AZ - EU contract published

[Davros]

Breaking news on BBC

I thought the Oxford vaccine was being manufactured in Oxford ?

Bluethrough So miss out under 50? Is that your suggestion? How old are you?

The risk is low for a 48 year old but it’s not zero. So under your suggestion people here would lose family members that otherwise wouldn’t. Or in ICU

It’s ICU btw which does include under 65 naturally as it’s the middle age in the range

Anyway you keep going on and on about this on every thread.

Whilst the EU is going mad and taking aggressive action. Very odd.

On the other hand, I'm also glad to see the EU finally acting in the interest of their members

The EU isn't acting in the interests of all their citizens. There are millions of them living in GB.

[quote Baileysforchristmas]@Bluethrough no i haven’t. I have nothing against Europeans. Our papers are awful but so was the German paper against AZ, don’t go by the British media. I think most people in the UK have nothing against Europeans[/quote]
so long as we vaccinate everyone in the UK, your elderly and sick can die in their droves, we don't care, we have enough vaccine and we ain't sharing.
thats the UK's attitude.

Posters wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax rather than europeans, what does that tell you?

On the other hand, I'm also glad to see the EU finally acting in the interest of their members

The potential repercussions it faces from US won’t be in their interests

wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax

What don’t you like about Covax?

Posters wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax rather than europeans, what does that tell you? the EU is an incredibly rich and privileged group of countries. They can make their own vaccines.

Do you know what the govts 9 priority groups are?

so why are you suggesting i have said 50 as a cut off point? the Govt has stipulated this age, not me!!!

I am in my 50s, in a vaccine shortage, i would rather my vaccine go to a vulnerable person wherever they are then me.

If you listen to EU rhetoric avoiding a boarder between NI and ROI wasnt just about protecting peace in NI, it was about protecting peace in ROI too. RoI is a member state. Except it wasn't. It was about using the northern Ireland peace treaty to make Brexit as difficult as possible.

UK has gone through a lot of hardship to try and keep free that boarder as free as possible. As soon as it suits the EU to do so it has bung a boarder in without even consulting the affected member state. So it does impact on Brexit

Fighting over inadequate resource achieves very little, working together to increase global production is the only solution.
That's what is so sad. Aztrazeneca has done exactly that. It is running as a not for profit and trying to expand production across the world. The fact the EU has gone after Aztrazeneca shows how little regard it has for what the company is doing.

But actually in the long run. Neither of those two things are as important as what the EU's behaviour is suggesting in the long run.

If you are happy to use member states as political footballs, happy to tear up contracts when it suits you, and happy to consider seizing private property when it suits, the EU is not going to be a very comfortable place for business to invest....

thankyou @MarshaBradyo and @Frodont, you have made my point.

@Bluethrough

Do you know what the govts 9 priority groups are?

so why are you suggesting i have said 50 as a cut off point? the Govt has stipulated this age, not me!!!

I am in my 50s, in a vaccine shortage, i would rather my vaccine go to a vulnerable person wherever they are then me.

Great so you’ll be opting out

More excess for whomever we give it to

@Bluethrough some
Posters said covax but if you look at bigger picture why is eu more deserving than some other non eu countries if all are struggling and all have high deaths/ cases?
Yes they are our neighbours but do you not think excess should go to the most next in need be that france or brazil

so long as we vaccinate everyone in the UK, your elderly and sick can die in their droves, we don't care, we have enough vaccine and we ain't sharing.
thats the UK's attitude.

You keep repeating this shyte ad nauseum

What does it tell you about your precious EU if they are going to 'die in their droves' without having the excess doses from a country whose population is less than a fifth of the whole EU?

Oh, and Germany have said they won't use AZ for older people, and after Macron's (inappropriate) comments today it seems France won't either. So the 'elderly and sick' there won't be helped by Britain's theroretical excess doses.

Posters wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax rather than europeans, what does that tell you?

Why is someone from, say South Africa or Cambodia less precious than someone from Poland or Denmark? And shouldn't the world's biggest trading bloc have the ability to procure their own vaccines rather than being a charity case??

I am very glad I didn’t draft the AZ contract- it is very poor drafting especially clause 5. AZ would have not been given much opportunity to change terms and given they had a prior contract with U.K., I can’t see how a Belgium court would be able to impute intention in any of the clauses that the Uk plant would need to divert/share initial vaccine doses to EU. U.K. is not party to the agreement or any contract with the EU to share our supply, as the other EU member states are.

In addition, the US companies are leading the world in Covid vaccines. It isn’t clever to not call the US a friend in this situation, not sure what that German MEP was trying to achieve. I don’t expect Biden to say much openly to fuel the fire even more, but I don’t think he needs to.

