I’m just angry now

[BathFullOfEels]

They knew a vaccine would be the only way of getting us out of this mess. The country has already been locked down twice. Why, why, why didn’t they use this time to set up the logistics of distributing and administering these vaccines?

Why, why, why are the government allowed to decide who to prioritise to receive these vaccines when they were always going to distribute in a way that benefits them. Surely any government with an ounce of realism would be self aware enough to realise that they would make this vaccine distribution a political decision and instead allow the decision to be made by an independent third party who can distribute it in a way that would allow the country to get back to work. Instead it’s likely that months and months down the line we’ll all be forced to go back to work despite still be unprotected.

I have visions of pensioners being able to swan off on holiday over the summer while the workers of the country will still be unable to.

It’s an absolute fucking farce. Watching that press conference last night just finally made it snap for me - they genuinely don’t know what they’re doing at all

Of course they need to vaccinate those at risk of serious illness or death first for goodness sake, why would you vaccinate those unlikely to even need hospitalisation first? Whilst the vulnerable and elderly lay dying and everyone else is denied treatment for other illnesses. That’s ludicrous.

As for the logistics, it does seem odd if they are working it now, but I think a lot of that is media scaremongering, just because the info isn’t released doesn’t mean it was not earlier worked.

From the start it has been all about protecting the NHS system.

Nothing else comes close for them.
They will not want it going around the world that the beacon of the NHS system, cannot cope.

The government wants to be "world beating".

This thread, and others, show you can't argue with stupid.
There have been countless clear explanations of the rationale behind the covid vaccination policy and still there are those who "don't understand".

Exactly - the government could never be able to win. One government trying to please an entire nation.

It might have helped if the Government had been seen to be trying to please the nation, instead of enriching their cronies.

I despair reading this OP and many of the views on this thread. If you can't see the point of vaccinating the most susceptible to the virus at this stage there's no hope for you. I'm glad it is medically experienced professionals prioritising and not a bunch of whiners.

@longtimemarried

I am one of the "old folk" and would happily give up my vaccination to someone much younger and who helps keep the economy going.

Good grief, you sound very selfish . Thank goodness you are not the one to make such decisions.

Surely the priority should have been vaccinating front line NHS workers, care home staff and residents and teachers. Then people at high risk, then the over 70s, then everyone else

This is just silly, they may be at a higher risk of getting it, they are not at a higher risk of dying from it or needing hospitalisation unless they fall into specific vulnerable groups.

And hour relatives are not representative of the group. The overwhelming majority are getting their jabs.

@SillyOldMummy

In fairness, OP has a point. My MIL is age 70+ but in good health ( her and PIL could be still working if they needed to, but benefitting from defined benefit pensions they retired in early 60's). Anyway she happily announced as soon as she gets the vaccine she will be off to Spain for a month's vacation.

I just stared and said nothing.

It just seems selfish. I know pensioners have as much right as anyone to live a normal life, but when so many families are suffering so much, and when my PIL have absolutely NO clinical need to have a vaccine (as they can easily stay at home and enjoy their lovely detached house and garden and have everything they need delivered to them) it is harsh that by March they will be planning a catch-up year of holidays, while I'll still be homeschooling and unable to get back to work.

happily announced

again I'm 36 and as soon as I get the vaccine I'm hoping to fly to Spain and see my family or the Maldives ...

BathFullOfEels you might not want to murder pensioners, but you let your bigotry show.

Sorry, wrong quote. I was responding to the topic starter

@SillyOldMummy

My MIL is age 70+ but in good health ....Anyway she happily announced as soon as she gets the vaccine she will be off to Spain for a month's vacation

Why shouldn't she? Would you think differently if she was your DM?

anyone wishing they could have the vaccine today so that they can have their old life back they should read this other thread where it's explained why those that you'd refuse the vaccine to have it to protect yourself as well
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/4126088-Why-vaccinations-will-eliminate-deaths-quite-quickly

This thread has changed my mind. Interesting and the arguments for vaccinating old people make sense - I just hadn't really thought it through to that extent. It is easy to say "The old are going to die soon anyway" - and there is logic to that argument. (If Granny is going to fall or get a stroke or pneumonia anyway in the next six months why bother vaccinating?)

