Oh ffs just shut the borders already

[Circumlocutious]

‘PM concerned by Brazilian variant’

Sure, the mutation may be insignificant. Sure, we might be able to quickly tweak the vaccines so that they still work against it, if it all. Or it might completely fuck everything up and we end up a strain that vaccine-resistant. If not the Brazilian one, then it could be another mutation that emerges somewhere in an intensive factory farm four months from now.

I think the world won’t learn this lesson - that near borderless travel and weak quarantine rules are not sensible in a pandemic - until it’s too late.

PicsInRed I'm pretty sure he'll get back in okay but I guess we'll see.

Ever heard of a little place called New Zealand

Yeah, little place with a low population thousands of miles from anywhere with no land border to another country.

@lightand

Not that I necessarily disagree with you, but as someone else pointed out on another thread, what about the NI/ROI border?

What about Liverpool and Manchester?

Regional lockdown. We can lockdown the island of Great Britain whilst remaining one with NI. It'll just be Tier 6 - no casual travel in.

Flying people round the world in a pandemic

whilst ordering other people to stay home and keep their potential viral particles to themselves does seem odd.

Agree. Look how quickly borders around the world shut like dominos when the British strain was reported (rightly so). The Govt.’s first duty is to protect its citizens.

@InterfectoremVulpes

Ever heard of a little place called New Zealand

Yeah, little place with a low population thousands of miles from anywhere with no land border to another country.

Australia. Approximately 25 million people. Multiple disparate states (it's a matter for the states!), multiple land (and sea) borders, illegal landings to manage - yet they're keeping infection overall low though closed (to casual travel) external national borders and regional lockdowns and border closure to squash any flares.

@PicsInRed
We can lockdown the island of Great Britain whilst remaining one with NI

Not what I would call a "shut the border" that @Circumlocutious talks about.
And NI has a border with ROI, which is still in the EU.

Just saying.

But I get where the op is coming from.

@jasjas1973 not making anything worse! this government has got form for locking the stable door once the horse has bolted

i stand by what i says bet its here already!

@PicsInRed
But they are in their summer presently.
When the UK had summer, our covid deaths were at 80 a day for weeks. Not ideal, obviously, but covid does seem to act like flu in that Sept - Mar/April is far worse that May-Aug/Sept

Northern Ireland.

I just wondered what "close the borders" brigade want to do about about the BRITISH who live in Norn. They aren't freight. They have free movement with RoI which (last I checked) is an international border. Would you want the Norn residents to "prove need" to be able to travel to GB.

@Tal45

It's the Yes Minister 'standard foreign office response' again isn't it.

Yes it is.

And I don’t think the government really had an excuse in January PicsInRed. Head in the sand. I was praying they’d wake up and not trigger brexshit.

@InterfectoremVulpes

Ever heard of a little place called New Zealand

Yeah, little place with a low population thousands of miles from anywhere with no land border to another country.

I get that the comparisons don’t strictly work with New Zealand. What about South Korea? (population of 52 million - cases have barely risen above more than 1000 / day for the last year, and were generally in the low 100s a day max for the winter period).

Somehow I don’t think those excuses would be pedalled out if a virus is circulating that had the same attack rate but targeted children. I don’t think then we’d be saying ‘it’s impossible, there’s nothing we can do’.

Could also ask about residents of Gibraltar, also British...

@InterfectoremVulpes

Ever heard of a little place called New Zealand

Yeah, little place with a low population thousands of miles from anywhere with no land border to another country.

And a massive tourism industry

It's hardly Craggy Island!!!

[quote lightand]@PicsInRed
But they are in their summer presently.
When the UK had summer, our covid deaths were at 80 a day for weeks. Not ideal, obviously, but covid does seem to act like flu in that Sept - Mar/April is far worse that May-Aug/Sept[/quote]
This is South Korea’s winter. Definitely a seasonal effect with covid, I agree, but because they’d quashed it in the summer, their winter peak (1000ish cases) resembled our summer last year

I'm no expert, but Mexico's chief epidemiologist insists that closing borders against covid is useless and Mexico just got its first case of the UK variant of covid brought in by a Brit.

@lljkk

Northern Ireland.

I just wondered what "close the borders" brigade want to do about about the BRITISH who live in Norn. They aren't freight. They have free movement with RoI which (last I checked) is an international border. Would you want the Norn residents to "prove need" to be able to travel to GB.

People from Manchester couldn't go for a jolly in London. People from Bristol couldn't climb Pen y fan. People from the Borders couldn't jump to and fro.

They all lived.

I haven't been able to go into Edinburgh my nearest city for weeks but flights are arriving there every day.

[quote GirlCrush]@jasjas1973 not making anything worse! this government has got form for locking the stable door once the horse has bolted

i stand by what i says bet its here already![/quote]
But there is no need to add more wood to the fire is there?

Unless you are Bojo who still believes in Herd Immunity

@Coyoacan

I'm no expert, but Mexico's chief epidemiologist insists that closing borders against covid is useless and Mexico just got its first case of the UK variant of covid brought in by a Brit.

Mexico has particular pressures around businesses which locate themselves on the border of the USA in order that cheaper Mexican labour may be used whilst skilled admin commute in from the US. Also tourism and family remittances. There are a few conflicts of interest there.

@PicsInRed

I 100% agree OP.

They had the excuse of not knowing in January even though fuckloads of the rest of us were already buying masks and turning Brexit cupboards into Corona cupboards but there's no excuse now.

It's a disgrace that the borders are still open to leisure and zoomable business travel. A fucking disgrace.

Agree.

I agree.

We need to keep the supply chain flowing, but that doesn’t even necessarily even need to mean people crossing the borders, just goods.

Except the people in Northern Ireland... ?

Are are you expecting completely new infrastructure to spring up overnight to handle all our imports and exports as unacccompanied goods?

Even better, the landbridge service relied on by Irish imports/exports.

Organs for transplant, sensitive documents, animal imports, medicines, should these arrive unaccompanied, too?

There is no need to end accompanied frieght.

Professional hauliers have few social contacts when on the job, they travel much of it solo, it's much lower risk than a family going on hols by plane to a resort then returning to packed school, office, hospitals etc.

Totally agree. Been saying this since March and it drives me mad. We will just go round in circles with new variants