Conspiracy theorists - mental illness or stupidity?

[Notcontent]

I know people who believe if really crazy conspiracies have always been around, but this pandemic has really brought them out of the woodwork... I mean, how could you realistically believe that Covid-19 does not exist, or that the vaccines contain microchips??

Some people who believe those things might have a low IQ and/ or poor education and so lack any “critical thinking” skills - and so might not be able to see why this is really illogical. But what about people who are clearly reasonably intelligent and well educated - like Jeremy Corbyn’s brother. Is it almost like a mental illness? Do they become so obsessed with being anti-establishment that they lose the plot?

I think in the past people sought political change but that doesn't seem to be a concrete option in the supposedly "post ideological age"...people like to feel like they're smarter than other people and can see "what's really going on" etc..same forces that drive people to vote for populist leaders, anti-imigration parties like ukip...a misplaced desire to demonise others who are no better off than you are, or blame some mythical illuminati, rather than look at the real root of the problems people face today.

Conspiracy theories have been around for centuries. In the past there were just as many people who tried to change the system, and just as many who attributed bad things to God or witches or the Spanish or Jewish people or coffee or something else that actually wasn't a factor.

I think the only conspiracy is why the Government seem intent on ensuring that the UK remains the country with the worst death rate (per capita) in the world.

@CrayonInThreeBits

AquaFairySoul I see what you're saying, but there are a lot of different types of things that come under the umbrella of mental illness, including personality disorders, some of which could plausibly leave you more vulnerable to believing conspiracy theories.

I feel part of the problem is too much, and poorly-filtered, information. It feels as though it's possible to find out about anything online (to the point where it seems unbelievable that, say, you can't find any mention anywhere of the regional rhyme your mum used to sing to you at night, or whatever). Human beings have an instinctive drive to learn, and to come to conclusions, and when there's unending information out there, so much that you could never read it all, and a lot of it at a level beyond what you can understand by yourself, and somebody promises to lead you through all the most interesting bits and show you how it comes together and makes sense, it's tempting to follow that path.

High-importance information that other people don't know, especially, is high-value to the human brain. Combine that with mistrust of the media and government, from living in a massive, faceless, lumbering bureaucracy that you feel you have no influence over and which has perhaps placed you personally in a disadvantageous economic or social position, and finding a community dedicated to discovering The Truth THEY Won't Tell You seems kind of appealing.

Can you not see how this is being really damaging though? Still saying that there are lots of things that could be mental illness so some could make you believe covid conspiracies? That's really not likely sorry, and it just perpetuates all the negative stigma around mental health problems.

Yes sure someone could have a personality disorder and then think that there's something up with the vaccine but, then in a thread like this, that's been equated to stupidity lack or knowledge.

Yes people have also said that people who believe stuff like that may also be really clever but then again this still makes links between mental illness and intelligence which just isn't fair. They're not linked.

I get the point of the thread sure - if people are mentally unstable anyway then yes they may be more likely to believe something they've read online. Maybe. Possibly. But then the VAST majority of people who believe things online really will not have a mental health issue... It's just the power of social media as we all know.

I just think that there's such a massive thing around mental illness - you can't talk about it...if you have something wrong with you you're a freak (honestly I have medics taking a step back from me when I say I have psychosis... literally moving away )..... And then you get something like this and it's just a massive kick in the teeth. Here's me trying to get on with my life, take the meds that will help me keep stable and functioning and most importantly safe.... So to see my issues linked with being otherwise stupid... It's really not nice.

By all means start the debate around why people believe these theories, how they get started, how damaging they are etc because that's very very valid but.... It could be done without belittling or further stigmatising those of us with totally unrelated mental health issues.

@PrincessNutNuts

I believe those who believe things that make them a danger to themselves or others should be sectioned and de-radicalised.

Yet again...... This.. dangerous and stigmatising

Have you any idea what it takes to be sectioned? What extreme level of mental illness and risk you need to be at? I do.... And I can again tell you that linking something so serious, so life altering, so utterly terrifying.... To believing something about a vaccine.... It's just so painful to see.

Yes someone who thinks that a vaccine is a gvmt plot ergo won't have it does put others at risk yes that is true I'm not saying it's not. But likening that to the level of risk you need to be at to be sectioned.... Come on...

And fwiw just to clear it up and I'm going to then stop posting for my own sanity...
I don't believe any conspiracies about covid, I am pro all vaccinations, I follow the rules, I've work in a professional role. I have two degrees and I would say I'm pretty smart.....This isn't a brag before anyone gets at me, it really isn't - but I'm saying it because I'm this person, this educated, trustworthy person, who also has severe mental illnesses. You know - the things that this thread are trying to link.... They're just not in any way relevant to each other!

I don't mind the thread staying up, I'm not planning to report it and I'm also not planning to return to it. But I think maybe @Notcontent could you consider asking to change the title of your thread to be a little less stigmatising?

