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Can we unlock the schools at start of Feb?

776 replies

MeandT · 21/01/2021 17:49

I'm totally supportive of the lockdown BUT by the end of next week, case numbers nationally will be the same as they were at end of November. Hospital admissions are falling again.

Rather than going back into tiers with the shops and food pubs open (where all the spreading happened in December), can we not issue all the teachers with N95 masks (and vaccines for the clinically vulnerable), make all the kids wear triple layer face masks all the time, and just get on with the important job of educating this country's kids in person? Starting again 1st of Feb.

AIBU to ask if we can send the kids back as soon as we hit the case rate we unlocked at on 2nd December?

IABU= no way, the cases will shoot up too quickly again, even if they all wear masks all day.

IANBU = yes, get them back before half term, the only reason it went nuts in December was because everyone was out Christmas shopping and seeing family.

OP posts:
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Turtleshelly · 22/01/2021 01:57

Using not going.

What I’d give for an edit button!

Turtleshelly · 22/01/2021 01:58

The latest data shows primary and secondary teachers are at twice the risk as the average public. Primary TAs are at three times the risk.

Wheresmykimchi · 22/01/2021 02:02

@Turtleshelly

The person above moaning when teachers call her is the very same type of poster that moaned teachers didn’t call in the first lockdown. Some people just love to bitch and moan and hate others. Let’s be nice we’re all struggling.
Quite. a day ago there was a thread about a teacher not responding to daily emails and messages!
Wheresmykimchi · 22/01/2021 02:03

@EscapeGoated

Not entirely sure why I'm bothering but here goes.

Teachers are working their arses off just now (most of them). It takes easily twice as long to delivery good remote learning than it does in a classroom.

The majority of kids are probably having a more stable education now than they did between summer and Christmas. Just because your school had no cases, doesn't make it true for all. Plenty of schools had a lot of cases and in a secondary 'bubbles' don't exist so one positive case in a class could mean 160+ kids off for 2 weeks to isolate (6 or more different subjects + lunch + PE + form class + bus to school and on and on). In some schools the whole school had to close due to staff and pupils either testing positive or having to isolate. Some kids had to do the 2 weeks isolation more than once (so a month or more off school).

We had huge amounts of kids that suddenly developed asthma and their parents sent a letter saying they were exempt from masks in corridors (after 3, 4, 5 years in the school without a single medical issue or even a hint that they might have asthma on the forms that are completed every year by parents). Huge amounts more that simply didn't bother and our only option to deal with it was 'ask them to wear one and give out a mask to them' - which was usually found on the floor further up the corridor if they even bothered to stop and take it.

You can't just decide to cancel a whole professions contract to suit your childcare needs, and the suggestion that you think we should just not get any break at all is pretty rich considering you're moaning that you can't even get your own child to do one bit of phonics. That's right Your. Own. Child.

How do other European Countries manage to keep schools open? Not all have, and those that do are not packing 30 kids into a room around the size of the average sitting room with zero social distancing or masks. The kids all wear masks in most other countries from as young as 4 or 5 years old, there is not of this 'muzzling' bullshit or claims that we are somehow harming them by getting them to wear a damn mask.
The British public seem to be so damn entitled its no wonder our Covid rates are out of control. This board was FULL of threads before Christmas about people justifying why they were going to break the rules or why they felt the rules shouldn't apply to them. There are stories in the paper every damn day about shit like a houseful of people at a baby gender reveal party (WTF) or a car load of people driving 300 miles for a Macdonalds. Thread upon thread of people justifying why they think their child should be in school right now and fuck everyone else.

Come tell that to the (mid 30's) staff member at my school who spent 3 weeks in intensive care and hasn't been able to return to work since then. Tell that to the kids who have lost a parent to Covid. Tell that to my colleague who was infected with Covid at school and spread it to her partner who died (late 40's btw).

Look at the schools who are having to close now to all including 'keyworkers' children and vulnerable children due to ever spreading infections and staff getting ill. And that is when the schools are meant to be closed to all but those who absolutely have to be in...

Imagine if they were still full?

Hospitals are at or way beyond capacity - in a normal year Scotland has 170 or so ICU beds. At the moment there are over 260 being used with over 160 of that being Covid patients. And Scotland has way lower infection rates than England.
When the NHS is in the position that it is having to cancel or postpone other treatments for serious conditions (even cancer in some places) does that not tell you that the NHS is at breaking point?

