Am I missing something?

[BPCoveredInSpots]

I try to keep on top of what’s going on.
Most days I check the figures - local and national. I attempt to keep up with government statements, guidelines and u-turns. I ignore hyperbolic media sources that love the dramatic doom and gloom aspect of Covid.

My take is that whilst Covid isn’t a serious threat in terms of deaths, it has a high hospitalisation rate and as such is a big risk to life as we know it right now. This seems obvious.
We’re also finding more out about long Covid (around 1 in 10).

However I am seeing more and more people, intelligent people whose opinions I respect in other matters, having very different takes on the whole situation, with things like

1. The numbers are being made up.
2. Hospitals are not overcrowded, this is political spin.
3. Death certificates are being filled in with Covid to inflate the figures.
4. The government is using a mild illness to sneak in more and more control measures - make us blindly comply and lose our freedom.
5. The great barrington declaration.
6. Only the vulnerable should shield, everyone else should be allowed to get on with it.

I don’t believe these things.
I think there’s been plenty of government incompetence, lack of action followed by panic and last minute decisions.

I’m not a dr or a scientist, but I do feel I know enough to refute all the above points.

My biggest question though is why?
Am I missing information?
Is there truth in these? For what end? Any evidence of it (apart from manipulated statistics that feature heavily in the Covid denier narrative).

Sometimes people just don't want to admit the truth because it then obligates them to do something they don't want to do.

There is more and more disregard for the truth. Just look at America. The media don't help either.

I agree with Mumski45.
Also people often ignore something which is not related to them directly so if their family is ok they think that problems don’t exist. When someone from their family dies or at least someone they know it becomes different.

But it’s not like we can pause our life wait for this pandemic to be over and return back to normal. It’s realization that effects are much wider and long lasting. I feel most for vulnerable kids, people with mental health issues, single mothers, small restaurants and business owners. Old people who haven’t seen grandkids almost a year now. As well as it’s frightening when government starts to dictate how far from the house I can go.

I also understand people who have someone close to die from covid feel people breaking the rules are to blame, but if my parents die and I haven’t seen them for a year I will feel just as bad. So yes we are careful but there is a balance. Let people decide what is best for them.

@Mumski45

Sometimes people just don't want to admit the truth because it then obligates them to do something they don't want to do.

There is more and more disregard for the truth. Just look at America. The media don't help either.

This

Also the people that go to the other extreme. Where everything is doom with little regard for the facts or true. The whole wards and ICU full up with children rumour for an example.

People are basically going a little potty after months of this. The unknown is worrying. So this is how people are mentally coping.

I've been in and out of hospital all year with a serious condition. The hospital has been empty every time. Usually just me and one other patient in the waiting room. Nobody in the corridors, nobody in the wards. Just nurses and doctors chatting. I'm not blaming them, but at least in my part of the country, this is a true observation so it must be the same in other areas.

I have to deal with journalists for work and one told me that case numbers were being inflated. Don't know if I believe him or not though. He told me a few things that sounded urban legend-y.

For the record, I'm a mask wearing, shielding person so I'm following the rules and see covid as a threat. So I'm not trying to discount the severity of what's happening.

I have no doubt that the threat to the NHS is real. I have too many friends working on the front line showing the effects of this to not believe it.
But. My parents shielded for months. They saw me and the grandkids a handful of times at a distance. And then my dad died. We will never get those months we kept him 'safe' back.
I'm not sure what I believe anymore. Ive heard that anyone dying who tested positive with covid will have it on their death certificates no matter what they died of. What that does to the 'official' figures i don't know. It's just so hard to know what to believe anymore isn't it?

So sorry to hear that @Cloe78

It's this sort of thing that makes people want to revel.

When I've been in my (empty) local hospital this year, I've wondered how many people are missing vital treatments. How many non-covid lives have been lost this year? Number must be in the thousands?

@ChristmasSexyTime

I've been in and out of hospital all year with a serious condition. The hospital has been empty every time. Usually just me and one other patient in the waiting room. Nobody in the corridors, nobody in the wards. Just nurses and doctors chatting. I'm not blaming them, but at least in my part of the country, this is a true observation so it must be the same in other areas.

I have to deal with journalists for work and one told me that case numbers were being inflated. Don't know if I believe him or not though. He told me a few things that sounded urban legend-y.

For the record, I'm a mask wearing, shielding person so I'm following the rules and see covid as a threat. So I'm not trying to discount the severity of what's happening.

