Tighter restrictions? What else can be "tighter"??

[R2221]

Schools closed, work places closed, nailbars, hairdressers, clothes shops, closed. My high street is dead and a couple of big shops are permanently closing down. We've been totally indoors, going out only to get grocery and exercise.

Oh, gyms are closed, no play dates, birthdays, dinners or even coffee with friends. WHAT ELSE CAN BE DONE TO STOP THE SPREAD??? What would "tighter" restrictions mean? To me, next tighter level means no grocery and exercise :(

My local hospital is totally full. I don't understand why.

@Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow

Covid is largely a disease of the overweight. Restricting exercise is a fucking own goal

I despair of this government

The government isn't restricting exercise.

Boris has personal reasons for needing the childcare and support bubble. If he removes that for everyone then he will also have to follow that.

Well the hospitals are full because of mixing over Christmas. Assuming most people are now following the rules (?!) it will come down.

But to speed it going down I would think the most obvious thing to do is close nurseries, as at least in London, tubes and trains are pretty quiet. Perhaps coffee shops, and perhaps make DIY home deliver only.

I can’t imagine stopping people driving 5 miles to go walking somewhere pretty is going to make any odds, even if you could police it.

I'm a lawyer and we have worked from home throughout

Some firms are using the fact they are now in the office as a badge of honour and they are serving their client's properly!!!

A friend of mine works in sales for a pet food company- she's classed as an essential worker!! She's clearly isn't. If she was making the food that is slightly different.

So many companies forcing people into work uneccesarily- that's needs to cracked down on.

Also reduce the shops which are open or seriously reduce what they are allowed to sell - eg homebase - went in for some putty stuff found myself buying cushions etc.- I'm sure other people will go just to browse homewares - that is not essential shopping.

@TrinidadQueen

Boris has personal reasons for needing the childcare and support bubble. If he removes that for everyone then he will also have to follow that.

Bullshit. Carrie will.

He will do fuck all.

@DisgruntledPelican

Household mixing. That’s where it’s spreading.

And probably because they stopped people from doing anything else. I'm not speaking for myself but I can completely see why,in Winter, when there is f all to do that some people will be visiting family and friends. Not everyone has a fairytale home life that they can survive seeing nobody else and others will find it too difficult. It's just facts. I actually wonder if transmission would be exactly the same if people could meet for coffees, go to the cinema, go to the gym. I reckon there would be less in home socialising and less in home spread.

Daily Mail has obviously got the same writers as on here, allowed out once a week on there

Went for a walk yesterday & there was a group of 12-15 people coming through the park gate including 6-7 young children & several couples, no social distancing, friends relative just flew into the Uk from EU on Weekend with no checks whatsoever & tested positive the next day, another friends dc travelling hundreds of miles to university, despite all teaching online & no face to face requirement for the next 6 weeks.

So, if people weren’t so selfish then I’m sure we’d be able to get through this a lot quicker!

Last lockdown, in March, Dh was furloughed. This time he is still In work. Manufacturing is still very much open As normal it seems.

Garden centres, open. Costa, open, go outdoors, open. B and q, open. Macdonalds, open. If these places (and lots of others like them) are open, people will visit them.

Lots of people Have made support bubbles And childcare bubbles. I’m not saying they aren’t necessary, but if transmission is Mainly happening in the home, then these bubbles are an obvious issue.
Childcare still open for everyone. Yet many parents are on furlough and still sending their children to childcare. I get completely why they don’t want to pay for it and not use it, but again, it’s another aspect of society that is still open for mixing people all together at close distances.

People are so tired of the restrictions. And I think many people still think it won’t happen to them and are willing to take their chances as they are so fed up of this life. Unfortunately, while some people are not following the rules, the rest of us will have to follow them for even longer. It’s shit.

@Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow

Covid is largely a disease of the overweight. Restricting exercise is a fucking own goal

I despair of this government

🙄

a) It’s largely a disease of the old not the overweight

b) The government is not stopping you going out to exercise

c) You have to eat less to loose significant amounts of weight, exercise alone is unlikely to do it

The idiots on these threads make me think they can't be real

Over 60s not allowed out - many frontline medical staff in this age group, happy to do without them in a pandemic?

