How much longer are we meant to do this?

[Creamteaincornwall]

I have so many friends who are at the end of their tether. Some suicidal, many almost.
I attend a zoom support group for my mental health and emotional well being as I have BPD and ASD. The last few weeks have been horrendous, every person is at the lowest they’ve been since the beginning of all this.
The amount of posts I’ve read on various Facebook groups of people saying they don’t want to get up in the morning anymore, they just stay in bed. Surely this isn’t doing anyone any good physically or mentally?
Surely this will put most in a weaker position if they were to catch covid?

How much more are we all suppose to take of this? With no end in sight?

@ProtectMaternity
I'm not a HCP and accept that I am shielded about how close to the knife edge the NHS is.

As a non-HCP, it's been very hard listening to Covid denier types saying that the NHS isn't overwhelmed. Even on MN threads there are a handful of posters claiming that they are HCP and their local hospital has never been close to overwhelmed and that claims of the NHS being overwhelmed is political manipulation designed to pull at our heart strings. Or there will be posters who say that the NHS is at 95% capacity every winter so what?

Covid denial is a minority view but they are very loud and difficult to ignore. I also fear that they have increased in number since lockdown 1.

[quote xmasmob]@inquietant

Unknown unknown unknown

It might mutate into something less deadly

It might mutate into something more deadly and finish us all off

I might get hit by a bus or die of a heart attack before either happen

You can only deal with what you have in front of you - several vaccines that work and are being adapted to work more effectively against the variants we know exist [/quote]
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@Truelymadlydeeplysomeonesmum

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[quote Delatron]@inquietant all viruses mutate. You really seem to be getting yourself worked up. Do you honestly think the scientists working on the vaccines didn’t think they would mutate?

The vaccines can be very easily tweaked. And the current ones still protect against severe disease with the MUTANT strains. Amazing really.[/quote]
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[quote xmasmob]@inquietant but we are currently suppressing and vaccinating?

So what do you want to happen? We vaccinate the majority, carry on suppressing indefinitely?[/quote]
I was answering 'what does it matter if it transmits so long as people don't die/get seriously ill'

I am aware we are currently in a lockdown

At no point have I said 'indefinitely'. I simply said that having widely circulating virus risks vaccine efficacy, so I think it would be better not to do that.

You do know that it will be circulating forever though @inquietant. What’s the long term plan?

[quote xmasmob]@myfriendsgivebadadvice

The current vaccines don't work on lowering transmissions with the new, more serious variant

Not true, hasn't been proved one way or another.

It's not more serious - just more transmissible.[/quote]
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Why aren’t we perpetually terrified of ALL viruses circulating and mutating?

Couldn’t the common cold circulate and mutate to make all our arms drop off or something?
Or couldn’t Norovirus mutate to cause our bowels to explode??

@inquietant if the vaccine reduces transmission, great. We won't have to lockdown/social distance the more people are vaccinated.

If it doesn't reduce transmission, then how can we suppress the virus long term? We haven't managed that yet despite months of lockdown last year, there will always be spread on opening. Covid elimination is just not possible.

So now what? I'm genuinley asking what the end plan is. Are we just to live like this because there might be a chance of mutation at some point? Like someone else said, I'd rather be dead than live years like this.

@Wherediditgo

Why aren’t we perpetually terrified of ALL viruses circulating and mutating?

Couldn’t the common cold circulate and mutate to make all our arms drop off or something?
Or couldn’t Norovirus mutate to cause our bowels to explode??

I'm wondering the same thing. Clearly we have viruses circulating all the time so why don't we just social distance forever incase they mutate? 🙄

It's hard but stay strong. Things are getting better. Case numbers are dropping, hospitilisations are dropping, deaths are dropping and vaccinations are going gang busters. They will ease restrictions once they have vaccinated enough people and case numbers are sufficiently low that they won't worry about it taking off (because enough people will have been vaccinated so it won't spread). Ignore the doom and gloom and talk about variants. The Government medical advisers are very confident the vaccines will work sufficiently against them for now and they are already making boosters. And yes I do think by Easter things will be much better. And then just keep getting better by summer.

@Australia77

It's hard but stay strong. Things are getting better. Case numbers are dropping, hospitilisations are dropping, deaths are dropping and vaccinations are going gang busters. They will ease restrictions once they have vaccinated enough people and case numbers are sufficiently low that they won't worry about it taking off (because enough people will have been vaccinated so it won't spread). Ignore the doom and gloom and talk about variants. The Government medical advisers are very confident the vaccines will work sufficiently against them for now and they are already making boosters. And yes I do think by Easter things will be much better. And then just keep getting better by summer.

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@Australia77

It's hard but stay strong. Things are getting better. Case numbers are dropping, hospitilisations are dropping, deaths are dropping and vaccinations are going gang busters. They will ease restrictions once they have vaccinated enough people and case numbers are sufficiently low that they won't worry about it taking off (because enough people will have been vaccinated so it won't spread). Ignore the doom and gloom and talk about variants. The Government medical advisers are very confident the vaccines will work sufficiently against them for now and they are already making boosters. And yes I do think by Easter things will be much better. And then just keep getting better by summer.

