Oh ffs just shut the borders already

[Circumlocutious]

‘PM concerned by Brazilian variant’

Sure, the mutation may be insignificant. Sure, we might be able to quickly tweak the vaccines so that they still work against it, if it all. Or it might completely fuck everything up and we end up a strain that vaccine-resistant. If not the Brazilian one, then it could be another mutation that emerges somewhere in an intensive factory farm four months from now.

I think the world won’t learn this lesson - that near borderless travel and weak quarantine rules are not sensible in a pandemic - until it’s too late.

The UK and ROI should have talked together at the start of the news about the strange pneumonia spreading from Wuhan, and both should have agreed to close borders together and keep one another safe.

As mentioned many, many times--you can ban travelers without banning freight.

I just wondered what "close the borders" brigade want to do about about the BRITISH who live in Norn.

I haven't seen my family in the UK for a really long time and probably won't do so this year, either. It's shit, but there's a pandemic going on right now.

Ensuring freedom for NI people should have formed a motivation for the UK and ROI working together on this issue. If Ireland and the UK had formed a single bubble, NI people could have continued to go back and forth as they please.

I am really struggling to comprehend how a party that practically got elected on the back of the "control our borders" rhetoric are too bloody scared to do just that.

Sorry, MN seems to have eaten the post I just wrote, but Brexit has probably complicated things.

There has been muddle right from the start about what Brexit was supposed to be about. Many pro Brexit people thought of it as being about controlling borders, while others seemed to want to turn the UK into an agile Singapore which could sidestep the EU and trade directly with other partners, esp emerging economies.

I think the slightly desperate desire to form favorable trade agreements with various countries has made the government reluctant to cause offence by shutting flights down.

At any rate... Who would want to come to visit new variant lockdown Britain?

The biggest issue is too many thickie Brits going abroad then coming home, potentially incubating "it", many of the worst offenders being friends and family of sitting MPs, well known journalists and other high profile or high wealth individuals.

It needs to stop.

Wasn't there a suggestion of this over the summer and the airlines and public kicked up a fuss - as they deserved a holiday!!

I was listening to LBC last week and a pilot called in. He said it was unbelievable how lax things are in the UK compared to other countries. He said he had literally flown 000s of people in on 777s and they were just left to disperse to wherever they wanted.

I agree it's utter utter madness and something needs to be done urgently

I'm a little confused as to why Johnson felt the need to mention being concerned about this particular new variant today.

We've known about the South African variant for weeks without any action.

Another has been reported in Nigeria.

Why is this one causing him concern?

People who went to Spain in August did not bring new variants now. Afaik quarantining for arrivals to USA is completely dependent which state you enter, there's no national policy for international arrivals.

Ever heard of a little place called New Zealand

Yeah, little place with a low population thousands of miles from anywhere with no land border to another country.

Ever heard of a large place called Australia - where they managed to close their internal state borders to keep the virus contained?

There always seems to be someone willing to excuse why the UK have handled this so badly

Closing the borders doesn't help when we rely on food and medicine imports.

Why do people keep banging on with the same old story. Countries with closed borders still allow freight in, it is visitors who are banned. And even then not all visitors - there has been plenty of international sport being played in Australia and NZ, but the athletes have to quarantine before being let loose on the playing fields.

I can't understand why all passenger planes haven't been grounded.

WHY are people still flying in and out?

Apart from freight or repatriation through embassies, we should not be travelling in or out of the country.

I have a theory which could be completely wrong. Richer people[didnt put rich people, just richer people].

Richer people use nannies and cleaners. They can still work in peoples' homes right through a pandemic.
Richer people fly frequently. Maybe why flights not stopped or much quarantine enforced.

WHY are people still flying in and out?

DH has flown in and out a few times for work.

WHY are people still travelling

I think there is some belief that there are hordes of selfish holidaymakers out there. I wish there was data on footfall at airport work vs leisure, because I cannot believe it can be the case. If it is the case, all countries should require neg cv19 test tbh, at boarding and landing, that should weed out the false neg issue mentioned upthread.

The gov quarantine exemption list for workers gives an idea of who is travelling at present for work.

