Are teachers more at risk from covid?

[notevenat20]

Did anyone listen to More or Less discuss this?

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m000rvjr

What do you think?

@TooManyPlatesInMotion I hope you can understand why my concerns are valid. There are 3 small children who no longer have a mum and 2 teenager boys without a dad. It's heartbreaking. Both were fit healthy people.

@Remmy123

No one can say for certain where they caught it.

I go nowhere other than work and home. I am in a room with 30+ children. I'm pretty clear where I caught it.

[quote Remmy123]@mumsneedwine I was just curious what's with the attitude?![/quote]
No need for wide eyed surprise. Why are you curious?

In my children's school 6 staff had it in the last week before Christmas- one in ITU on ventillation, others with long covid including the others who did not return for a good six weeks.
In my school, at least 6 staff had it in March- including three who still have long covid- 2 with no taste and smell still and one with severe fatigue and weird skin complaints still. Then we had another 5 staff sick in the first two weeks of term. That was with just keyworker and vulnerable children in and none of these staff had been in contact with each other so it was caught from children.

And those individual cases are awful and devastating for those families involved, without doubt @mumsneedwine. However, they aren't representative of the wider picture across the nation, or the views of scientists, statisticians (both those advising the gov and those not doing so), PHE or the Children's Commissioner.

That doesn't alter the fact that is is unbelievably horrible for families who have list someone of course.

There were also various bubble closures in both schools throughout the autumn term also. 4 different occasions in my children's school and 3 in mine separate the instances I mentioned above. What is really concerning and one reason why the data is questionable is that at no time has anything been classed as an outbreak. We are reporting to DFE and not PHE. Speaking to other teacher friends who have had multiple cases in their schools - I cannot find one who has actually had their multiple cases classed as an outbreak. There is massive gaslighting going on about what is happening in schools.

DH works in a primary school in London and since January, they've had about 40% of kids attending school, and 12 members of staff have tested positive for Covid. One is very ill in hospital. That's for a period of 4 weeks.

The government is criminally irresponsible if they don't acknowledge that schools are hotbeds for the virus.

I think it's been mentioned before in this thread, but obviously teachers aren't just worried about themselves - articles like this are very scary www.msn.com/en-gb/health/familyhealth/scientists-say-children-should-be-vaccinated-against-coronavirus/ar-BB1djTXt?ocid=msedgdhp

I am capable of seeing the flaws in the NASUWT data and the flaws in the ONS data at the same time. One does not cancel out the other. I'd be disappointed if that wasn't acknowledged actually.

@mumsneedwine

I thought you were off to work in the civil service and had resigned?

That doesn't alter the fact that is is unbelievably horrible for families who have lost someone of course.

Yes, and it's especially awful for those families that they know that the government has not funded schools, and has made no effort whatsoever to stop airborne spread of the virus in schools.

When someone dies and there is nothing that could have been done that's one thing. When someone dies and it very well could be the case that they might not have done had they been able to wear PPE / if the school had rotas / if there was better ventilation and social distancing then that's a whole different story.

It's like if there was a workplace accident on a building site and someone died but all safety protocols had been followed - that's a tragedy - if that particular site told their workers it was optional whether to wear hard hats or actively discouraged it (even though other sites were all wearing hard hats) then that's clearly not the same thing.

If schools had not closed over January I think teachers becoming seriously ill and possibly dying would have risen sharply because the weather prior to that was quite warm.

OK, I ahve now listened. I am really disappointed actually. By his normal standards that isn't probing. He does ask about dates but they leave the (challenged) ONS thing dangling at the end and really don't unpick it at all. It's quite a short slot really.

All of the studies are before the new variant , of course, which wrought havoc. That should have been mentioned.

frazzled are you and daisy the same person because I was responding to daisy?

I am well aware female nurses are on that post. Look at the top and it says high risk 'includes', not 'this is an entire list. I am not going to go away and look up teachers again now but am pretty sure secondary teachers are on a par with female nurses and male secondary teachers, excluded on that ONS list were higher than several on that list, oddly, at, iirc , 39.1 deaths per 100000.

Not sure your cattiness to mum was relevant or called for.

School Infection Survey was 150 schools in a small window of dates. Despite what eh said, I thought a major flaw at the time was that it was in low incidence areas (completely by accident) so several schools in Cambs were used.

It stopped just before cases rose.

They shouldn't have stopped it really.

@sherrystrull so you don't go into shops / petrol stations / do you live with anyone?

No one really knows for sure.

People on mumsnet have got it from staying in!!

@mumsneedwine those numbers are awfully high and you have very tragic examples.
In our school no teachers have been +ve - it’s very diverse isn’t it ?

[quote Remmy123]@sherrystrull so you don't go into shops / petrol stations / do you live with anyone?

No one really knows for sure.

People on mumsnet have got it from staying in!![/quote]
We don't go into shops. I live with people who work in schools and attend schools. We are very aware of the massive risk of all of us being in different bubbles so choose not to do anything else to put us at risk.

I think the chances of catching it in my classroom are hugely more than the one time I go to a petrol station wearing a mask and sanitise my hands straight after. All of my colleagues are like me. We are trying to keep each other as safe as we can by not putting ourselves at risk other than work.

@Piggywaspushed yes we are the same logged in using my ipad which has old user name.

I'm terms of a small window date it's a small window date for everyone including bus drivers etc (infection rates low throughout the summer due to very long lockdown) and no teachers were not on that list.

The small window was the reference to the SIS.

The list says includes. It isn't exhaustive. The ONS seems to have a desire to lump all teachers together. Separated out , male secondary teachers would be on the list. That's all I am pointing out. I am married to one, who is also CV.

Well I like to look at statistics when asking who is most at risk in the workplace. It is not teachers.

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/causesofdeath/bulletins/coronaviruscovid19relateddeathsbyoccupationenglandandwales/deathsregistereduptoandincluding20april2020

www.itv.com/news/2021-01-25/covid-statistics-reveal-twice-as-many-working-age-men-died-compared-to-women

@Frazzled6 I was. Couldn't leave until Easter though as teachers have to give a terms notice. However been offered my dream job in school and kids have sucked me back in. Especially my colleagues DD who asked me to stay for her. So I am. How can I leave her ?

@Pomegranatespompom so tragic. We had escaped ok in autumn term (lost my first colleague in March which hit us all so hard), but had a horrific 6 weeks from mid Nov. Once it got in it tore through school despite every effort to stop it. We've been told it was probably the new variant before it became known.

@sherrystrull there's no need for the rudeness and attitude. I tried to reassure teachers that parents don't in fact hate them and gave some insight into what some parents might be feeling and you attack me for it. Calm down and don't be so quick to assume that everyone's here to criticise you. I get that it's a sore point because teachers have come in for a lot of flak lately, but it'll do you no good to automatically jump to that position. Just be a bit more open to hearing other views.