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Original poster

Two Women fined for walking for Starbucks

648 replies

Superketchup · 08/01/2021 13:17

What rule have they broken? I don’t understand. Two of them met - yes can meet one other person - they’d driven 5 miles - surely that’s ok?! - and they had a Starbucks each which the police said was a picnic?!
Why are they keeping takeaways open if it’s agaisnt the law to get one? I took my kids to the park, the coffee shop was open for takeaway. It was freezing. We got a hot chocolate each. I’m too scared to do so again!

OP posts:
Delatron · 08/01/2021 13:58

We need to drill down what the problem was here.
Was it the driving 5 miles to exercise and that’s not local?

Walking is exercise whether you have a drink in your hand is irrelevant. So stop moaning about people buying coffee and going for a walk with it.

I think the grey area is once again ‘sitting down whilst walking’. Though lots of people sat at the benches in the park today in my town with coffee and chatting to one other. Good for them. This isn’t how the virus spreads.

Chambored · 08/01/2021 13:58

@dadshere

Why is it always Derbyshire? Reminds me of the old saying,

Derbyshire born, derbyshire bred.
Strong in the arm,
but thick in the head

😂
WitchesBritchesPumpkinPants · 08/01/2021 13:58

@problembottom

This makes me despair - it isn't hard to understand! I'd hate to be in the police right now, they either get slammed for not clamping down on covidiots or slammed for fining covidiots - can't win.

DD (2) and I were meeting up with my DSis every weekend for a coffee and a walk. Both of us had to drive to get there. We're now not allowed to do this which is upsetting but the guidance is quite clear.

DD and I still regularly walk to our local park and I get a takeaway coffee. That's allowed.

Where do you live that this is not allowed?
MrsFezziwig · 08/01/2021 13:59

And the government need to clarify things - why say takeaways can stay open if you’re not allowed to actually use them?

atswim2birds · 08/01/2021 13:59

Oh, I see, so instead of upholding our legal framework you think we should have moral police with powers to punish people for whatever an individual officer considers a moral transgression?

I think you should all stop fannying about trying to think up endless ways to get around the rules for your own benefit, then the police wouldn't be an issue.

Lemonpiano · 08/01/2021 13:59

@problembottom

This makes me despair - it isn't hard to understand! I'd hate to be in the police right now, they either get slammed for not clamping down on covidiots or slammed for fining covidiots - can't win.

DD (2) and I were meeting up with my DSis every weekend for a coffee and a walk. Both of us had to drive to get there. We're now not allowed to do this which is upsetting but the guidance is quite clear.

DD and I still regularly walk to our local park and I get a takeaway coffee. That's allowed.

Don't be ridiculous. The police are not victims.

They take an oath and they have clear responsibilities to uphold the law.

This police force is abusing its powers and making a mockery of our legal system.

Meredithgrey1 · 08/01/2021 13:59

Stay home unless absolutely necessary. Coffee out is not necessary.

Go out for specific reasons only. Starbucks is not exercise.

One of the specific reasons you are allowed to leave home is to shop or obtain services from a business that is allowed to remain open.

IceCreamAndCandyfloss · 08/01/2021 13:59

@user1471523870

I think you are only allowed out for exercising, essentials, work or medical care. Leisure trips to coffee shops are not included.
Driving five miles to get a coffee isn’t really local or exercise so wouldn’t meet that criteria.
Haffiana · 08/01/2021 14:00

Oh, Derbyshire again.

Such a waste of money. The fine will not be upheld and will cost the police force in terms of time wasted.

I cannot believe that Derbyshire police have fucked up AGAIN. They will be on the news headlines apologising AGAIN by tonight. What a PR nightmare for them.

Bohemiagirl · 08/01/2021 14:00

I never thought I'd say this, but I think it might be helpful if places like Costa closed for a few weeks, just until we're over the current crisis. In the first lockdown my local Costa didn't open. There is a big queue outside my local Costa, certainly in some cases people are picking one up during their walk/exercise but there are others who are just popping out for a coffee (in their cars) for something to do, and arranging to meet their friends in the queue.

I'm not in favour of tight restrictions but there are people who do take the piss. And we've just had a state of emergency declared in London.

HavfrueDenizKisi · 08/01/2021 14:00

@Mintjulia

Stay home unless absolutely necessary. Coffee out is not necessary.

Go out for specific reasons only. Starbucks is not exercise.

FFS! Exercise is permitted and coffee shops can do take aways. Wind your neck in.

Derbyshire police haven't learnt their lesson from last time.

Completely ridiculous and I sincerely hope these women do not pay the fine.

Lemonpiano · 08/01/2021 14:01

@atswim2birds

Oh, I see, so instead of upholding our legal framework you think we should have moral police with powers to punish people for whatever an individual officer considers a moral transgression?

I think you should all stop fannying about trying to think up endless ways to get around the rules for your own benefit, then the police wouldn't be an issue.

The police wouldn't be an issue if they weren't abusing their power and acting unlawfully.
NeurologicallySpeaking · 08/01/2021 14:01

@Plussizejumpsuit

I'm sure someone will tell you that Yabu and they were killing people. But I don't get this. How is walking with a coffee different to walking without? I'm not a fan of the police. This is really showing they are not dealing well with the new laws.

