Chris Whitty in The Times today - don't meet friends and family unnecessarily

[MrsMiaWallis]

"Emergency patients will be turned away from hospitals, causing “avoidable deaths”, unless the public starts obeying the lockdown, England’s chief medical officer warns today.
In a stark intervention designed to shock, Professor Chris Whitty warns that everyone who meets friends and family unnecessarily is a “link in a chain” that threatens the lives of vulnerable people"

Worth noting. I had to pick up a prescription from my local town and was surprised to see so many people - mainly middle aged women, some of whom I know and had always seemed like rational intelligent people - walking around town and chatting on the pavements, unmasked, no social distancing.

Apologies I don't know how to do share tokens.

Yes like everyone.

Well no, it's not like everyone.

Some people have been able to work from home throughout, saving thousands on commutes, and live with their family so don't feel lonely or isolated. Others have lost jobs, live alone and feel extremely depressed. We're not all in this together and never really have been. Nobody is going to give up the few simple pleasures left to them because of your smug finger wagging, so not sure why you bother.

Nobody is going to give up the few simple pleasures left to them because of your smug finger wagging, so not sure why you bother

What's smug is assuming the rules only apply to other people and that noone needs simple pleasures except the privileged few.

I agree with pp @BuggerBognor , I think who said people are sick and tired of the drama the media feed us day in and day out.

The very serious messages are getting lost in the noise. The media wants us all to live in a permanent soap opera and that is not good for people.

I also agree with op @MrsMiaWallis on the mental health thing. We are creating a society where any emotional difficulties are branded as having mental health issues.

I had PND and it went undiagnosed for about 8 months. It took a couple of years to get through it. A couple of years later I list my second daughter late in pregnancy. I grieved. But at least I could recognise the emotions for what they were.

Be anxious because you've lost your job, be pissed off because you can't homeschool your children whilst trying work, be upset because we haven't been able to socialise properly for nearly a year BUT know that all these feelings come and go.

*lost not list. Fat fingers!!

So many people seem to be unable (or unwilling) to understand the difference between personal risk and public health risk. Yes meeting a friend for exercise/a chat outside is probably fairly low risk (not no risk) on a personal level, but if everyone does it those that are unlucky become a significant source of transmission (and onward transmission beyond that). You can’t manage a pandemic through individual risk assessment. The amount of personal responsibility is concerning, just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should.

Agree with IcedPurple

Starmer has a mole I am sure so he knows nurseries are next . Handy to announce before the weekly broadcast next week

The fact that he has a mole is obvious surely.

To say that the restrictions that came in 6 days ago aren’t working is quite premature.

We've had 10 months of restrictions that are not strict enough and then have to be revised upwards. My instinct is that faced with a highly transmissible strain and knowing that there is a 2-3 week lag before you see the effects of what you've implemented, you start by being very strict (i.e. narrow definition of key worker/which kids are in school; close non-essential factories/shops; close nurseries with appropriate financial compensation, close takeaways etc) then in 2-3 weeks if you see your measures are taking effect you slowly start opening things up.

Yes there's an economic cost here.

But what we're doing at the moment is endlessly tightening the screws so a) people get fed up and non-compliant and b) we're constantly chasing our tails because infections go up uncontrollably owing to insufficiently strict measures.

@Emufakes

You CAN'T carry on as normal, that's the thing. Even if you wanted to, most stuff is closed.

Good! and more stuff and should be closed! control the virus first, economy second, and reading these posts it appears to be a case of "those that can, should, and those that can't...Well I'm not cross, I'm just disappointed

[quote Unsure33]@GhostPepperTears

But you are saying in affect that the government has over estimated the intelligence of the British public.

And that we can not follow guidance. We need more LAWs.

