Children who don’t consent to a lateral flow test should be treated as positive and sent home

[user1471505494]

Schools now have much higher numbers attending than in the first lockdown. The lateral flow test was brought into schools to try and keep Staff and pupils as safe as possible.

If a parent or child refuses consent is absolutely their RIGHT to do so and I appreciate that there are many varied reasons for this. It should therefore be the RESPONSIBILITY of the schools to safeguard others and send the child home to self isolate.

@PugInTheHouse

Being on a ventilator is more uncomfortable than a covd test though

Obviously a ventilator or Long Covid is more uncomfortable My kids have had PCR tests without complaint but denying that it is uncomfortable is unfair

@FoxyTheFox

Being on a ventilator is more uncomfortable than a covd test though

Are people still trotting out this tired old line?

Ventilated patients are almost always sedated so the comfort of the ventilation is irrelevant, they are unaware of it.

Not true. It's difficult to get sedation levels right and patients can be over or under sedated. Both cause problems. Many patients report being aware of conversations or events that happened when they were 'asleep'. Ventilation is very uncomfortable and although every effort is made to keep patients comfortable, it is not rare for patients to experience discomfort.

@PugInTheHouse

Being on a ventilator is more uncomfortable than a covd test though

Urgggh

Where has all this hatred come from towards children not just on this thread but other it is quite worrying, they have lost out so much in the last year,( yes I know so has everyone) but the way children are being spoken about is disgusting

Of couse the test is a bit uncomfortable but most people I know have said its not as bad as people are trying to make out.

Even if they are sedated, getting to that stage is a lot more uncomfortable FFS.

Thanks Lougle, I will check it out

With a test that 50% reliable it means half of the kids sent home don't have it while half of the kids staying at school do. That's surely not accurate enough.
The kids sent home can get a PCR test which is more accurate but there's still lost learning between the LF test being positive and the PCR test being negative.
I am not anti-testing (my kids have had PCR tests) but 50% is too low imo
When Covid tests were first being developed weren't many rejected for not being accurate enough? Or is 50% considered accurate enough?

Endo I agree with your second point. I certainly don't want testing instead of isolating.

My school (special Ed) are testing staff weekly but not pupils as staff would have to do it and HT doesn't want that and can't afford to lose staff to do it and very few of ours could do it anyway.

She has refused testing for contacts of cases because it would only be staff and the pupils could be asymptotic. So she will isolate bubbles.

Fembot - very insightful reply. I was being a bit tongue in cheek in response to some of the really quite daft posts. Obviously the tests are not a bit of fun but they are a necessity to ensure we are keeping people safe. Frontline clinical staff are doing these every couple of days to try and keep people safe.

@Nonamealoud

Where has all this hatred come from towards children not just on this thread but other it is quite worrying, they have lost out so much in the last year,( yes I know so has everyone) but the way children are being spoken about is disgusting

I’m not sure why you think there is any hatred towards children, quite the opposite in fact.

It doesn’t warrant an insightful reply. HTH

@Ponoka7
I didn't lose anyone to covid. However both died during national lockdowns.

I know how it feels knowing someone you love is dying and you cannot be there and they are dying on there own in hospital. So your essentially hoping the die quickly so they don't know their alone. No ones holding their hand or telling then they are so loved.

Covid has had a massive effect on everyone. It's not just the people who have had covid/ died of covid. who have suffered.

Until covid essentially fucks off this is continuously happens to families everywhere unfortunately.

@NoSquirrels

I’ve given consent for my secondary aged DC, but to be honest I’m not at all happy about it. Because the school has specifically said they won’t be isolating close contacts any more if the DC are using lateral flow tests, and that is a major concern to me. They just aren’t accurate enough for that.

I am happy to consent to my DC taking a LF test to pick up asymptomatic carrying.

I am not happy that if an asymptomatic carrier is identified, their close contacts can continue to go to school, incubating and potentially also spreading the virus until their viral load is high enough for the LV test to pick it up, at which point it’s too late.

It’s a dumb strategy. So I don’t judge those who haven’t consented.

My thoughts exactly, except I haven't given consent.

I am aware that in the event of a close contact they will be sent home to SI which is a far more responsible action then leaving them in school and hoping then don't pass it on to others before testing positive.

fembot - not helpful but thanks for the contribution

Not sure. I'm a teacher currently on mat leave but won't be having the Pfizer jab as I'm breastfeeding. Should I return to my primary school?

