“No onesies please as it makes the children in school jealous”

[Lemons1571]

A message from the head of our primary. Please could all parents at home please ensure their primary children are fully dressed in day clothes ready for their class 9am zoom. No onesies. Apparently the children actually allowed to go to school are annoyed seeing their classmates lounging at home in onesies / pj’s / loungewear.

Ummm, I’m sorry, I thought I heard you issuing instructions on what I must / must not do in my own house. What possible authority does a school have to do this? Kids forced out of face to face education. Being shown some lovely examples of the artwork done by the kids at school over zoom with the caveat “oh don’t worry I know you can’t do this at home”.

Read the room ffs. Just another request to put other people’s children before my own. As it happens my primary child gets dressed of his own accord, but if he wanted to wear a onesie then quite frankly anyone else’s opinion can fuck off.

Physically going to school = uniform worn as per school rules.
Physically barred from school = my house my rules.

No doubt I’m overreacting but it annoyed me!

@ineedaholidaynow

For those saying the school has no right to say what happens in your own home, if you are taking part in zoom calls etc with them, then for safeguarding reasons they do. What happens if you are a household that's quite happy to wander about in your underwear, would that be acceptable to be seen by the teacher/rest of the class?

Neither a 'onesie' or pyjamas are underwear, people are pretty well covered up in both.

If parents make sure their children are in school uniform for home lessons, do they then change out of it after the lesson? I just don't get the need for it.

I think it is a terrible intrusion to have cameras in your home and definitely would not co-operate with that for school lessons. Work sheets should suffice.

@LizFlowers
Not attending zoom lessons is now marked as non attendance.

That can't be right! DD doesn't have a camera!

@tootyfruitypickle

That can't be right! DD doesn't have a camera!

I'd assume in cases like that that's different as opposed to an active choice ifyswim.

And it appears the more I see these threads that it's not the same everywhere.

Fwiw I'm not a fan of the live lessons (but I still want op to clarify if the headteacher actually mentioned the onesies as I think we might find they didn't)

There are disadvantages and advantages on both side. School in school at the moment is nothing like what it usually would be.

In some schools, it's BETTER. Smaller groups, same teacher who has a lot more time to spend with each child.
Everything else is as normal, apart from the frequency of mandatory hand washing.

Playtime, outdoor classes, experiences are the same.

And frankly, no one is denying the right of children at school to enjoy themselves, it's not supposed to be a prison! But let's not pretend it's not obvious how much the ones at home are missing out.

Mine are in school uniform, as required by the school. I'm fine with that. Seems sensible. At the end of the day they get changed because we go out for a long muddy walk. It helps them differentiate between the school day when they have to work, and home. If the school hadn't requested it I'd probably have done that anyway.

I'm not sure why people get het up about having cameras in their home. Surely you can just sit in front of a blank wall or a cupboard or something when on zoom.

@Iknowwhatudidlastsummer

There are disadvantages and advantages on both side. School in school at the moment is nothing like what it usually would be.

In some schools, it's BETTER. Smaller groups, same teacher who has a lot more time to spend with each child.
Everything else is as normal, apart from the frequency of mandatory hand washing.

Playtime, outdoor classes, experiences are the same.

And frankly, no one is denying the right of children at school to enjoy themselves, it's not supposed to be a prison! But let's not pretend it's not obvious how much the ones at home are missing out.

Some schools.

Not IME.

And not in secondary.

Please remember why many children are in schools (not all because of key workers).
They are missing out on things that some at home aren't

It isn't as black and white as you say.

@LizFlowers some people's pjs might be quite skimpy, some boys might just sleep in their shorts/pants. Some people have to have it spelt out that these garments are not suitable for zoom lessons

[quote RootyT00t]@Lemons1571 can you confirm whether the head said the onesies thing or just to be dressed and parents have added in the blanks?[/quote]
I have just rewatched the clip (it’s the head talking on a video update). Head said that the “kids in class were finding it tough as the kids at home looked relaxed in their onesies so could they get dressed please”. Three times it was stressed that this applied “particularly on afternoon zooms”.

@Lemons1571 if he said those words, I take it back.

The way you worded it made me think he'd said the first bit but not the second.

But I reckon PP might be right about this being more to do with parents than kids.

I think it is a terrible intrusion to have cameras in your home and definitely would not co-operate with that for school lessons. Work sheets should suffice.

They are not mandatory, you can set up your pc or tablet on a neutral corner of your house, there's nothing intrusive. Most of the kids seem to be using a background which they seem to find very amusing.

Work sheets are not enough, and leave the children unmotivated, isolated and so bored.

In my school we initially had problems with kids turning their cam off so that they could doss. They'd then be expecting individual catch up 🙄 So current rule is if the kid has their camera off, they're asked to turn it on. If they refuse, they're removed from the lesson. They can come straight back in of course but will be bounced out again if they're refusing to turn their camera on. Generally removing once solves the issue very quickly as they can't pretend to their parent that they're working if they're not on the call.