The reactions of the Commission are childish. There are numerous vaccines in the pipeline. In addition, the Novavax one (trials have shown efficacy against the Kent strain) is manufactured in the U.K. so the EU should try and do this the friendly way. Not via trying to bully the only pharmaceutical company that tried to do the right thing and not make a profit. I wonder what the Nordic countries think of the situation. The Swedes won’t like it and will have felt proud of AZ.
Finally, I am very curious if the EU are talking to the Russians. I haven’t followed the Sputnik developments much. France/ Russia relations were good for many centuries. It would actually be good for Europe as a whole to become friendlier with Russia again. Let’s hope it blows over and something good comes out of this.

Posters wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax rather than europeans, what does that tell you?

I'd rather vaccines went to countries that dont have the money or facilities to manufacture their own.

I'd rather not prop up a failing superstate to does have the money to throw at a vaccination program but has not does so because... why?

Once the vulnerable gave been vaccinated in vulnerable countries and the UK has been vaccinated, then is the time to support the EU

@Bluethrough none of that was from me or the UK government, given the chance we would’ve come to a compromise, we were never given the chance.

@Hazelnutlatteplease that's what I was just saying to my dh. It doesn't make Europe look like a good place to do business. I'd be furious if I was Pfizer or Astra Zeneca just now.

The EU has gone nuts, it has lost it’s mind, it is not helping European citizens.

It all boils down to they do not have a patent to create priority vaccines contracts

Interesting, @Boulshired, could you explain the implications of that?

@Puzzledandpissedoff

Their behaviour has serious consequences which will extend beyond the pandemic,vaccine issues and national borders. I'd suggest they are now cultivating quite a dangerous and volatile situation. I'm no longer simply aghast at what they are doing I'm quite worried about how this might escalate. My sympathy for ordinary people remains but my contempt for the action on the EU Commission grows by the minute. They have lost their minds

Totally agree with all of this - god knows how this'll end up

Massive respect too for the many who've been honest enough to say they've changed their minds about leaving the EU. It takes integrity to change a position in light of developing events and it's refreshing to see

My friend was very pro leave and me the opposite. Her main stance was control of our own destiny.

Just had 1.5 hours on phone where I rang her and started with "well it turns out you may have had a point re brexit. And I may have been wrong. Actually - I think it may turn out I'm proved very wrong"

The great thing is being friends we can have such honest discussions and do respect each other views and despite her absolute right to gloat - she didn't

so long as we vaccinate everyone in the UK, your elderly and sick can die in their droves, we don't care, we have enough vaccine and we ain't sharing. thats the UK's attitude.

Posters wanted our excess vaccine to go to covax rather than europeans, what does that tell you?

It tells you that the UK is actually concerned about those countries who, through poverty, are in no position to obtain adequate supplies of the vaccine for their populations, unlike the rich EU states.

“Poor planning on your part does not necessitate an emergency on mine.” (Bob Carter)

@Bluethrough I think what that tells us is we want to help people who can’t help themselves rather than letting them suffer to bail out some of the richest countries in the world just because they’re European. They need to be throwing money at this, being nice to Astra Zeneca and the rest of the companies and world asking for help to get them out of the mess they’ve created by being so bureaucratic and inward looking. Instead they are throwing a tantrum blaming everyone else and threatening peace agreements and talking about wars.

I’m sorry for people living in the EU having to live with this shit show but it is the fault of the EU.

Just like what was said over and over in Brexit there is a big world out there. We can be friends with whomsoever we choose. The EU need to be more reasonable if they’re expecting help.

It doesn't make Europe look like a good place to do business

Nope. And lots of pharmaceutical companies are based in ROI, including Pfizer, Johnson & Johnson and Sanofi.

If I were Michael Martin I'd be raging that the EU had enacted Article 16 without even consulting ROI. It beggars belief, really.

@Hazelnutlatteplease Which countries do you have in mind would be more deserving?
How would ensure a fair distribution of vaccine rather than to their elites?

If you listen to EU rhetoric avoiding a boarder between NI and ROI wasnt just about protecting peace in NI, it was about protecting peace in ROI too. RoI is a member state. Except it wasn't. It was about using the northern Ireland peace treaty to make Brexit as difficult as possible.

What is your proof of this? Talking about the UK going through hardships to keep the 'boarder' open, Britain didn't even seem to remember that NI was thing until the EU brought it up. Don't pretend like the majority of Britain give even a tiny shit about NI, they didn't before Brexit and they don't now.