ICU full of young people

[Sleeplessinsaltend]

I keep hearing from people on here that ICU is full of young people, if we unlock then the wards will be full of 30/40 year olds. Looking at this it seems not to be the case.

@Nellodee

I couldn't find data for all of the UK, but here is some up to date data about hospitalisations and outcomes by age in North London. London has a slightly younger demographic than the rest of the UK, but not drastically so. We can see that whilst hospitalisations are far greater in the older categories, there are a substantial number of people in ICU who are under 60 and also a large number who may be over 60 but still of working age.

And many of those people may be in the CEV group that will be vaccinated as part of group 4 or may have other health issues such as obesity that put them more at risk.

may have other health issues such as obesity that put them more at risk.

Does this mean it's ok if they die?

AFAIK it's only extremely obese who will be prioritised for a vaccine. Is it ok for the overweight to die then? They're still teachers, doctors, nurses, parents.

We have a lot of overweight people in this country in their 40s who will be unvaccinated for a long time - many of them doing critical jobs. It's not ok if they all get very ill or die. Obviously we need things like schools open but why not do it a bit more safely? Why not keep restrictions like face masks as long as needed?

I hate this narrative that basically it's ok if disabled, ethnic minorities or overweight people die. It's just pure evil and I find it truly disturbing how many trot out the 'oh but they had an underlying condition' as if that makes it ok.

Oh FFS. Pointing out that people with certain conditions are more likely to suffer complications and be admitted to icu is not the same as saying ‘it’s ok if they die’ .

Surely 'young' people means between the ages of 0-30.

If you're in your 30-50's and are classed as overweight and obese your metabolic age will be significantly higher.

Hospital are not full of babies or rows of beds with healthy metabolic aged patients, dying of Covid.

@IloveJKRowling

may have other health issues such as obesity that put them more at risk.

Does this mean it's ok if they die?

AFAIK it's only extremely obese who will be prioritised for a vaccine. Is it ok for the overweight to die then? They're still teachers, doctors, nurses, parents.

We have a lot of overweight people in this country in their 40s who will be unvaccinated for a long time - many of them doing critical jobs. It's not ok if they all get very ill or die. Obviously we need things like schools open but why not do it a bit more safely? Why not keep restrictions like face masks as long as needed?

I hate this narrative that basically it's ok if disabled, ethnic minorities or overweight people die. It's just pure evil and I find it truly disturbing how many trot out the 'oh but they had an underlying condition' as if that makes it ok.

That is not what is being said, and claiming it is is not helpful. It's also not helpful to keep hearing that ICU is full of younger people, when the VAST majority of those have a significant underlying health condition that puts them at risk.

I hate this narrative that basically it's ok if disabled, ethnic minorities or overweight people die. It's just pure evil

I'd agree with this if anyone had said it, but I don't think there's been a single post among the countless CV threads where they have. Many acknowledge that some groups are more likely to die, but that's a long way from thinking they somehow don't matter

It's noticeable once again, however, that it's daring to bring the obese into things that tends to kick things off on here. Despite all those posts last spring from folk who insisted Covid was finally going to spur them into losing weight, it remains the one big unmentionable on MN

You should know by now there are two types of person you are not allowed to question on MN - teachers and the obese 🤣

Don't think there's been a single post among the countless CV threads where they have.

I've seen many, many posts where these vulnerable groups are referenced to make the point that the general population at large isn't at risk and decisions should be made centering the general population.

Which amounts to the same thing.

Because it prioritises consequences for the general population and writes off others as collateral damage-absurd given the proportion of the general population who would be left badly affected.

@TemperIWasLosin

Don't think there's been a single post among the countless CV threads where they have.

I've seen many, many posts where these vulnerable groups are referenced to make the point that the general population at large isn't at risk and decisions should be made centering the general population.

Which amounts to the same thing.

I agree with this.

The constant references to 'underlying conditions' alongside the assertion that 'unlocking now would be safe for the majority' is clear indication that many do not give a shit if people not like themselves get very sick or die.

