. Yes for those friends and family in occupations I have previously mentioned who have it so much worse and have no option to change the conditions they work in either before or during the pandemic. Here we are again this is why I suggested some teachers need more perspective.

I’m glad your child’s teachers have been doing the best they can. Ours most certainly haven’t and that is where my irritation lies. I’m not going to go into details but before someone chimes up that I can’t possibly know if they are trying their best I have had at least 3 conversations with the head regarding the remote provision and some of the responses I got make it very clear.

noblegiraffe · 04/03/2021 22:52

Yes for my teacher friend who did 30+ parent meetings over zoom one after another in a single day

A parents evening? That’s pretty normal?

Ibizababyy · 04/03/2021 23:06

@noblegiraffe and yet the kids at my kids school haven’t had one since before the pandemic. Which demonstrates my point you quoted from that bit all are doing their best.

Fire7 · 04/03/2021 23:14

This reply has been deleted

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noblegiraffe · 04/03/2021 23:17

[quote Ibizababyy]@noblegiraffe and yet the kids at my kids school haven’t had one since before the pandemic. Which demonstrates my point you quoted from that bit all are doing their best.[/quote]
Not really. I'm secondary, we do loads more parents evenings than primary. If you think your mate is impressive, secondary teachers might have done three of those since Christmas.

Riquesh · 04/03/2021 23:20

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Quotes a deleted post.

YardleyX · 04/03/2021 23:24

Certainly in my area, the secondary teachers have far outshone the primary teachers.

Managing 2 sets of all exam years through the last 12 months must have been mind boggling.

But I don’t know any primary teachers who have done anything more than send out links to Twinkl sheets. Most, to be honest, have not even done that.

noblegiraffe · 04/03/2021 23:24

That's not a serious poster.

Fire7 · 04/03/2021 23:25

I also don't think the teaching unions have done much good at all for the reputation of teachers over the last year.

All teachers I know (and I suspect the vast majority nationally) are desperate to get back to school.

But if the teaching unions had got their way, DC would not have spent a single day at school since February last year and would be lucky to be back before next year. Teachers would have effectively spent 2 years at home.

That has clearly affected public mood and opinion imo.

noblegiraffe · 04/03/2021 23:25

Don't you get bored of this, Fire?

YardleyX · 04/03/2021 23:28

Fire7 is 100% correct on that.

Beforethetakingoftoastandt3a · 04/03/2021 23:32

A neighbour of mine is a teacher and he says it has been like night and day with some teachers working flat out and others with their feet up in the garden.

Yes ive experienced this during the current lockdown. My timetable hasn't changed at all. Im teaching a full timetable via teams, with added children in the room too. Marking work sent in and work from the students in class. And then all the other tasks, three parents evenings, constant meetings, phoning parents and cpd. Other subjects stopped all teaching, and therefore all marking. Slightly pissed off....

RubyViolet · 04/03/2021 23:44

@Fire7

I also don't think the teaching unions have done much good at all for the reputation of teachers over the last year.

All teachers I know (and I suspect the vast majority nationally) are desperate to get back to school.

But if the teaching unions had got their way, DC would not have spent a single day at school since February last year and would be lucky to be back before next year. Teachers would have effectively spent 2 years at home.

That has clearly affected public mood and opinion imo.

The teachers unions didn’t make policy or decide anything. The Government made all the decisions for schools this year. The schools and Teachers followed the rules that the Government made. Gavin Williamson is the Education Minister in charge of Education, he is ultimately responsible for Education. If people have issues with how schools have been staffed, opened, closed or resourced Gavin Williamson is your man. Take it up with him. He masterminded the covid response in schools. It’s all on him.