I think a lot of people will disagree with that .[/quote]
People may well disagree, but you read on MN time and again 'you don't need to follow that, it's only guidance' so yes they probably have overestimated the intelligence of the British Public (or at least it's willingness to follow guidance if it doesn't suit them) and if they want people to follow things currently in guidance probably should make them law

@MrsMiaWallis

Starmer has a mole I am sure so he knows nurseries are next . Handy to announce before the weekly broadcast next week

The fact that he has a mole is obvious surely.

nope not to me

I wanted to go for a fast walk with a friend next week, this thread is making me reconsider.

@inquietant

Many people simply say 'I've done my own risk assessment'

They clearly need better training in how to risk assessment then!

Because I bet my own life if they needed hospital treatment they expect it.

I'll say it again. We live in a society which encourages selfish behaviour. People voted for this. Go online and you don't have to go far to see comments disagreeing with giving children free school meals or helping single parents comments such as "Well you shouldn't have had a child if you can't financially support it yourself," often spouted by old men who incidentally did not look after their own children rather left them with the stay at home wife.
Now explain to me why those working single parents for example , should jeopardise there livelihood for the same old men who berate them.
Btw I'm not a single parent in receipt of free school meals. I'm giving you an example of the sheer irony which those selfish people have.
I don't give a shit about you, but please put your life on hold to help me now.
For what it's worth I tend to stick to the rules/guidelines even though I'm financially disadvantaged by doing so.

@Onlinedilema yes but again, if single parent or kids need hospital treatment but she's passed covid on to so many of those old men that the hospital is full and they die avoidable deaths?

On the schools issue MH explained what the government meant in their schools are safe mantra and they still maintain they are.

They mean that they are safe for the children and staff inside them.

I'm still not convinced that makes them safe when we have a sage report saying school children are up to 7 times more likely to then bring it home but ......🤷‍♀️ I'm guessing they don't want parents too scared to send children back?

To the above poster who said Whitty should quit and tell everyone how shite Boris is and how he ignores advice. I kinda wish he would but also think he's too dedicated to out the nation at risk and I'm also grateful he hasn't because he's great at exhaling the situation in layman's terms.

I'm giving you examples. Let's face facts here young, fit people are not in the main dying from covid . It's the elderly and those with underlying conditions.
There are some exceptions obviuosly.

Surely a natural consequence of many people having had the virus and recovered is that theres no incentive for these people to carry on following the laws/guidance.

If your whole household has had the virus mildly and are now completely better you probably think theres no harm in mingling freely with family and friends, especially if their household has also all had it.

I wouldn't do this but I can see that many people would.

I don't know if there is evidence that you cannot catch it again. Perhaps it would be less severe.

A 66 year old family member has to travel on two buses and a train to work every day, then work eight hours in close proximity to others. This is alright as he's deemed a key worker. However, chatting in the street to someone has people screaming blue murder. Weird?

I'm not going to stop saying this - lobby for the housing market to be closed or at least restricted.

6 surveyors at my practice. Each visited at least 4 fully occupied houses per day last week. That's well over 100 instances of household mixing in one week and we are a small firm so imagine how much risk is being taken in the big firms.

What's smug is assuming the rules only apply to other people and that noone needs simple pleasures except the privileged few.

Except having an outdoor coffee with a friend isn't breaking 'the rules'.

Starmer has a mole I am sure so he knows nurseries are next . Handy to announce before the weekly broadcast next week

TBF he doesn't need a mole - almost everyone gets to hear what the government are going to do next, before they actually do it.

If they want to run government like a sieve then they can't be surprised to get leaks.

@Nellodee

This issue of essential workers quitting and leaving their non-essential partners at work needs to be dealt with. Could businesses be forced to furlough non-essential workers who are married to essential workers?

That couldn't possibly work unless the non key worker earns less than the furlough cap or their furlough is an enforced 100%

If employers, shops and a portion of the public aren't listening (not including parents who have no choice whether wfh or not in that list) maybe senior health professionals need to lay out in stark, no holes barred, simple terms, with very graphic pictures, what exactly the collapse of the country's heath care service will mean to the average person and their loved ones.

Actually scratch that, maybe they need to lay it out again to Boris, with lots of pictures in crayon this time