Schools aren't closed to protect teachers. They aren't closed to stop children getting Covid. They are closed because they are a big factor in transmitting the virus and the NHS cannot cope at the moment.

Hear hear.
Turtleshelly · 22/01/2021 02:03

[quote 2fallsagain]Interesting article - evidence from scientists to the select committee.

Schools reflect but do not drive community transmission, vaccinating teachers is not part of the get kids back to school plan and there is likely to be a regional approach to opening.

Essentially schools will open when cases and hospital admissions come down and they will be the first to open.

That's all anyone knows.

schoolsweek.co.uk/covid-19-nine-things-we-learned-from-scientists-at-education-committee/?mc_cid=f0ed556937[/quote]
Literally hours after this committee, after which Harries said teachers aren’t at a greater risk, data was released showing they are at twice the risk. At least twice. TAs 3x and additional needs schools way higher.

The same Harries who said mass gatherings aren’t a risk, masks aren’t needed, testing and tracing isn’t needed and kids are at greater risk of a road accident than catching Covid (she now admits transmission is high in kids... and road accident data is v low) oh and children in YR and Y1 don’t share lunchboxes.

2fallsagain · 22/01/2021 02:53

@noblegiraffe

Where has that been reported?

That the scientists on the ed select committee didn't seem to know their arse from their elbow? You just needed to listen to what they were saying and compare it to what happened before Christmas.

That doesn't really help. You can't say something is bullshit and then not reference how or why. I'm not saying you are not right but if you are going to challenge the evidence given to the committee then it's helpful to back it up rather than just say "they don't know their arse from their elbow. I'm not following every detail and I don't tend to venture on to these threads.
loulou0987 · 22/01/2021 06:43

I just wondered if you worked in education or healthcare and understood the practicalities of what you are proposing? Completely not a dig, but can what you are suggesting work??

solittletime · 22/01/2021 07:04

I just wish there was some sort of creative approach to help children socialise. Instead of re opening completely, even just half the class coming in twice a week for a few hours, doing the daily mile and chatting, a simple PE and drama games in the playground, even a local open space! It would give the children such a morale boost and help them cope with lockdown for longer.
Instead of everyone bashing heads on opening or not opening, shy are the government not giving any scope for creative discussion and creative solutions? We are in a crisis but no one seems to want to look at h the e situation from a different angle

Spikeyball · 22/01/2021 07:18

Masks for ALL wouldn't work because large numbers of those who most need to be in school can't wear masks.

trying22432 · 22/01/2021 07:25

Yes!
No masks for kids!! They are kids.
Also the masks are not stopping this virus from spreading it is more a form of reassuring people so they can still get on with their lives somehow.
Masks are useless in this case and are causing other health problems. Definitely not good for kids to wear 6 hrs in school.

DecemberSun · 22/01/2021 07:28

Masks for all is the way forward temporarily. If the DCs can't (or won't) wear them they can continue to be educated at home.

We have to stop putting people at risk when there are solutions.

Masks, social distancing, ventilated classrooms.

MarshaBradyo · 22/01/2021 07:29

[quote smogsville]@happinessischocolate says:

Majority of people never use so much of what is taught at school, Macbeth? Crop rotation? The tudors and Henry VIII. Kids can miss some learning. It's not going to do them any harm. And i say that as the parent of a year 11 who missed some of his mocks due to illness.

Do lots of other posters agree with this? I emphatically don't but am interested in how many do.

Great username btw. I'm not trying to start a fight, just genuinely interested in others' views here as I'm definitely in an echo chamber IRL.[/quote]
No no agreement here. Would loathe to lose learning by choice

EmmanuelleMakro · 22/01/2021 07:32

@PurpleDaisies
If I was speaking as a “true teacher”, I’d remind you that sentences start with a capital letter
How patronising - and ironic.
‘If I were speaking as a teacher...’
Hoping you do not teach English to any year groups

EmmanuelleMakro · 22/01/2021 07:34

Also the masks are not stopping this virus from spreading it is more a form of reassuring people so they can still get on with their lives somehow.
Masks are useless in this case and are causing other health problems. Definitely not good for kids to wear 6 hrs in school.

This.
No science behind it (dentist studies showed this) /sheer superstition.

kowari · 22/01/2021 07:34

Masks, social distancing, ventilated classrooms
Ventilation first in my opinion. It seems to be avoided in many situations because of the whingers. Just put more clothes on, relax uniform rules or do away with them for now.

trying22432 · 22/01/2021 07:35

This Covid business is really getting on my nerves now...honestly people wake up!
Why do people believe blindly in the media?
This is destroying our children's lives and it's ridiculous you can't see it.