It works for us because we know all of ours have cameras and the cam is important for keeping engagement - wouldn't work for all. We'd make exceptions if someone is having a lot of internet issues.

I wouldn’t say the home provision has been bad, its been much better than last time (primary). They have the right balance of live and independent working. I know they can’t get everything right and it must be hard for them to see it from the pov of their families at home. But it causes upset when my child sees artwork on zoom that is held up as “this is a good example of what to do”, when he hasn’t got access to pastels and all the other resources that had been used.

I get dressed every morning (wfh ft). They pay me, I do stuff. The school are not paying me to teach my child so I am not beholden to their wishes. It’s bloody hard enough as it is.

Yea DD is doing really well so I don't imagine it would be an issue not to have a camera.
She has one, it's just gone fuzzy, so it can be demonstrated as bust!

@tootyfruitypickle

Yea DD is doing really well so I don't imagine it would be an issue not to have a camera. She has one, it's just gone fuzzy, so it can be demonstrated as bust!

I can't see how long term they in any way implement that properly - you can't discriminate when people don't have technology.

RootyT00t
I'm in secondary and was going to say the same.

Sometimes I think it would be interesting to make a list of the reasons some of my students are in school, or the home lives some of them have and post them on mumsnet. Then see how many of the posters moaning that the children in school get a small group with the teacher / saying 'but how will11 year old DC manage in life without live zoom lessons' would really want to swap places.

Mumsnetter's child: happy healthy, neurotypical child with involved parent(s), a safe place to live, generally good wifi, somewhere to work, an appropriate device, enough food for the day.

Hypothetical child in the same school: deemed vulnerable, has a social worker, has to be in school so staff know they are safe and their absence triggers staff visiting the home regularly and reporting issues to social services. The child is in the process of trying to get an EHCP at KS3/4 because they've fallen through the cracks and their parents consider them stupid. The only meals they can rely on are school meals and they don't have another device other than their phone but that doesn't have much data.

If people really want to argue that a few weeks keyworker/vulnerable provision is really going to put the second child at an advantage then they need to wake up and realise the world is more than their narrow experiences

@Lemons1571

I wouldn’t say the home provision has been bad, its been much better than last time (primary). They have the right balance of live and independent working. I know they can’t get everything right and it must be hard for them to see it from the pov of their families at home. But it causes upset when my child sees artwork on zoom that is held up as “this is a good example of what to do”, when he hasn’t got access to pastels and all the other resources that had been used.

I get dressed every morning (wfh ft). They pay me, I do stuff. The school are not paying me to teach my child so I am not beholden to their wishes. It’s bloody hard enough as it is.

It's not about being beholden to their wishes. They have every right to say that the children need to be dressed.

My children hate going to school and I hate sending them in. They are do jealous of kids who can stay at home. I'm pleased with this rule. It's not fun working in hospitals at the moment and the kids know we are at risk from catching covid at work. That sucks more than your kids having to put on jumper and leggings.

My secondary school makes them wear uniform and checks it by turning cameras on

@RootyT00t those were the words!
I suspect it’s more about the teachers finding it hard to motivate the classroom kids once they’ve seen their friends at home.

luckily the secondary rules are no cameras as my teenager hasn’t got dressed for weeks

[quote Lemons1571]@RootyT00t those were the words!
I suspect it’s more about the teachers finding it hard to motivate the classroom kids once they’ve seen their friends at home.

luckily the secondary rules are no cameras as my teenager hasn’t got dressed for weeks[/quote]
Sometimes it can be something like one parent allowing w child to lie on the sofa in PJ's so it is just done as a general rule.

I don't think cameras should be the be all and end all but I don't agree that the school don't have the right. They do.

YABU. There is no reason the6 can’t wear the school uniform as requested

I am an introvert. I hate the intrusion of online lessons in my home. There are so many people in my house every day and it makes me pretty anxious and tearful. I am a teacher,I find my lessons I have to do two days a week ok, I do love seeing my class, but I find it draining and stressful in a way I don’t find classroom teaching. I hate hate hate all the online staff meetings, planning meetings, handover meetings. I hate that every morning my children are online and and 50 kids can see what’s happening in my home. I accept it’s my own issue.

Nonetheless, my kids are appropriately dressed for the zoom classes. Some days, I think they deserve a break and I’d rather they were lounging in their pjs because online learning and staying home almost all the time is intense. I feel being able to relax and plan our own day is one of the only advantages of lockdown and that has been taken away by these bloody online lessons. But I don’t want my kids to think it’s ok to have anyone see them in their PJs. So I ask them to get dressed.

@Crystal90567

My secondary school makes them wear uniform and checks it by turning cameras on

What if the parent doesn't turn any cameras on at home?