In my circle of acquaintances, I don't know anyone who travelled for leisure, but I know some who travel for work.

Do you understand what happened when France closed the border on us?

All closing the border will serve is teach others to do what China did. Lie and hide. I felt it was really important that the UK identified the new variant here and alerted the world. And also thought the way the rest of the world responded was not positive. So no I don't think closing the border will help.

MaxNormal

I hope not, DH is flying to the Middle East on Friday.

Me too, Tunisia (from France where I live though- so glad I’m not home in England) for my wedding. I’m nearly 34 I want to actually have my fucking life thanks, security of marriage and the chance to have children before I’m too old. Sick of this crap. Keep yourself safe and you’ve nothing to worry about have you.

@LadyInParis congratulations! I hope you have a wonderful day and that it all goes smoothly for you.

I think as a minimum we should be allowing travellers from Brazil (and maybe neighbouring countries?) into the UK. Why is that so hard - it is not like we have lorries of food carrying half of our food arriving from there like we do the EU.
Same with South Africa. It was all the wealthy people taking holidays in or via SA (e.g. Kay Burley) who were not required to quarantine because they flew business/first class or flew economy but no-one enforces quarantine in the UK which led to these variants spreading in the UK.
Maybe the police could stop policing countryside walks and care home visits to sick elderly relatives and start policing the actual law: face coverings/quarantine/self-isolation.
These are all laws that the police is failing to police, while spending their valuable time forming road blocks to stop people driving for their exercise. It is clear which is more of a thread to virus transmission, yet Priti Patel and the cabinet and the police refuse to police the actual law and instead 'police' non-binding Guidance.

Clearly I forgot a 'not', we should NOT be allowing travellers from Brazil...

MaxNormal

@LadyInParis congratulations! I hope you have a wonderful day and that it all goes smoothly for you.

Thank you so much! It’s already been pushed back and pushed back, we should be married by now already! I follow the rules I wear the masks I rarely go out my mental health has suffered as has my fiancé’s health in terms of the stress of working from home. It’s making his job much more complicated and therefore much longer working hours sometimes (often) into the early hours. We have given up so much. And since it is getting worse, we are taking advantage of the fact that right now we can marry if we do it before it does all get worse with new strains. Otherwise we will marry in what, a year? Two? When it all blows over? Then my chances of children is so so low. I’m willing to be confined and have all the above and have my freedom curtailed etc, more than happy but I draw the line at losing my wedding and my future family. We have to have Covid tests before travel, and back in Paris quarantine. All fine. It’s the fault of the slow government not the population. It’s too late to close borders.

Anyway my rant! Good luck for your husbands travels! Hope he has a good journey and stays well

@cardswapping

WHY are people still travelling

I think there is some belief that there are hordes of selfish holidaymakers out there. I wish there was data on footfall at airport work vs leisure, because I cannot believe it can be the case. If it is the case, all countries should require neg cv19 test tbh, at boarding and landing, that should weed out the false neg issue mentioned upthread.

The gov quarantine exemption list for workers gives an idea of who is travelling at present for work.

In my circle of acquaintances, I don't know anyone who travelled for leisure, but I know some who travel for work.

I'm mystified that so many people still think travellers are choosing to visit the UK for a holiday Those that are travelling, are presumably doing so for business purposes. Essential business.

So Boris says all travellers from Brazil must have a negative test before travelling but what about the people who are negative when they land in the U.K. and then a few days later may test positive? Surely we need to close the borders?

I'm mystified that so many people still think travellers are choosing to visit the UK for a holiday
The travel from Brazil includes those travelling back from there to the UK, so UK residents still taking holidays etc.
Plus business purposes can generally be done by internet. And many other countries are managing without business travel when they have closed their borders. It really isn't worth the risk of a worse new variant than our own new variant.

And there still people taking holidays. There was a councillor a couple of days ago who reminded her town on social media to stay at home - posted from her holiday in the Maldives IIRC.

@Kokeshi123

The UK and ROI should have talked together at the start of the news about the strange pneumonia spreading from Wuhan, and both should have agreed to close borders together and keep one another safe.

As mentioned many, many times--you can ban travelers without banning freight.

I have no words