Restriction of public transport - yes, that will make us carers and key workers much less at risk of catching it and passing it on

Curfew - yes, let's cram supermarket shopping into fewer hours, that will be much safer. Some of the suggestions here would see some shift workers unable to shop at all on their day shifts.

Shopping in a specific radius - yes, let's punish the less well off by forcing them to the nearest shops

Shopping once per week per household with one person - yes, brilliant, imagine lugging home all that shopping alone on the limited public transport. What would this solitary shopper use to carry it? Even parsnips, carrots, apples, plums for a family of four will fill up one bag.

What next, charge them for an extra seat on the bus because they had to put it all in a massive backpack?

No sitting on park benches - anyone who can't keep moving for mobility reasons, asthma etc should ideally be removed from society, we are weak and might need the NHS for not Covid, actually, it would be more efficient to shoot us really.

And obviously forget support bubbles - suicides don't matter, only those with Covid "sadly" die. And you'd save a fortune for the NHS on people like me who are on meds for life.

Commit suicide - save the NHS!

"No sitting around on park benches. One trip out for one hour per day."

Is there any evidence that sitting on a park bench has contributed to the spread of the virus? I can see that it could theoretically, if the virus can spread on hard surfaces outside, but I don't know if any studies have been done?

How would the one hour limit be enforced I wonder?

I do agree with the pp who says we need to look at what reduces transmission - but do we actually know what are the significant causes of transmission yet? Would be good to have some certainty on that at some point!

@Calledyoulastnightfromglasgow

Covid is largely a disease of the overweight. Restricting exercise is a fucking own goal

I despair of this government

Well yes Scotland has a real bad heart health record and not exactly favourable weather for outdoor exercise but let's close the gyms. I'm a member of a gym and not a peep did I hear about 'cases'. Shutting gyms is just another false thing to go after.

And it's not fecking schools either. Jesus schools are such an easy target.

As another poster said just a peer into a McDonalds kitchen - they are packed in like sardines. What about places like the huge Amazon warehouses.......

@Meredithgrey1 I am completely confused by the idea that curfews would help. I know other countries have done it, but surely if nothing else it forces everyone to shop in a shorter time period, so shops will be busier
I don’t get curfews either. Surely the only places open late at night are 24 Hour supermarkets and surely it is better to spread out shopping as much as we can to avoid having everyone there at the same time. We get deliveries, but I would be tempted to Go at odd times to miss the crowds if I needed too.

I meant Boris has personal reasons for not removing the childcare and support bubbles. Not that he will personally suffer the effects from it. That will as you rightly say, fall on Carrie.
But the fact it would effect their family on a personal basis in a way that many of the other restrictions have not, might make him think. Here's hoping anyway. I think removing these bubbles would be completely inhumane and will lead to a huge rise in suicide and mental health. Some are barely hanging on as it is.

Pet shops: people taking their bored kids in to look at the animals. One person only.

Garden centres shut. It’s January, nothing they’re selling is essential/can’t be bought online.

National Trust cafes. Exercise is essential, cup of tea isn’t.

No-one but no-one needs to be flying for business. That’s what Zoom is for.

@Aixenprovence

"No sitting around on park benches. One trip out for one hour per day."

Is there any evidence that sitting on a park bench has contributed to the spread of the virus? I can see that it could theoretically, if the virus can spread on hard surfaces outside, but I don't know if any studies have been done?

How would the one hour limit be enforced I wonder?

I do agree with the pp who says we need to look at what reduces transmission - but do we actually know what are the significant causes of transmission yet? Would be good to have some certainty on that at some point!

Indeed, is there any evidence that driving to a beauty spot or country park spreads the virus worse than walking in a very crowded urban park?

Theres something special about the very air in beautiful places that makes viruses spread more efficiently than in uglier places?

Which other country currently has an internal travel ban on its citizens? Most don't, in fact nearly all do not. Allowing internal travel while socially distancing is something that could make this lockdown a lot more workable for many people - a nice walk in slightly different scenery even once every couple of weeks is something to look forward to. Particularly since it now seems likely we will be locked down til at least 23 March.

[quote PistolKnight]@RedToothBrush the fail is [/quote]
The Mail is reporting in the same way as the Guardian. They are going along the lines of the Hancock interview in which he refused to rule out anything.

