Astrazeneca less effective against mild illness in SA variant

[bathsh3ba]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55967767

NB this was a sample of 2000, not yet peer reviewed.

I'm beginning to wish they wouldn't report incomplete findings so publicly. All the commentary suggests it's too early to say if this is a big problem or not - so why tell us?!

@JaneNorman

Great article, thanks *@CoffeeandCroissant*.

This is the bit I don’t understand: The B.1.1.7 + E484K 🇬🇧 variant will only gain a selective advantage over “ordinary B.1.1.7 🇬🇧.” when a significant proportion of the population have Sterilising Immunity to “ordinary B.1.1.7 🇬🇧”

The B.1.1.7 variant was able to become the dominant strain without the majority of the UK population having immunity to the original strain. So how would this one be different?

I’m not disputing it, I just don’t understand compared to what we have seen so far. Is it to do with the relative transmissibility?

I don't know, but the transmissibility thing would seem to make sense. As in B.1.1.7 being more transmissible than the original virus was then able to become dominant. But if E484K is not more transmissible, it has no advantage. Maybe.

@CoffeeandCroissant thanks for the link!

I wonder if it is not possible to request the Pfizer vaccine when called to get the jab?

DH went for his jab this morning and was given AZ, there was no choice

My DH claims he is going to insist on receiving the Pfizer vaccine.

Good luck with that!

WHO has now approved AZ for all age groups.

And all places I believe?

@TheChip

It makes sense that they would work given that most of the time mutations make the virus weaker. I wonder if its just fear deliberately being pumped to try and push people towards the vaccine more.

Well it hasn’t worked with me because now I do not want the Oxford vaccine. I’ve spent a year being terrified I’ll die and barely leaving the house. I’ll wait a bit longer to get a better vaccine if I get offered the Oxford one next month. I couldn’t cope with getting the oxford and still being in fear.

Contrary to earlier reports, this says South Africa is still deciding what to do with the AstraZeneca doses it already has. Has decided to use the single dose Jannsen vaccine for the initial rollout, even though this vaccine has yet to be approved anywhere in the world (it has completed phase 3 trials though).

apnews.com/article/world-news-coronavirus-pandemic-africa-south-africa-coronavirus-vaccine-3f54526ca5bfca84eadfaeaea5ade5d5

For those people saying they would pick Pfizer over AZ. All the real world studies so far not run by Pfizer themselves say the same thing. Which is basically Pfizer numbers are similar to AZ outsider the lab when given to people. As for the SA studying on AZ they used a 4 week gap. When AZ works better with a longer gap. Hence are 12 week gap schedule. So it wouldn't have been fully effective yet

Study 1 took place in Israel

A study by the Israel Institute of Technology showed that the Pfizer jab was between 66 to 85 per cent effective at preventing infection and 87 to 96 per cent effective in stopping severe disease.

Those figures suggest the vaccine is not quite as effective as Pfizer's own data showed, but they are nevertheless very strong results.

Study 2 took place in the UK and the results should officially be reported soon. Here they are anyway

#Just one Pfizer jab gives 64-65 per cent protection. Two boosts it to about 84.

The Oxford vaccine is expected to be similar and — despite self-interested smears from Brussels — across all age groups.

Remember, this is against MILD illness. The jabs’ success in preventing severe cases or even death will be higher still.

Indeed the PHE data already seems to show hospitalisations of OAPs plunging thanks to their jabs. That is wonderful news for them — and for Britain’s hopes of a rapid return to near-normality.

These jabs are FAR more effective than a flu shot, which hits 50 per cent protection at best and is often far lower.

And the results, Britain’s first since the clinical trials, utterly vindicate the Government delaying the second dose to inoculate as many people as possible.

Almost all of the data analysed relate to the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine because its administration began three weeks before the Oxford/AstraZeneca jab.
amp.ft.com/content/eb311423-dd2f-48f8-af57-8d8f0103c313?

At 10% effectiveness against the South African variant, the AstraZeneca vaccine isn't much more effective than the flu vaccine.

It's a bit like ensuring everyone over 65 has got a flu vaccine back in January 2020. Not really going to help in the long run.

@NoraBattysCurlers

At 10% effectiveness against the South African variant, the AstraZeneca vaccine isn't much more effective than the flu vaccine.

It's a bit like ensuring everyone over 65 has got a flu vaccine back in January 2020. Not really going to help in the long run.

In one small test that was done before it was at full effective. Until the test is run using a 12 week gap and they have the data for that. Nobody knows for sure.

Hopefully the new AZ data will be available soon

I’m honestly feeling so disheartened and somewhat frustrated that I’ll be having the Oxford vaccine. I know that sounds ungrateful, but it’s becoming clear than all the other approved vaccines are far more efficient at preventing mild disease than the Oxford, in all variants, especially the SA one - so I’m struggling to see how that is going to be any different for severe disease.

I feel like we’ve got the short end of the straw, except this is people’s lives we’re dealing with.

@doireallyneedaname but if it prevents hospitalisation and death then surely that's a good thing.** There are lots of other mild illnesses, do you worry about those? We are not going to eradicate Covid so reducing it to a mild illness is fantastic.

**I am aware that we don't know that for certain yet.

Also, the Oxford vaccine works well against the virus that we have predominantly in the U.K. at the moment. It doesn’t seem like the SA variant is expected to take over at least in the short term.

By which time a booster should be ready.

@doireallyneedaname its less effective at preventing mild disease from the SA strain as it doesn't stimulate antibody response as effectively.
It does appear to provide t cell immunity which then prevents the disease becoming serious.
And it works perfectly well against the UK variant.

Totally appreciate that - but the other vaccines still provide better protection against the current dominant one AND the SA variant. I really feel awful typing this because I’ve felt really proud of the UK for making the vaccine.

Perhaps if and when we find out it’s efficacy against severe disease I’ll feel better. For me
I don’t see anything stopping the SA strain from becoming a bigger problem than it is, or another variant - and it looks like the other vaccines are better equity at taking on changes in the virus than ours.

Equipt, not equity!

The flu jab is nowhere near 100% effective and I don't hear people complaining about that. If any of the jabs prevent serious illness then that's the main thing and we just have to get on with a mild illness in the same way we would with others

The flu isn’t really a threat to the majority, I know lots say the same about covid but we don’t know enough about it to say that with confidence yet.

@CrackOpenTheGin, do you live in fear of colds and mild flu? That's what the Oxford vaccine reduces Covid to. No vaccine is going to be 100% so there may not be an answer to your extreme anxiety.

@doireallyneedaname, you might not know enough to say that, but the scientists/doctors do and state that.

No professional has said that though, have they?

We also don’t know if the Oxford vaccine stops severe disease.

There have been 108,000,000 reported cases of covid worldwide. On that basis I think we know enough about it to know that it isn't a threat to the majority (if we're thinking in terms of severe disease / death). I'm not minimising how dangerous it is to some people but really this comment is a bit daft, sorry.