Learner drivers - Legal experts help required.

[Comefromaway]

Can anyone point me to the actual legislation whether it be the The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) (No. 3) Regulations 2020 and 2021 amendments or the Road Traffic Act or Motor Vehicles (Driving Licence) Regulations or anything else, where it says that a Learner Driver cannot drive at all, even if making an essential journey with a member of their own household.

Eg. if I give my child a lift to work according to gov.uk & various people’s interpretations including a local 6th form, they cannot be the driver.

But I can’t find any actual legislation that says that.

Agree OP it's all a bit odd this. Only heard about this today and struggle to find clarification ( and I'm good a googling 😀)

It won’t affect us til Feb for ds as dd passed last year just before lockdown but to give an example. She works and if she hadn’t passed her test would be reliant on me taking her to work. Last year she drove to work & back again with one of us accompanying her.

If your 6th former is going to college then of course they can drive themselves with you in the car. There's nothing to say they can't. You would have to drive her anyway, so where's the difference if she drives?

What you probably can't do (but who would know) is go out for a random drive. However, I am sure there's always some petrol or milk that needs to be bought.

www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive
"Learning to drive during coronavirus (COVID-19)
You cannot take driving lessons in England, Scotland or Wales.

You can only practise driving with members of your household or support bubble in Scotland and Wales. It must be travel for work, education or other essential journeys.

You cannot practise driving in England."

Is that what you are looking for?

Yes DD did all my essential driving during the first lockdown. Every food shop, pharmacy visit etc

Hi OP I found this:
www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive/practising-with-family-or-friends#:~:text=Because%20of%20coronavirus%20(COVID%2D19,cannot%20practise%20driving%20in%20England.
Inn the November lockdown my DD's instructor told her it was ok for her to drive to college or an essential trip e.g. to college. But this time it like different. I was only aware because a friend posted on FB. Going to see if I can get her insurance suspended because I've just renewed it. Really frustrating.

We’ve just realised this - gutted for my daughter already had her test moved in November and moved from next week till June!!!
Very frustrating for her

TBH there is so much traffic on the roads now and the bad weather I can understand why they've changed it.

I hat DD (now passed) driving when it may be icy or snow.

www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive/practising-with-family-or-friends

Because of coronavirus (COVID-19), you can only practise driving with members of your household or support bubble in Scotland and Wales. It must be travel for work, education or other essential journeys. You cannot practise driving in England.

So in England learners CANNOT drive at all.

Bloody glad I saw this thread because I'm teaching DS2 and had no idea this had changed.

I think it’s because a learner driver is considered (arguable I know) at more risk of having/causing an accident which would put pressure on the ambulance service / NHS.

Great (not). DD has a test booked for February, obvs not going to happen. She is 17 and lost her job because it was in hospitality and she has absolutely nothing to do atm but has the opportunity of an apprenticeship (in healthcare) if she can drive. She has been doing essential journeys. I've not seen this publicised anywhere else so had no idea we weren't supposed to be doing it.

We’ve just realised this - gutted for my daughter already had her test moved in November and moved from next week till June!!!

Does she know there's some app you have to pay for but it finds cancelled tests for you? Not much use at the moment but might be to bring it forward when it starts again.

@PrincessLen

www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive "Learning to drive during coronavirus (COVID-19) You cannot take driving lessons in England, Scotland or Wales.

You can only practise driving with members of your household or support bubble in Scotland and Wales. It must be travel for work, education or other essential journeys.

You cannot practise driving in England."

Is that what you are looking for?

No, I found that. But it doesn’t reference the actual legislation making it illegal/that the fine & penalty points would be issued under.

@Grumpyoldpersonwithcats

www.gov.uk/driving-lessons-learning-to-drive/practising-with-family-or-friends

Because of coronavirus (COVID-19), you can only practise driving with members of your household or support bubble in Scotland and Wales. It must be travel for work, education or other essential journeys. You cannot practise driving in England.

So in England learners CANNOT drive at all.

Bloody glad I saw this thread because I'm teaching DS2 and had no idea this had changed.

But that’s not an actual law. The Covid threads have taught me that all manner of things on Giovanni.uk is legally incorrect. I’m after the actual legislation that you could be fined/given penalty points under.

Oh great, the government have found another way of shafting young people during this pandemic.

I must ring Boris and tell him my DS still has access to Netflix and instagram which he is enjoying, so perhaps the government had better put a stop to that. I'm sure they'd hate to think they'd left his life with any shred of joy or purpose, having already shut his school, cancelled his exams and stopped him from meeting up with his mates and his girlfriend.

Would you also like to know the specific legislation that murder is prosecuted under (although as there isn't any that would be rather challenging)?
It being clearly written on the government site should be enough for anyone other than lawyers or police officers enforcing the rules and such people should be using much more appropriate resources than Mumsnet to find out.

@StatisticalSense

Would you also like to know the specific legislation that murder is prosecuted under (although as there isn't any that would be rather challenging)? It being clearly written on the government site should be enough for anyone other than lawyers or police officers enforcing the rules and such people should be using much more appropriate resources than Mumsnet to find out.

As I’m not planning on committing murder I’ll pass on that one, thanks.

And I’ve trawled legislation.gov.uk and drawn a complete blank hence why asking here if anyone else had found it.

Good point, I've had a quick look and can't see it in recent ones, hmm.

I didn't know this was a thing now, I was stuck behind a learner driver yesterday. I'n in England and had no idea they shouldn't have been on the road

Interesting that pay as you go learner insurances (veygo) are still letting you buy learner insurance by the 2 hour slot then, seems really unfair that they let you buy this.

I didn’t know this was a rule and DS drove to the supermarket and home again. They shouldn’t be allowed to sell insurance in this instance. I didn’t realise we were breaking any rules.

@Bayleaf25

Interesting that pay as you go learner insurances (veygo) are still letting you buy learner insurance by the 2 hour slot then, seems really unfair that they let you buy this.

I didn’t know this was a rule and DS drove to the supermarket and home again. They shouldn’t be allowed to sell insurance in this instance. I didn’t realise we were breaking any rules.

I’m convinced it’s not breaking any rules.

But I’d like to be sure.

Blimey, I had no idea. I will hold off renewing insurances on my DC’s ‘learner’ car.

I agree with you Comefromaway, the actual legislation can be very different from the guidance, so interested if anyone can find it.

I'm struggling to find any legislation that covers this in England. The Scottish SI (www.legislation.gov.uk/ssi/2020/344) covers this, but there is no mention of learner drivers (or of driving at all) in the English SI (www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/1374).

I think it's another case of guidance vs. legislation - and so it is a moral decision rather than a legal one.

NB - I am not a lawyer or a legal expert.

Had no idea about this and DD has driven home from work with DH. This is so unfair on young people and also not publicised at all! This is the third time driving lessons have stopped for her and her theory test has been cancelled several times. I despair for young people.