Really, just two patients in the entire hospital? Nobody at all on any of the wards? 🙄

*rebel

Really, just two patients in the entire hospital? Nobody at all on any of the wards? 🙄

Yeah, genuinely. Nobody in paediatrics (ward in darkness), nobody waiting in the waiting room outside radiology, nobody except me in the nephrology department. Nobody waiting for bloods.

Without photographic evidence, I can't prove this to you but it's the truth. There's nothing happening there. It's a rural hospital but it serves a large geographic region.

Although @Henio I haven't been anywhere near A&E so perhaps it's very different on that side of things?

The death stats involve people who die within 28 days from a positive diagnosis. That limits the possibility of Covid being wrongly diagnosed as the cause of death. This was talked about fairly early on, and the change was made precisely because of the possibility of Covid being wrongly listed as the sole cause of death.

It's one reason why the ONS stats are higher. They provide the number of excess deaths, so they're deaths that are as a result of the pandemic, whether direct or indirect.

Re the seemingly empty waiting rooms and corridors, that's a false impression. They're deliberately only having a small handful of patients in the waiting room to limit the danger of the virus spreading. I've had a couple of appointments during the pandemic (I have long Covid) and they have made it clear that I wasn't to arrive early because they didn't want patients waiting in waiting rooms longer than strictly necessary.

With regards to the corridors, a frontline doctor explained that they deliberately keep the corridors empty, again to prevent as far as possible the virus from spreading. He said that conspiracy theorists are deliberately taking photos of empty corridors to make it look as if the hospital was empty.

Sorry for your loss, @Cloe78.

Those circumstances must have made an already very sad situation far harder.

Ive heard that anyone dying who tested positive with covid will have it on their death certificates no matter what they died of. What that does to the 'official' figures i don't know. It's just so hard to know what to believe anymore isn't it?

Deaths certificates can have more than one cause of death listed. Also list more than one illness at the time of death. These are 2 separate sections of the certificate.

The deceased can also have had covid months before, that was not diagnosed then or tested, but the doctor can see the damage, for example an xray, more recently and see that over time covid had caused it. Hope that makes sense

Ive heard that anyone dying who tested positive with covid will have it on their death certificates no matter what they died of. What that does to the 'official' figures i don't know. It's just so hard to know what to believe anymore isn't it?

It really isn't.

He said that conspiracy theorists are deliberately taking photos of empty corridors to make it look as if the hospital was empty

I take your point but I know firsthand that so many things have been cancelled. I've had two different tests cancelled with no idea when they'll be rescheduled. And the last blood technician to take my bloods said he's bored out of his wits, and that he's doing less than 10% per day of what their capacity is.

This isn't all hospitals clearly, but in mine, yes, the wards are empty and there's not much going on. I've walked past the wards and there's nobody in them. I'm not a conspiracy theorist. Just somebody with kidney disease who has seen this with my own eyes. From what I've seen, I'm lucky to have seen my consultant a few times over the past twelve months.

@Mittens030869's post: yes, have had precisely that outlined to me by medic friend.

Makes logical sense to me.

Sorry that shouldve been italicised, not underlined Mittens. I'm not hand on hips over here

Was speaking to someone yesterday who was questioning whether the nhs is really getting busy and potentially will be overwhelmed, because she hasn’t physically seen it with her own eyes.

She then said all the restrictions are ridiculous and we should open up society and just make older and vulnerable people shield until it’s all over.

So perhaps that answers the question of who is saying these things and why.

Some people will bury their heads in the sand until it bites them on the arse. They don't see because they don't want to.

@ChristmasSexyTime
But you were not in Covid part of the hospital. I took DD for outpatient appointment a few months ago, it was quiet but taking someone with you were restricted and appointments were staged to exclude waiting so less people obviously. And a lot of appointments are online atm, DD will have another appointment next week, it will be online. It’s possible that her consultant will be working not from the hospital but from home and it’s fine by me.
Also some doctors and nurses are off with Covid and other health problems. It’s certainly the case in our local hospital, the figures were published recently. So I wouldn’t draw conclusions that the NHS is not busy because your local hospital is quiet.

NHS is not busy because your local hospital is quiet.

I'm not @Greenlynx I said its just my hospital, I'm not making a judgement on all hospitals. But when the OP talks of people's claims that hospitals are empty, I'm just saying that would be my experience of mine. It's just my experience, not everyone's.

I've seen stupid stuff on the other end of the scale too though, like 'being able to leave your house is a privilege, not a right' and 'anyone caught breaking the rules should be convicted of manslaughter' and 'I HAVEN'T LEFT THE HOUSE SINCE MARCH!!' Not sure this kind of hysterical crap isn't worse tbh.