Todays u-turn from DfE, key workers working from home should NOT send kids to school

[Esmerelda01]

In case you've not seen.

Could cause a lot of people issues on Monday

www.theguardian.com/education/2021/jan/09/school-guidance-for-children-of-key-workers-changes-again?CMP=twt_a-education_b-gdnedu

Good

I think the ‘real world’ we are living in is cohabiting with a pandemic that is overwhelming our capability of dealing with it.

There are no good solutions. The reality is things will be a lot better in 6 weeks or so if people don’t take the piss!

If children overhear some inappropriate conversations from social workers etc, it is BETTER than the alternative.

When things get tough, something has to give, and a verbally sterile environment for a child is much better to let go of than someone’s life. The fact that you don’t see your child’s mixing as contributing to someone’s death does not mean it is not happening.

We need to keep school places for those who genuinely need them.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

I think the ‘real world’ we are living in is cohabiting with a pandemic that is overwhelming our capability of dealing with it.

There are no good solutions. The reality is things will be a lot better in 6 weeks or so if people don’t take the piss!

If children overhear some inappropriate conversations from social workers etc, it is BETTER than the alternative.

When things get tough, something has to give, and a verbally sterile environment for a child is much better to let go of than someone’s life. The fact that you don’t see your child’s mixing as contributing to someone’s death does not mean it is not happening.

We need to keep school places for those who genuinely need them.

It's not about the children being damaged by breathing it. It's about the vulnerable people's confidentiality.

If you were having an online consultation with your GP or counsellor, would you want their children listening in?

Breathing it= hearing it

robin they have a legal obligation to have SOME provision for emergency parental leave though not all of them would cover it for a ten day isolation.
My DS (SEN so school open) is self isolating next week. I'm taking two half days and DH is taking one full day and the rest is covered by existing flex arrangements.

Sara,

That is not what a PP claimed. And in answer to your question, I would not LIKE my doctor’s child listening in but I would TOLERATE it, as I know that, currently, it is the best alternative to all.

That is the problem, here. Everyone wants everything else to be normal and the health service to take the strain (and break). What we need is to accept that, for a while, things will be far from normal, but we can save a lot of lives.

if you were having an online consultation with your GP or counsellor, would you want their child listening in?

Honestly wouldn't bother me at all, that child doesn't know me personally, I'm just a face or voice on a screen. A child old enough to understand what is actually being said by me is a child old enough not to interrupt their parents during such calls.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

I think the ‘real world’ we are living in is cohabiting with a pandemic that is overwhelming our capability of dealing with it.

There are no good solutions. The reality is things will be a lot better in 6 weeks or so if people don’t take the piss!

If children overhear some inappropriate conversations from social workers etc, it is BETTER than the alternative.

When things get tough, something has to give, and a verbally sterile environment for a child is much better to let go of than someone’s life. The fact that you don’t see your child’s mixing as contributing to someone’s death does not mean it is not happening.

We need to keep school places for those who genuinely need them.

You don't think talking with someone whose maybe had their kids removed, or their child murdered by their ex or one of the other million scenarios may not be ideal to be able to hear a child in the background?

This may surprise you, but I could tell my child fifty time to not speak when I'm on the phone but kids being kids they may suddenly decide to fall out and argue over who gets to use the blue pen because.....well.....they're children!

Jeez, the amount of people on here who have been so shielded from the realities of the real world are supremely lucky.

@drspouse

robin they have a legal obligation to have SOME provision for emergency parental leave though not all of them would cover it for a ten day isolation. My DS (SEN so school open) is self isolating next week. I'm taking two half days and DH is taking one full day and the rest is covered by existing flex arrangements.

annual leave request refused, furlough request refused, unpaid parental leave needs to be requested 21 days in advance and I cannot afford it anyways - I am a lone parent and DH left us so no other parent to chip in. What am I supposed to do??? There is literally nothing for some parents other than somehow carry on.

Well again, I’m sorry about that. But I’m not sure what your point is in relation to keyworkers working from home. If you have to manage, so should they?

Spn,

No, it is not ideal but, had you been listening, which you seem supremely unable to do, I said that we had to accept that things were not ideal now and hard compromises had to be made.

But, you clearly think that your clients and their calls trump the MH of the doctors and nurses up to their eyeballs in Covid, and the deaths of a few more ‘oldies’ which is the inevitable consequence of unnecessary mixing.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

Spn,

No, it is not ideal but, had you been listening, which you seem supremely unable to do, I said that we had to accept that things were not ideal now and hard compromises had to be made.

But, you clearly think that your clients and their calls trump the MH of the doctors and nurses up to their eyeballs in Covid, and the deaths of a few more ‘oldies’ which is the inevitable consequence of unnecessary mixing.

Dont be so bloody dense!

We're not "trumping" anything, we're dealing with vulnerable members of society when one small thing, like hearing children in the background after losing their own child, could just be the thing that makes them decide to jump off a bridge.