BUT I also know the reality of caring for an elderly parent. When my mother fell and was in pain and frightened - would I have left her there to suffer? Of course not.

The reality is we DO take sick people into hospital and we DO treat them - because each INDIVIDUAL in pain or struggling for breath deserves that and needs help.

I do take issue with the government's cronyism - jobs for the boys - and the complete inefficiency of rolling out the vaccine. Could be done so much more quickly.

I despair reading this thread. The view of some posters of the value of older people, and the lack of realisation that they are people with feelings and emotions just the same as everyone else is depressing.
So many people now only seem to care about what affects them directly, not about wider society.

I agree with you OP the Covid response has been unfairly skewed towards the very old. We could have cut hospital admissions and saved the NHS if Boris had told the elderly, where possible, that they should shield back in Oct/Nov. Instead he wanted blanket rules for us all so many older people have been bubbling away and having numerous unnecessary contacts.

I also do think the over dramatisation of children’s needs is ridiculous. A child will not be damaged forever from 18 months or so of a stop/start life, generally with enough to eat in a warm house.

A lot of damage is being caused by parents transmitting their own anxieties to their children.

Even in lockdown, children in the U.K. have it much better than 90% of the world in normal times.

In a few years most children and young adults will look back on Covid as a blip in their lives.

we are sacrificing our children's entire futures
Fuck off man. Entire futures? Give yourself a shake! The hyperbole is outstanding!

This thread is a good indication of why MN is a far better social media model than Twitter.

There's a space and willingness to take the time to engage and explain relatively complex issues.

And, to be fair, a willingness to engage and listen.

That space and good will is less obvious on, say, Twitter.

More and more I think populism and social media like Twitter go hand in hand.

Not RTFT but ultimately it's an economic argument. The elderly are most likely to need hospitalisation, so they're taking up the most resources if they get ill, so vaccinate them first.

Personally I would vaccinate healthcare, care workers and then education and prison staff and then start with younger CEV who need to work and THEN start with the over 90s etc. Quite honestly I can't really see the point of vaccinating my 92 year old housebound MIL ahead of my 69 year old SIL who helps care for her.

But I can see the logic in the government's priority list as well.

(plus, the elderly are more likely to vote Tory)

I suppose so but this discussion is not "hatred" in itself. There's valid points. It's an extreme descriptor that is used far to often to explain and shame people for perfectly legitimate discussion around issues some people don't want you talking about. And the claim was made early in the thread when not much had been said at all. It's not just here or about old people. It's everywhere and it ultimately becomes meaningless because people will still discuss but just stop caring about being "hateful".

Vaccinating the elderly and vulnerable will stop most of the requirements for hospitalisation, which is why we've been having the lockdowns.

At that point, restrictions will be lifted, long before younger people with no underlying health conditions have had the vaccine.

A lot of the worried well are going to need to get their heads around that in the next few months.

So many people now only seem to care about what affects them directly, not about wider society

In a nutshell

@Thingybob

Instead he wanted blanket rules for us all so many older people have been bubbling away and having numerous unnecessary contacts

In many cases these 'unnecessary contacts' were instigated by their own 'children' so that they could provide free childcare

many older people have been bubbling away and having numerous unnecessary contacts

Not just older people, though, is it?

@MagicSummer

In my area a lot of the elderly have certainly not been "locked away at home for 10 months with the odd outing".

I see so many over 70s in the queues for the likes of B&M's, Wilko's, Home Bargains etc. and on buses it's ridiculous. I appreciate there will be some who have no one to help with their shopping but in my area there is support in place if required.

If the over 70s actually stayed in other than going for a walk if they're able and avoided the supermarkets the hospital admissions wouldn't be so bad.