@endoplasmicreticulum my issue predominantly lies with use 2 and the plan for that policy. Its effectively allowing covid to rip through a school and it is the SEN children who will be disproportionately affected and discriminated against with use 2. Use 1 is easier to swallow and easier to find an alternative (ie 10 days isolation before returning) but use 2 is really really unfair.

@babybythesea

I have withheld consent for Dd precisely because I want her out of school if there is any chance she may have it. If someone in her class tests positive, I absolutely want her at home, behaving as though she is positive. I don’t want her having a test which has a low reliability rate, getting a negative result and carrying on with life as normal when in fact it is a false negative and she is busy spreading it. I would rather she was at home isolating. It’s academic at the moment though as she’s at home anyway. I’m a TA so she could go in, and if I had to work full time she would as she’s only 11yo (Year 7) so I wouldn’t want to leave her for extended periods. But my head has worked out a rota which means I’m only doing mornings and I don’t mind leaving her for those.

But what if she is the first in her class or school to show symptoms? Would you still not get her tested?

I can see that you would naturally keep her at home and isolated but without a positive test result how could school implement their positive case protocols?

@PugInTheHouse

fembot - not helpful but thanks for the contribution

You’re not being helpful trotting the same old hackneyed comment that has been floating around since March, it’s just simplistic bilge.

@Schmoozer

Surely children with sensory issues would have to tolerate having a test if they were going to access any hospital treatment ? As this is something that is likely to be an issue for many months to come, surely these children need to be supported to get used to these tests as opposed to expecting them to access education without tests and run the risk of spreading infection ??

They would have to be sedated and physically strapped down in many cases.

My Ds needed a blood test. He needed it for urgent medical reasons. It was impossible.

@Schmoozer

Surely children with sensory issues would have to tolerate having a test if they were going to access any hospital treatment ? As this is something that is likely to be an issue for many months to come, surely these children need to be supported to get used to these tests as opposed to expecting them to access education without tests and run the risk of spreading infection ??

You may as well ask a blind person to try and see a bit better as ask an autistic person with sensory issues to get used to certain medical procedures.

@NoSquirrels

I’ve given consent for my secondary aged DC, but to be honest I’m not at all happy about it. Because the school has specifically said they won’t be isolating close contacts any more if the DC are using lateral flow tests, and that is a major concern to me. They just aren’t accurate enough for that.

I am happy to consent to my DC taking a LF test to pick up asymptomatic carrying.

I am not happy that if an asymptomatic carrier is identified, their close contacts can continue to go to school, incubating and potentially also spreading the virus until their viral load is high enough for the LV test to pick it up, at which point it’s too late.

It’s a dumb strategy. So I don’t judge those who haven’t consented.

But that's how the tests will now be used in schools after the initial test. Not that anyone is saying this openly and publicly. If they were, I imagine there would be far more people with the same reaction as you (which is utterly reasonable!)

Another way that "schools are safe"...

@SionnachRua

Yanbu. I feel the same way about anti-vaxxers tbh. Fine if you want to refuse it but you shouldn't be allowed into mainstream school.

Some people will agree to anything! I’m no anti Vaxxer either.

How does it work that a Covid swob is taken from the nose and throat.

The lateral testing is just for the nose is that right? And if it’s positive you have to re test with the original Covid test? It’s a ridiculous method!

Is it possible to help these children habituate to the fear by a slow hierarchy
e.g look at a cotton
hold a cotton bud
Touch body part with bud
Working up to touch inside of nose with bud
To waggling bud in nostril for count of ten ??

These tests don’t need to go down the throat, so children with fear of gag response won’t be affected

I’m sure some people / children will never be able
To tolerate some interventions

But I also think that some could be supported to work on a graded exposure to overcome the physiological arousal and psychologically overwhelming emotion response ???

These tests don’t give false positives they give false negatives, hence the benefit of regular tests

No, lateral testing is still throat and nose.

I can’t believe people are advocating children with disabilities that make them unable to take a test being banned from education. What sort of country do you think this is.

@Comefromaway

No, lateral testing is still throat and nose.

I’m doing lateral flow tests several times a week It’s nose only