People are dying from cancer more than ever suicide rates are doubling and all everyone seem to care about is this bloody Covid that now it's overtaking our lives.

I don't are of the backlash of my post ... I talk to people on a daily basis and people are truly fed up and yet are too scared to say exactly how they feel because of people accusing them of being Covidiots. Well not agreeing with lockdowns not agreeing with the treatment we get in hospitals atm if we don't have Covid it doesn't make you a covidiot. Covid is real but not above all other illnesses and not above a normal life.

People are losing their livelihoods and I don't understand how some of you are still pushing for lockdowns to continue. Unless you are comfortable in you 500k house with no mortgage or unless you are getting full pay package and truly could not give a f* whether are losing their homes because hey ho you are comfortable.

BelleSausage · 22/01/2021 07:35

You could try but lots of schools would not be able to fully ‘re-open’ because they have been open to key worker and vulnerable students and infections have taken out huge numbers of staff- even with these reduced numbers.

DDs school would not be able to re-open. Her teacher and TA are currently both hospitalised with COVID and two other teachers are very ill at home. That accounts for half the class teachers. Four more TAs are at home isolating.

We’d be back to rolling school closures, soaring infection rates and endless self isolations for exam groups.

It was only barely working before the new variant. It wouldn’t work at all now the more transmissible version is so wide spread.

mrshoho · 22/01/2021 07:38

@trying22432

This Covid business is really getting on my nerves now...honestly people wake up! Why do people believe blindly in the media? This is destroying our children's lives and it's ridiculous you can't see it.

People are dying from cancer more than ever suicide rates are doubling and all everyone seem to care about is this bloody Covid that now it's overtaking our lives.

I don't are of the backlash of my post ... I talk to people on a daily basis and people are truly fed up and yet are too scared to say exactly how they feel because of people accusing them of being Covidiots. Well not agreeing with lockdowns not agreeing with the treatment we get in hospitals atm if we don't have Covid it doesn't make you a covidiot. Covid is real but not above all other illnesses and not above a normal life.

People are losing their livelihoods and I don't understand how some of you are still pushing for lockdowns to continue. Unless you are comfortable in you 500k house with no mortgage or unless you are getting full pay package and truly could not give a f* whether are losing their homes because hey ho you are comfortable.

You still don't get it.
FreekStar · 22/01/2021 07:38

My dd's school has definitely had ventilation, the kids have been able to wear their coats in class, but still they have had lots of children with covid and she's had to have 3 separate periods of self isolation last term, so have missed 8 weeks. Clearly ventilation isn't key! It just helps. The only sure way to avoid covid is to not go near anyone who has it. Which is pretty impossible in a school.

BelleSausage · 22/01/2021 07:41

And I would also say that I didn’t know anyone who had it in the first wave and now I know at least ten very ill people and two dead.

FreekStar · 22/01/2021 07:41

Still waiting for those who are advocating outdoor learning to tell me what 200+ children are going to do in a concrete yard all day!

trying22432 · 22/01/2021 07:42

I honestly get it more than anyone else. Unlike others I have been following the rules and don't even have a bubble....like others seem to use for their convenience. I didn't have people over at Christmas but I know people who where felt so strong about following the rules but wait a minute ...I can't have my brother alone at Christmas and I'm going to pick him up from Cambridge ( where he lived in a shared house) to spend Christmas with me.
What annoys me is that people who preach these lockdowns are the ones who break them the most when it's most suitable for them.
People are selfish and hypocrites at the highest level

Spikeyball · 22/01/2021 07:43

"Masks for all is the way forward temporarily. If the DCs can't (or won't) wear them they can continue to be educated at home."

Think about it. Many children in the vulnerable category cannot wear masks. Many of those children are currently in school because of needing the routine, mental health issues or their needs being too great for their families 24/7. If that place is removed as well as causing great suffering to those young people and their families it will be cause big problems at society level. The needs of these children will not be met. I for one would be insisting on a residential placement which would have to be provided which will cost hundreds of thousands a year as well as putting many more adults in direct contact with my teenager. Many other parents would do this and there is no capacity for it. Insisting on masks for absolutely all is a suggestion made by people who have no idea about the consequences of doing this.

trying22432 · 22/01/2021 07:43

And our kids lose them most!

People who continue with these stupid rules will destroy all our lives forever