The discussion IS relevant but I wish it were kinder

@AquaFairySoul
Your well-written and logical posts demonstrate your point exactly.

Honestly some of the views in this thread are appalling with regards to those people who may have issues with their mental health.

Link to article about motivated ignorance and rationality

link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11229-020-02549-8

It's really important to know why people believe conspiraces and untruths. We are so vulnerable to this stuff and it's harmful, and a real threat to our society because (not a conspiracy theory) Bad People take advantage and feed these memes and disrupt society. If we think it's just mentally ill and and stupid people who believe these things and "I'm clever and rational and never would" then you are wrong. Clever and well educated people do believe these things. All the time.

It depends on the person.

Some will be genuinely unwell.

Others are really just profoundly thick, terrified of what’s happening and looking for the comfort of thinking someone/something is in control (even if their motives are malevolent).

I believe Covid is real and I don’t believe it was created for as my nefarious reasons.

I also believe that man has been to the moon.

But I believe that Dr David Kelly committed suicide - nor did the spy in the bag.

..,

This brilliant radio documentary is worth a listen if you have a spare 40 minutes - Jeremy Thorpe: A Silent Conspiracy

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04wz633

But I don’t believe that Dr David Kelly committed suicide - nor did the spy in the bag

I live in a town where there are a lot of 'hippies' and alternative thinkers, covid denial is very real here and a large proportion of people don't comply with lockdown or mask wearing.
I think the narrative that many people here have is that Covid is just the flu, and if they strengthen their immune system with wheatgrass and meditation then there is no way they can catch the virus. Many of them also believe in wider conspiracies, government cover ups etc.
So I think in many of these people it is a lack of understanding about how viruses work and the concept of immunity, I also think that 'questioning the narrative' is popular and acceptable here and makes these people feel as if they belong to a community and they get a lot of validation from each other for their beliefs.

I live in a town where there are a lot of 'hippies' and alternative thinkers
Is that town in the SW region?

This thread title is ill judged! One can also claim that those believing the mainstream media and not finding answers for themselves are even more stupid! It's likely that in reality neither people who believe or those who don't believe in conspiracies don't do much research for themselves. I'm amazed at the level of fear and panic amongst people due to COVID, all thanks to wholehearted belief in media and that the governments have our best interests at heart. I don't agree with most conspiracies on Covid but cannot help thinking that the events and measures do not make much sense.

@AquaFairySoul

And also the suggestion that if it's not mental illness then it is stupidity, is also bloody offensive. In saying that you're making stupid thoughts comparable to mental illness. I'm seriously pissed off about this thread. Try living with psychosis for a while, have it wreck your life and your families, live with the stigma of having to tell people what's wrong and then actually genuinely take a step back away from you because they're that scared.....and then come back and start this thread again.

Well said

Somebody mentioned moon landing conspiracy here. I would like to add to it that faking of the moon landing would have been impossible. At the time there was a fierce competition between the USSR and the US. Do people not think that the USSR would have all their eyes on this? They would be the first ones to discredit it, but they did not despite being a lying and controlling regime.

@PrincessNutNuts

I believe those who believe things that make them a danger to themselves or others should be sectioned and de-radicalised.

If this not an ironic post, it is scary.

You want people sectioned for a belief! You do realise what would happen if someone decided that belief was dangerous don’t you?

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but do question things! I have to admit (and I'm embarrassed to admit) that I sometimes have nagging doubts about the first moon landings - all looks a bit fake! I also sometimes question government choices and intentions.i often believe other things Niger than we know about contribute to decisions made.

I'm not stupid (my IQ is 155 and I have a PhD), but if you met me you might think I was as I really can't be bothered with snobbery, frequently admit my mistakes, and admit when I don't know stuff (which is daily!!!)

Sorry "bigger" not Nigel (whoever he is)

all thanks to wholehearted belief in media and that the governments have our best interests at heart
It is hard to believe the media when so many of the stories are not news at all, they are "maybes" or "hopes" or "possibilities".

Also, it is hard to believe that the Government have our best interests at heart when they seem to have other priorities before us mere plebs.
For example, £22 billion for the world beating Test & Trace system yet no money for FSM at half-term (until Marcus Rashford shamed them in to it).

Several members of my extended family seem to be on board with the current conspiracy theories. No history of mental illness, and fairly intelligent. The only thing I can think is that they have fallen down a social media hole.

Let's not use this as a thread to insinuate that you are more intelligent and superior to these people.

I appreciate the support of others thank you. As I said I'm not replying further for my own sake but I do appreciate that people have taken my point

I find this thread pretty offensive too, calling people thick because they happen to have an alternative opinion. You clearly think a lot of yourselves and that you're oh so intelligent. Get over yourselves.

Its mostly stupidity. They didn't listen to the scientific explanations back in March and April at the daily briefings and they cannot comprehend what would happen if we had no lockdown at all. They cannot imagine a situation of services, especially health, completely collapsing

They think is bad, but they have no idea at all of just how bad it could be