But @practicingperson we could always have behaved in a way to help ensure people who are very ill could live fuller lives with less risk. Such as not going to work or school when ill with any thing at all. Wearing masks in public, mandatory flu vaccines for all.
We could go further, restricting car journeys, and travel for example. Much higher tax rates, higher benefits so that people who suffer ill health through poverty can have their life expectancy extended by 10 years. On a global scale we could save hundreds of thousands of lives by ensuring that everyone has access to food, and that we don't exploit people by buying cheap clothes, or cashew nuts that women are paid less than £1 a day to shell. Never a more clear indication of not giving a shit if people not like themselves get sick or die. What do you do for those people? Or is that different? If so, why? So many amazing altruistic people on here.

@TemperIWasLosin

Because it prioritises consequences for the general population and writes off others as collateral damage-absurd given the proportion of the general population who would be left badly affected.

Do you really think making the general population less healthy and poorer while borrowing absolutely shed loads of money, abandoning the most vulnerable children and leaving people in care homes without contact from loved ones is really an acceptable solution? The Covid response has protected people who can afford to stay home while exposing those who are on the lowest wages to more risk. Who do you think stock the shelves, do deliveries and care for our elderly? It makes far more sense for the healthy, well off professionals to share the risk and children to be in school than this insane situation where people sit at home judging each other. Non of this will help the NHS in even the short term. They now think it will be a nightmare year for flu as we've overprotected our immune systems. Fantastic. Surely the answer can't be protect them more. Until what? We need to live in sealed containers? Being alive involves risk and that should be borne by those who are least likely to need hospital treatment.

Mahatma Gandhi Quote: “The true measure of any society can be found in how it treats its most vulnerable members.”

@IloveJKRowling global society? Neighbourhood society? National? What counts?

@GiveMeNovocain I totally agree. But the argument you will get is that it's better for one person to deliver to 20 houses than 20 people going out. For example.

Being alive involves risk and that should be borne by those who are least likely to need hospital treatment.

Yes, that is what has happened. Being locked down hasn't been easy but it is easier for the healthy majority than exposing the vulnerable (significant!) minority.

I don't agree with a lot of your other points but there are other things to do in life, you're clearly not going to change your mind and you're welcome to your opinion.

For everyone affected by covid so severely it’s an awful illness . But it’s not the situation posters on these boards would have us believe.

There are nearly 20 000 people still hospitalised with Covid.

That's just the hospitalised, this long after the peak and so far into the fourth lockdown.

A rather large 'everyone', given the steps that have been taken. Clearly, we should have done more and we need to do more.

@TemperIWasLosin

For everyone affected by covid so severely it’s an awful illness . But it’s not the situation posters on these boards would have us believe.

There are nearly 20 000 people still hospitalised with Covid.

That's just the hospitalised, this long after the peak and so far into the fourth lockdown.

A rather large 'everyone', given the steps that have been taken. Clearly, we should have done more and we need to do more.

Just to say yes there are current around 18400 patients in hospital with covid. That doesn't mean all of them are in hospital because of covid

Some are there for other reasons but they also test positive for covid. There is currently no data available to separate the two groups. However you are right way to many people are still admitted with covid each day. Hopefully the vaccinations will bring that down quicker.

Yeah like someone on these boards who had two family members admitted to hospital. Caught COVID whilst in hospital, got sick and died of COVID as the broken bone etc wouldn't have killed them.
So much for shielding the vulnerable.

That is one of the good things about vaccinating the NHS staff. Hospital transmission has been falling a lot thank goodness. No doubt it will still happen but the chances are becoming less every day.

I caught covid in hospital, passed it on to my entire family including CEV daughter. So my interest in the hospital stats is personal too. I’m
not alone in catching covid this way if you look at these boards and the government statistics.

People saying will can still do more, we have had strict lock downs, our vaccine uptake is incredibly high, despite what I read on these boards I see high mask compliance when I’m out. Sadly it’s a pandemic, there will be a lot of people in hospital. But, the majority of those will be older people. Now we have vaccinated them and continue to vaccinate the vulnerable groups we should see these numbers fall.