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I notice that some posters come and take the piss - but don't have any real view themselves.

Everyone is entitled to take the piss, but of the basic position I expressed, which is it isn't a good idea to have widely circulating virus because there's a risk that further mutation could render the vaccine ineffective, resulting in further lockdowns, with all the associated social, health and economic fallout - which part is incorrect?

From what I read - suppression to manageable levels could be done by summer, as with the first wave.

@inquietant

I notice that some posters come and take the piss - but don't have any real view themselves.

Everyone is entitled to take the piss, but of the basic position I expressed, which is it isn't a good idea to have widely circulating virus because there's a risk that further mutation could render the vaccine ineffective, resulting in further lockdowns, with all the associated social, health and economic fallout - which part is incorrect?

From what I read - suppression to manageable levels could be done by summer, as with the first wave.

I for one am not claiming that you’re completely incorrect in what you’re saying.

I would just like to see, on a thread about people who are struggling and with talk of suicide, that we can post some messages of hope as well.

There is a time and a place for getting in to the semantics and trying to posit our views. I personally don’t think this is the right place for it. People need a little push to get through - speculation about mutations and further lockdowns won’t help that... especially when it is just speculation.

@inquietant

I notice that some posters come and take the piss - but don't have any real view themselves.

Everyone is entitled to take the piss, but of the basic position I expressed, which is it isn't a good idea to have widely circulating virus because there's a risk that further mutation could render the vaccine ineffective, resulting in further lockdowns, with all the associated social, health and economic fallout - which part is incorrect?

From what I read - suppression to manageable levels could be done by summer, as with the first wave.

I just think people are anxious today and shouldn't be further worried tonight. Not some of the posters on this thread anyway.

🤷‍♀️Yes 🤷‍♀️No

ProtectMaternity
Because the only thing worse than being locked down like this is being locked down and thinking it’s unnecessary. Understanding why it is necessary has certainly made me less upset and angry about the situation. I’m not sure how a load of people saying “yes it’s shit and we shouldn’t be doing it” does anything other than make people feel more angry and depressed and hopeless.

Well said.
I find that understanding why we have lockdowns, why it's so important, helps with coming to terms with it too.

The AZ vaccine is proven to work on the dominant UK viruses.

It also has now been proven to cut some transmission of those two variants

Cases, hospitalisations and deaths are dropping.

Those are the facts we are sure about. Supported by evidence.

Anything else about SA variants or mutations doesn't effect us yet and we are still researching.

We didn't think we would have a vaccine this early or at all. Now we have several that can be tweaked to handle variants.

Things are going well and getting better.

If it doesn't reduce transmission, then how can we suppress the virus long term

We're just coming to this new-scientists are getting up to speed, our bodies are getting up to speed. We'll get ourselves into a position of superiority if we can keep the virus down for long enough to get ahead. This is why we don't want mutations! In all likelihood we'll improve on reducing transmissibility but the virus is working on adaptations even as the science evolves. We can slow this by giving it fewer bodies to practice on. It's vital that we keep numbers low to reduce mutations.

Why don't we worry about mutations with other viruses as they all mutate?? That's a dumb question in some ways. This virus is a bad mix of good transmission and really lethal potential in a significant number of people, given the good transmission. We can't afford for it to get even better at either or, quite frankly, we'll be looking at more carnage. The common cold would have to get much more lethal to have this effect and it's just unlikely to happen. Ebola would have to get much better at transmission (pre symptoms) and it's just unlikely to happen. But the possibility has always been put forward and scientists have indeed been concerned that we don't worry more and prepare more which is why we're being forced to start from scratch now.

It may always be that we need localised test and trace cracking down on outbreaks to keep numbers of new variants down.

We can't do that effectively without very low numbers in the community. That's why we're aiming for low Covid numbers, not zero. Nobody is considering zero unless we were lucky enough to get the perfect vaccine into people in record time.

Anything else about SA variants or mutations doesn't effect us yet and we are still researching.

It's affecting us, we just don't have all the data to show it.

I would just like to see, on a thread about people who are struggling and with talk of suicide, that we can post some messages of hope as well.

The idea that we can bring things down to manageable levels is a very positive view and in the 'good outcome' scenarios. I find it very helpful.

@myfriendsgivebadadvice

Anything else about SA variants or mutations doesn't effect us yet and we are still researching.

It's affecting us, we just don't have all the data to show it.

You know I mean it isn't the dominant one here yet or maybe at all

Don't piss about 😉

@myfriendsgivebadadvice

I would just like to see, on a thread about people who are struggling and with talk of suicide, that we can post some messages of hope as well.

The idea that we can bring things down to manageable levels is a very positive view and in the 'good outcome' scenarios. I find it very helpful.

Absolutely. So long as it is expressed in an appropriate way. I totally agree

Haven't noticed your posts. So that is not a dig at you. Unless you have been all ha ha and doom about it then obviously it is a slap on the face.

Anyway apparently there is a very funny thread about Hancock. Worth checking that out I think

I think we can certainly get this under control - like alcoholism you just need a little realism about the problem in order to address it.

I firmly believe in science and we are moving forwards. The vaccines are amazing which is why we mustn't risk them.