Just because you cant fathom the level of trauma a domestic abuse survivor or bereaved parent may feel doesnt mean it is anything less, or even in competition with a doctor or nurse.

Fuck me, did it hurt when you had your empathy chip removed?

@3littlewords

if you were having an online consultation with your GP or counsellor, would you want their child listening in?

Honestly wouldn't bother me at all, that child doesn't know me personally, I'm just a face or voice on a screen. A child old enough to understand what is actually being said by me is a child old enough not to interrupt their parents during such calls.

During the first lockdown a colleague of mine made a complaint about me because it took me a couple of days to reply to her non-urgent email. This was despite her knowing that I had 2 small children to work around and this was also when I had a DH around so we split the day.

So you might not mind, I can assure you that others do.

I’m using the kw space this time, for many many reasons

@NaughtipussMaximus

Or on how much it’s possible to do their essential job while simultaneously doing six hours of home school for a six year old. DH and I can work from home but people could die if we’re not giving our jobs our full attention. Last lockdown I was signed off so could look after DC.

No 6yo needs or is having 6 hours of schooling a day. Even on a normal school day in the classroom they arent doing work for that amount of time

@cadburyegg your colleague is an arse!
Your circumstances aren't unique though, there's many other people working from home facing such issues. Why compromise the safety of your family and those in school for the sake of an inconsiderate arsehole? Of course people are allowed to complain, a lot of arseholes do just to pass the time to be honest, your employer/ manager should have responded to the complainer to shove it up her arse obviously in a more professional manner

Or on how much it’s possible to do their essential job while simultaneously doing six hours of home school for a six year old.

you pick your battles. many children will unsurprisingly not be homeschooled but parked in front of tablets. Mine too. It is just what it is. If the child is 6, they are not in a crucial exam year but will have shed loads of time to play catch up once this whole shebang is over.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

I think the ‘real world’ we are living in is cohabiting with a pandemic that is overwhelming our capability of dealing with it.

There are no good solutions. The reality is things will be a lot better in 6 weeks or so if people don’t take the piss!

If children overhear some inappropriate conversations from social workers etc, it is BETTER than the alternative.

When things get tough, something has to give, and a verbally sterile environment for a child is much better to let go of than someone’s life. The fact that you don’t see your child’s mixing as contributing to someone’s death does not mean it is not happening.

We need to keep school places for those who genuinely need them.

Sorry but during lockdown my 10 year old child overheard me talk about sexual abuse.

Sorry but you don’t get to choose that catching covid is worse than that for my child.

This week I was discussing a serious knife crime, my other child needed to use the laptop for a school call. Again not appropriate for my 7 year old to hear this conversation.

I also am having lots of conversations about child sexual harmful behaviour. Should I ‘sacrifice’ my children for that?

Absolutely not.

Do I have a choice not to have those calls? No.

My children need to be in school for their own safety.

@3littlewords that’s what we’ve been told to do by school. They sent home a very detailed timetable. Obviously we can miss some of this and in fact we’ve asked for 2-3 days per week in school rather than 5 days as I am condensing my hours into 3 very long days, but DC also has SEN and we don’t want him to fall further behind. Luckily school agrees with us so 🤷‍♀️

I wouldn’t give a shit if someone’s primary age child overheard my doctors consultation.

@NaughtipussMaximus my Y1 dc has full day timetable too but its far from constant work for the full 6 hours and as I said earlier no 6yo (or any older child for that matter) would be doing school work for a full 6 hours of the day in normal times

People are inherently selfish and in a lot of cases, simply stupid. They can’t see past their own selfish noses and understand that their actions not only put teachers at risk, but key workers who may well not have access to a space for their child if.there’s a case of COVID in the class.

These key worker spaces are for those with a genuine need and yes, there are lots of individual circumstances which we have heard about on this thread. These key workers need the provision to be as safe as possible, not a babysitting service for the children of one key worker and a SAP or where there is someone working from home who simply can’t bring themselves to home school again. There are a great many parents who do important and stressful jobs who continue to home school and do so under great stress and exhaustion, putting in unsociable hours. My industry (clinical trial management, including COVID trials) is a good example. We have people working from 4am and late into the evening to deliver critical work whilst home schooling. If they can do it, then someone who is a SAP certainly can.

There are jobs which are incompatible with having children in earshot and that is accepted, but the piss takers really need to take a long, hard look at themselves and perhaps try to understand the bigger picture a bit better.

@Fleshlumpeater

I wouldn’t give a shit if someone’s primary age child overheard my doctors consultation.

What about the child? Maybe they shouldn’t be overhearing conversations about bowel cancer, erectile dysfunction, miscarriage?

Plus many patients will feel differently - especially if for example the doctor’s child goes to school with the patient’s child...

Well said, @HamishDent