Is the government preparing is for a New Zealand scenario?

[lockdownbreakdown]

Does anyone else think we are going to be locked down until the majority are vaccinated and then the borders are going to be closed indefinitely to prevent new strains? I definitely get this vibe from all the stuff leaked in the press. It seems to be the only way we can stop new variant from ruining the vaccination programme as we cant vaccinate the kids if we let in new strains from abroad we will be going back into lockdown indefinitely. Thoughts?

Bloody hell hope not.

But then I live abroad and my kids haven't seen their GPS since Xmas 2019.

[quote Chaotic45]@MaxNormal that work can fuck off quite frankly. Because too many people were using this loophole.
Mainly the very rich and very powerful.

Do it via zoom, or don't do it at all. Not possible by zoom? Tough shit. [/quote]
Charming...looks like the campaign some in the media are running to stoke up envy about anybody setting foot in an airport is working well.

MaxNormal is right - there are a significant number of people who have to travel into/out of the UK by air, as passengers, so that you and others continued to be supplied with, amongst other things, PPE, drugs, Covid testing materials..let alone alone food, provide support for the UKs infrastructure (power, water), etc. No, a lot of it's not possible by bloody zoom and if some people stop travelling you really could be in " tough shit".

Fundamentally despite what some in the MSM are trying to get you think not everybody is travelling into the UK on a *** work "jolly" or a trip to attend a business meeting. I have no sympathy for those travelling on holiday but those in line at Heathrow are not "mainly the very rich and very powerful".

If they were trying to eradicate Covid, it'd have to be a tougher lockdown. No takeaways, click and collect, exercising with a friend, getting in the car to travel to park) nearby countryside, schools closed etc. My family are out doing four essential jobs, so it'd be a long time before there wasn't a risk for us while the above can still happen.

I hope not. ( My upcoming trip in August to see my father and brother is the only thing that keeps me sane. Will spend two weeks isolating both ways if needed, plus Covid test or vaccine, but want to have an option to travel. Feel like crying, what a shitty situation.

Yes I’m sure this is what will happen. There will be no summer holidays abroad as you would need to pay for pcr test at both ends before flying, quarantine here on return (possibly in a hotel) and probably quarantine on arrival in your resort ( the EU don’t want our variant and their vaccination programme is behind ours with supply issues with AZ and Pfizer vaccines).

@Athrawes

No, because you still refuse to do lockdown properly. You are still all visiting friends and family and going to school and work. We, in NZ stayed home. All of us. For 7 weeks. At home. No work. At all. You lie keep refusing to do this.

The first lockdown was 9 weeks of no school, no work except critical workers, all childcare closed except critical workers. Most offices are still closed 9 months later.

Our population is hugely different to NZ we are all crammed together with a population of 65 million on an island almost the same size. New Zealand has a population of 5 million spread across the entire island. We have nearly double that in London alone. Of course it is easier for NZ to stop the disease where they have space and a tiny population, coupled with a warmer climate.

@Angel2702

People (including this thread title) keep referencing New Zealand, instead of a place like South Korea with its population of 55 million: they never got to 'Zero Covid', but the virus levels were always incredibly low and manageable. Daily cases in the 10s a day during the summer, and in the upper 100s in the winter (i.e. their 'winter peak' looked like our summer). In that scenario you can keep schools and most things open.

You know what is driving me mad, these influencers, z celebs (yuk) in the Maldives or Dubai, working. Standing in a bikini, is now deemed essential work? I swear they hire a photographer for content pictures and are abusing a loop hole. Government really needs to look at this.

I don't think we'll be able to do that now. The airlines wouldn't survive and the government won't have the money to pay them. If we had done what New Zealand did, kept everything open but closed the borders back in March, we could have given millions to the airlines instead of spending it on furlough.

7 wks. Big whoop. How, pray tell, would the government organise and fund that in a country with this population? NZ and the UK are not comparable.

Our population is hugely different to NZ we are all crammed together with a population of 65 million on an island almost the same size. New Zealand has a population of 5 million spread across the entire island. We have nearly double that in London alone. Of course it is easier for NZ to stop the disease where they have space and a tiny population, coupled with a warmer climate

Yet after just 9 weeks of lockdown, despite keeping our borders open, we almost eradicated CV, daily infections down to less than a 1000 per day.

but instead of building on that with track and trace and a little easing of restrictions, we went full on free for all.
allowed a virulent strain to grow unchecked, opened up schools/unis/work.... even 5 days of xmas.

The Govt had a chance to really clamp down on Covid but chose not too.

btw NZ has quite a temperate climate, not quite Spain! CV doesn't seem to be a seasonal virus.

I don't think they could but I wish they would do so. IMO they should have never lifted the first lockdown and maybe we wouldn't be in such a difficult situation now, I do appreciate how hard it is for those with MH problems, single, lone parents, elderly etc and financially but the government needs to show how serious it is.

@WitchesBritchesPumpkinPants

No even these muppets realise we're a year too late to achieve that! AND the nature of the population is VERY different. People in NZ want to keep NZ 'clean' and will go the extra mile to do so, too many people here will just whinge & find loopholes.

I agree re loopholes, so many sending children to school and nursery when a parent is at home, meeting for “exercise”, non essential shopping trips and there are plenty that aren’t simply adhering to the rules.

I’d welcome the border closures with proper enforced hotel quarantine that comes at a high cost so that people simply don’t travel.

I also think there should be more restrictions to really drive down cases and not just fines for breaking rules as it’s obviously not a deterrent to many. Losing things like driving licences etc may put more off thinking the rules don’t apply to them.