How is this contributing to the spread of covid? When you can do to drive thru or walk in takeaways. What difference does it make if you walk with it or sit in your car or take it home?

Not saying whether I agree or otherwise with the police actions in this case as I haven't seen the report but "I'm not a fan of police?!"

Really?! All/ any of them? Would you like to try society without?!

patchworkthedog · 08/01/2021 14:02

Overzealous policing maybe

Haffiana · 08/01/2021 14:02

From last time:

A former Supreme Court judge has likened Derbyshire Police's approach to the restrictions on public movement to "a police state".

Lord Sumption told Radio 4's World At One the use of drones to film walkers in the Peak District was "disgraceful" and "shamed our policing traditions".

Lord Sumption continued: "The tradition of policing in this country is that policemen are citizens in uniform, they are not members of a disciplined hierarchy operating just at the government's command."

"The police have no power to enforce ministers' preferences but only legal regulations which don't go anything like as far as the government's guidance," he said.

"I have to say that the behaviour of Derbyshire Police in trying to shame people into using their undoubted right to travel to take exercise in the country and wrecking beauty spots in the fells so people don't want to go there is frankly disgraceful.

"This is what a police state is like. It's a state in which the government can issue orders or express preferences with no legal authority and the police will enforce ministers' wishes.

"I have to say that most police forces have behaved in a thoroughly sensible and moderate fashion. Derbyshire Police have shamed our policing traditions."

Givemeabreak88 · 08/01/2021 14:04

There was people on MN saying the police don’t/won’t be stopping people, in fact there was a whole thread claiming how ridiculous it was to even suggest it (when someone asked)

TableFlowerss · 08/01/2021 14:04

The only argument I can see for this, is in theory they could have crashed their car on the way or been involved in an accident on the road, causing unnecessary pressure on an already stretched A&E, particularly in these icey conditions.

Leisure isn’t justifiable, exercise is I suppose

Don’t get me wrong, I think it’s madness!

ImAllOut · 08/01/2021 14:04

I do think it's individual forces more than anything, and Derbyshire have clearly shown their hand several times throughout. Both Welsh police forces in my local area have been really good and pretty fair throughout from what I've seen.

NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace · 08/01/2021 14:05

It's not hard. Stay in your house unless you have a reasonable excuse to leave. A starbucks with your mate is not a reasonable excuse.

That simple.

Bugger off from me too Angry

Chambored · 08/01/2021 14:06

@Meredithgrey1
No the law won’t say that, because it’s ambiguous - “should”
Which is why we’re in the mess we’re in.
Ambiguity leads to people being able to interpret the laws as they see fit, not use common sense and bend any rules to their own purpose. Hence why we’re fucked.
If we had a PM who made firm decisions and passed laws that actually said Do not do this etc..., yes it might be deemed draconian for a time, but at least we might have got a handle on this quicker, rather than being on lockdown 3, with ever increasing death rates.

ravenmum · 08/01/2021 14:06

@RoseAndRose

Police have the discretion to decide what's reasonable in their local area.

There's no set distance, because that would obviously be unfair.

Stay local - if they'd been walking round the nearest park, rather than driving to a beauty spot where police are keeping numbers down, I'm ready to bet there would have been no issue

Here in Dresden, Germany, there's a set distance of 15km. That means there's no confusion. But it's possible here because we have to carry an ID card on us (not just during Covid) which has our address on, so it's easy to prove we haven't exceeded the distance. Would be harder in the UK.

"Derbyshire Police said in a statement: "Driving to a location - where exercise could easily have been taken closer to a person's home - is clearly not in the spirit of the national effort to reduce our travel, reduce the possible spread of the disease and reduce the number of deaths."

So this is the police's stance. It's a bit thin - they should have given them a warning instead.

Meredithgrey1 · 08/01/2021 14:07

I think you are only allowed out for exercising, essentials, work or medical care.
Leisure trips to coffee shops are not included

Essentials aren’t mentioned. You’re allowed to leave your house to obtain services from a business that is allowed to remain open. Like a coffee shop offering takeaway.
You could (probably quite reasonably) argue that coffee shops should be forced to close, but they haven’t been, and therefore as a business that is allowed to stay open, it is a reasonable reason to leave you house.

Grobagsforever · 08/01/2021 14:09

@RoseAndRose

Police have the discretion to decide what's reasonable in their local area.

There's no set distance, because that would obviously be unfair.

Stay local - if they'd been walking round the nearest park, rather than driving to a beauty spot where police are keeping numbers down, I'm ready to bet there would have been no issue

@RoseAndRose

You're incorrect. Police do not make the law.

benedicto · 08/01/2021 14:09

Why do I remember driving a short distance for exercise being allowed?

If that is allowed, but you can be fine if your definition of 'short' (me: under 10 miles) is different to the police (clearly less than 5 miles in this case, or less than 2 miles if the police are in Maidenhead), then there is an urgent need for a law to define the distance.

Otherwise you are being fine for committing a crime that not been defined.

ravenmum · 08/01/2021 14:09

Looking at the pictures, are sun studios still open in the UK? They are almost Trumpian.