Its NOT saying that its incoming in the way that the Telegraph and the Times are.

The wording and stress thats put on these things are important to note. The Mail are taking the most sensational line possible from speculation rather than sourced in the way the Telegraph and Times are. I note here that the Telegraph and Times have been the closest to any new announcement on restrictions in the last few weeks with both reporting new ones accurately on their front pages the day before its happened.

So I'm still pretty confident that support bubbles are not for the chop. And I do think they will be the very last thing they will axe and will try to avoid doing at all costs.

DS worked in an Amazon warehouse before Christmas and said they were ultra strict about mask wearing and social distancing. They had people constantly walking around making sure everyone was adhering to this. If you didn’t then you were out.

@Blankscreen

I'm a lawyer and we have worked from home throughout

Some firms are using the fact they are now in the office as a badge of honour and they are serving their client's properly!!!

A friend of mine works in sales for a pet food company- she's classed as an essential worker!! She's clearly isn't. If she was making the food that is slightly different.

So many companies forcing people into work uneccesarily- that's needs to cracked down on.

Also reduce the shops which are open or seriously reduce what they are allowed to sell - eg homebase - went in for some putty stuff found myself buying cushions etc.- I'm sure other people will go just to browse homewares - that is not essential shopping.

So you "found yourself buying cushions" but you think that should be banned?

I'm glad lawyers are working in offices. Dad's estate closed at the start of the March 2020 lockdown and I was very glad that papers weren't hanging around someone's house. We just got in the week before to sign and close and collect the papers we needed.

Is everyone actually looking forward to paying the extra tax all this madness will cause?

I think a lot of work that could be done from home is being done in a workplace unnecessarily on the basis that the workplace is “covid secure” because they have a one way system or some such nonsense.

A lot of school places are being taken by families who don’t need them to care for the child, they “need” them to make their wfh experience less hellish. It’s hard, but lots of us are struggling through with wfh and homeschooling because we have no choice.

They could close nurseries and non-essential factories.

Supermarkets could impose a one person per trolley limit with exemptions for disabled people with carers and single parents with kids under, say, 11.

They could get rid of support bubbles unless it’s “prescribed” by a GP for someone who is vulnerable mental health wise. That way only those who genuinely need it rather than those who think it’s be nice to have will take it up and it would be easier to police.

They could get rid of childcare bubbles.

In the extreme they could impose a one person limit on leaving the house for essentials and ban leaving the house for exercise altogether. That’s what some countries did.

"b) The government is not stopping you going out to exercise"

Although, as a pp says, the mail reporting that "a whitehall source" says changes discussed (by whom? not known....) today included a ban on people leaving their homes more than once a week. Would be interesting to know if any assessment has been done of the consequences of that for people's physical and mental health.

Social household mixing. Everyone round here seems to be meeting up with friends under the guise of exercise. And loads of teens just behaving as normal, happily sanctioned by their parents (as reported on here)

I think one of the simplest ways to restrict excessive movement and mixing would be to ration car fuel. Enough for a supermarket trip and an emergency trip to accident and emergency and everything else specifically requested. Critical workers get more, haulage get more, emergency services get more, but ‘leisure fuel’ restrictions would see far less day trips.
I’d also do regional lockdown properly. No crossing from one are to another except with a permit.
Get rid of places like the Range, Pet shops, Take away coffee shops, takeaways in general.
Short hard lockdown, properly enforced. Then regional assessment of incidence.
I’d close schools and offer secondary children of essential workers and the vulnerable boarding places in are excellently resourced public schools.

@Calmandmeasured1 so many people are quick to jump to the banning of the support bubble of children under 1. Why? Why is it any less valid than the others? I’ve had PND. Without my support bubble I wouldn’t have coped. If it’s taken away I don’t think I’ll cope. Yes there are two adults in our house but DH is working full time and I’m supposed to be working part time.
So do explain to me why you think this is a reasonable suggestion to do away with? Could it be that it doesn’t affect you personally? This seems to be the rationale with a lot of posters these days.

I don’t have an elderly relative that needs care but I wouldn’t dream of suggesting they do away with the caring exception or support bubbles for the elderly.