In all honesty it looks as though we're in for at least another year of chaos and crisis, and probably no return to normality. Unless there is a change in government from utterly fucking useless to competence. Leadership has never been more important, and so lacking. The messaging is as clear as mud, and devoid of emotional intelligence.

@Ginandshinythings

You know what is driving me mad, these influencers, z celebs (yuk) in the Maldives or Dubai, working. Standing in a bikini, is now deemed essential work? I swear they hire a photographer for content pictures and are abusing a loop hole. Government really needs to look at this.

You'd need to look at when some of these images were taken, then look at the regs in force (travel corridors etc) at that time before judgng whether rules have been broken or not.

FWIW re "essential work", the ever changing list of those exempt from quarantine into the UK gives an indication of which jobs are considered by HMG, not people on MN, as "essential"..

I don't agree with some of the categories but the UK would stuffed without the likes of "seasonal agricultural workers", who are hardly rich and powerful..there are a lot of jobs on that list that contrary to some opinion cannot be done wfh or on zoom.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-travellers-exempt-from-uk-border-rules/coronavirus-covid-19-travellers-exempt-from-uk-border-rules

I disagree that people are travelling abroad for essential work purposes only, not true. There are people using this as a loop hole then spreading the virus around. Don't make me laugh saying there aren't, I know of people who have done it. It's not rocket science to know this is an extremely infectious position to put yourself in and more importantly others. Plenty of people have lost their jobs but it doesn't bode well when others are behaving in such negligent ways. Essential work means what exactly? I also know plenty of people whose employers have deemed them 'essential' workers. They are no such thing.

@Athrawes

No, because you still refuse to do lockdown properly. You are still all visiting friends and family and going to school and work. We, in NZ stayed home. All of us. For 7 weeks. At home. No work. At all. You lie keep refusing to do this.

Surely not everyone stayed at home. Police, health workers etc. for a start must have been working.

And who pays the bills when people can't work?

People have very different ideas of what essential actually means. The government is so vague because it doesn't want to be seen as the bad cop but it's really not helping. We would have been better with much harsher, stricter restrictions than the half hearted attempt at use your own judgement approach. Quite frankly we have some people doing what the fuck they want, whilst openly bragging that they will pay the fine, whilst others are terrified and daren't so much as open the door.
People who have to work through out who feel they have been thrown under the bus so if they want to go to the shop for chocolate and wine then they damn well will. Others who have lost their job and feel that they need to do certain things to get by. Home workers who can't cope with their kids at home so they bend the rules and send them to school. Others who keep their children off school because they think it's safer.
Yet others who don't seem to grasp that we are in a pandemic and expect
the most ridiculous customer service.
I guess it needs saying again : We are all in the same storm but we are not all in the same boat.

@Onlinedilema

Essential work means what exactly?

That sort of question/comment is exactly why I posted the link a few minutes ago - that's pretty much the current definitive list of who HMG think are essential and is worth a read - that the sorts of jobs on that list even exist might surprise a few....

If people are taking the micky and travelling for leisure then "Border" should be sorting it out...

Do people really believe that our current problems are caused by people at the moment nipping off to the Costa Del Sol in January? It’s all for headlines, popular cause they have fucked everything else up! A distraction from their failings.

The virus is endemic, zero covid is a fantasy. Locking borders to keep out any ‘mutants’, that policy will be in place until the entire world is vaccinated (and we only have a 80% approval rate for uptake of the virus anyway!)

Too many exemptions to make it workable - how do you propose we get vaccine deliveries, medicines, food - we aren’t self sufficient. Goods have to move in and out of the country. With people movements brings the virus but we need that for the majority to survive!

Do it via zoom, or don't do it at all. Not possible by zoom? Tough shit.

My BIL is a medical engineer. He went abroad (although not from the UK) to fix a specialised piece of hospital equipment. He's one of a handful of people in the world who could fix it, none of whom were in the same country as the hospital. But 'tough shit' to anyone who needs medical equipment during a pandemic, huh?

We can but hope. Should have done it a year ago.

@winetomorrow

From a British person in NZ... our first lockdown was weeks of nothing. No going to work. Supermarkets/shops where essential, but that was it. I work for lawyers and fully expected to be told I couldn't work from home/old school/need access to deeds. But government said NO! Every person that didn't have to be physically present in a role had to stay home. And if you did need to be present in an office then too bad, work we'd to claim the subsidy. The worst lawyers I knew (in NZ, so paling in comparison to some of the old school people I've for before in the rest of the world) all shut down their practice and worked from home as best they could. Key workers were hospital staff, food distribution and that was pretty much it. No takeaways, no nothing. If you weren't involved in keeping people alive you're not a key worker. And it worked! 6 weeks of nothing has meant a year of normalacy, except the rest of the world is locked off. We miss you, sort it out and join us!

First national lockdown was very similar here. Difference is we aren’t a backwater with a handful of people but a densely populated country of 66m people and a major finance/business hub.

First national lockdown was very similar here. Difference is we aren’t a backwater with a handful of people but a densely populated country of 66m people and a major finance/business hub.

Yep the NZ posts are getting very tired

Yes we are not and could never be like New Zealand. So well done, very happy that your 7 week lockdown worked considering your tiny, spread out population and the fact that you are pretty isolated out there.

I don’t think a zero COVID policy will work and they need another plan quite frankly. It’s here to stay so why decimate the economy for years trying to achieve the unachievable and ruining many lives, especially the young.